e-bike hatred.. I've found it

DaveMatthews said:
Seems like a completely narrow minded view of what an ebike is.
I get nothing if I don't pedal, so his statement is immediately 100% false.
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Yup...! There's much in that blog post I don't agree with (As Dewey said would happen :) )... and knowing nothing about the author, I'm speculating that his blog is from his own perspective of course, as a purely analog cyclist... presumably reasonably in shape, with a long love of his biking, and as a maker of "his preferred kind" of bikes, why would he be predisposed to say, seeing a pedal-assist motor as yet another mechanical advantage to add to the mix of bike hardware that already gives mechanical advantages.

For myself, I believe a throttle feature subtly changes an ebike, as it gives the potential to operate at any time like a traditional "moped" (or use the label of your choice, to indicate a motorized and 100%-motor-propelled transport.) While the use of that throttle remains the rider's choice usually, the throttled ebike nonetheless has that capacity built-in. Perhaps the author only rode (or is only familiar with) the throttled ebikes, and not the pedal-assist (throttleless) variants, triggering his comment about no connection between effort and movement...

I also don't fully agree with his position that ebikes won't get cars off the road. While there are some hardy ebike riders who use an ebike to completely eliminate their need for a car -- I believe there are many more riders who use their ebike to take their car out of play, frequently... so on any given day, ebikes "eliminate" cars from the roads, for some portion of that day, from some portion of what would have been car-only traffic. (Just as analog bikes do too.) But the pedal-assist ebike grants the option of "less use of a car" to far more people than analog bikes do, from a physical capabilities perspective. (Certainly not yet from a financial perspective.) In my own case, I've eliminated 82 of my would-be car commutes to work this year. Even if that is nowhere near a milestone of total car-less living, it is 82 days with my car removed from morning and evening rush hour traffic, which carries with it some measure of "greening"... and to his point that "plain bikes are greener, but didn't eliminate cars" -- I'm in that pool of people who personally would have never bothered even trying an office commute on an analog bike... too out of shape at the start; the analog biking was too painful and hard -- and I never once in 30 years of career, even entertained the idea. Along comes my ebike, and within 4 weeks of getting it, I can hardly stop commuting on it...

Anyway -- my reply is undoubtedly preaching to the converts here already -- sorry about that!
 
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" you can still pedal, but you don't have to"

BAN THE FREEWHEEL ! Imagine a bicycle that can coast along without the pedals spinning! It's just not a bicycle.

In fact, bring back the Laufmaschine - none of these new fangled modern contraptions with mechanical advantage.

Signed Fred flintstone
 
It seems Roadies admire Grant despite they think he is eccentric like these comments: "arguing that anyone other than a racer (and probably even racers that are doing anything other than racing) that is riding on anything other than a 35 pound steel bike with two top-tubes and 35mm tires is an idiot that is going to be sorry one day when their expensive non-steel non-touring bike randomly explodes in the middle of the road, causing a crash that breaks 7 bones in their body and sends shards of carbon fiber shrapnel flying through the air into the eyes of old ladies, small children, and cute kittens", and "He seems determined to take the cycling out of cycling. He hates helmets, cleats, bike shorts, quick handling, speed and light weight", and "Philosophically, I am bothered by GPs...round rejection of classic road geometry as dangerous and twitchy....a classic road race bike with a carbon fork isn't going to crash on a descent or have the forkshear off - those are two concepts that have been tested for longer than Riv has existed". Makes me want to read his book of essays to see what he considers to be practical cycling, adding him and Eben Weiss to my crusty Freds reading list, though Eben’s opinion at least appears to be changing as he gets older.
 
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Locals Only...
I find a thread of connection between Analog Bikers (I like that term) and Surfers.
Surfing is held out as a fabulous avocation - one for which you should buy all sorts of clothing and gear and head out to the beach for fun and excitement. Surfers on the other hand will pummel you if you dare encroach on "Their Beach". They want more surfers..not more people surfing.

Here's another one: In the 90's there was a thriving European Scooter Scene here in Colorado. I had many. Vespa, Lambretta, Moto-Rumi, Heinkel, Zundap, Bella, you name it. Everybody had fun...it was a tight knit group. Cushman Scooter owners need not apply. Well then Vespa re-entered the American Market with new scooters. Now what? They were European..but not the "Right Kind". People who bought new Vespa's hadn't "Earned" the right to be scooterists. We dragged ours out of the weeds and restored them. "Those People" just threw money at a dealer and rode off. Ditto - and worse - the Chinese Scooters that flooded in. We want more people on scooters as long as they were the same scooters we rode. We want more people on bikes as long as they're the same bikes we ride.

So I don't know - I doubt there will ever be smiling acceptance of non Analog Bikes by their riders. I see them on the paths...coming at me very fast...faster I suspect than the path limit...grimacing. I smile and nod just to piss them off as I ride my Cruiser. I'm pretty much always pedaling unless starting from a stop or I need to get out of or into a situation. I doubt they even know I'm electric as they blow past. I think a lot of them grind their teeth just because I'm wearing a Polo shirt and jeans..not a Spandex Outfit festooned with logos.
 
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Where I am E-bikes are still very rare, there are maybe less then a dozen in town. So the only thing I get is questions on how it works and where did i get this wonderful thing. It is a fat bike so it draws attention where ever I go, so I am not flying under anyone's radar. Mostly I get stares and an occasional thumbs up from the spandex crowd. One spandex clad rider gave me a dirty look but that was because a blew past him going up a steep hill going about twenty mph. High peddle assist and a 750 watt motor, got to love it!
 
Dewey said:
Grant Petersen, owner of Rivendell Bicycle Works, does not think ebikes should be classified as bicycles. He designs beautiful handbuilt lugged steel transport bicycles, my personal favorite of their frames is the Cheviot, but in a recent blog post he writes "Expressing a disopinion about eBikes inevitably gets misconstrued as being against older and physically challenged people's mobility and independence and right to the same fun others have. That's not our evil plan. We have no evil plan! It's not whether they're good or bad...It's whether they're a bicycle...of all the levers and wheels in it, the ones that MAKE it a bicycle are the ones that motors replace. You can still pedal, but you don't have to. There's no direct-connection between effort and movement, because the motor takes over. Motors take over these fantastic cooperative movements. They don't "enhance" them or "supplement" them any more than somebody dipping a spoon into your bowl of ice cream is "helping" you eat it...The deal here is that they have a motor so they're not bicycles, they’re motor-cycles, or at least mo-peds. Calling them bicycles gives them most or all of the privileges of a bicycle."

Grant argues he is not debating the merits of the value of motor pedal assist for climbing hills but rather he thinks the dividing line between human and motor powered cycling is one that in his opinion ought to maintain real world legal and practical prohibitions on where to ride an ebike. Contributors to the EBR forums will disagree with Grant's argument against giving us ebike riders "most or all of the privileges of a bicycle".
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I find it interesting that Mr. Petersen is afraid his opinion on ebikes will be misconstrued as being against older and physically challenged riders. Well here's a flash for you Mr. Petersen, your comments ARE against these people! In so many words you are saying that older and physically challenged people have no business riding "bicycles" in places others can. Is your manhood so threatened that you are afraid to be seen riding roads & trails with us older folk? You know full well that calling an ebike something other than a bicycle makes it an easier target for lawmakers! I wonder what your opinion will be when you are in your 70's and 80's!
 
Arlington County Virginia is opening a new bike path alongside Washington Blvd which is a busy north south arterial road running down the west side of Ft Myer/Arlington cemetery. The path opens on Friday but the County's Department of Environmental Services (DES) twitter account got into what started as a snarky exchange with William Shatner(!) about the County's ebike trail prohibition that ended with the Arlington DES Disqus account disinviting ebike riders from attending the ribbon cutting. This from a County that promotes a "car free diet" program for residents, and funds ebikeshare through the Capital Bikeshare Plus program.
https://disqus.com/home/discussion/arlnow/morning_notes_3728/#comment-4217593093
and
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1067896512095633408
 
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Dewey said:
Arlington County Virginia is opening a new bike path alongside Washington Blvd which is a busy north south arterial road running down the west side of Ft Myer/Arlington cemetery. The path opens on Friday but the County's Department of Environmental Services (DES) twitter account got into what started as a snarky exchange with William Shatner(!) about the County's ebike trail prohibition that ended with the Arlington DES Disqus account disinviting ebike riders from attending the ribbon cutting. This from a County that promotes a "car free diet" program for residents, and funds ebikeshare through the Capital Bikeshare Plus program.
https://disqus.com/home/discussion/arlnow/morning_notes_3728/#comment-4217593093
and
https://twitter.com/i/web/status/1067896512095633408
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That just makes me want to go ride on it.
Nicely, safely, and properly.
 
DaveMatthews said:
That just makes me want to go ride on it.
Nicely, safely, and properly.
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If you go dig down in the comments apparently the e-bike ban is in violation of Virginia State Law and the County Police are already on record saying they cannot and will not enforce an e-bike ban on that trail.
 
Mr. Coffee said:
If you go dig down in the comments apparently the e-bike ban is in violation of Virginia State Law and the County Police are already on record saying they cannot and will not enforce an e-bike ban on that trail.
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Yeah, I saw that. I'm sincerely hoping that cooler heads prevail and that the poorly thought out blanket statement is voided for those of us that would use it well and properly.
 
One really constructive idea would be for someone to make up 3x5 cards (or rather PDF files you could print onto 3x5 cards with a photo printer) that had the relevant e-bike regulations for each state and certain municipalities. That way if you get into a conversation with a police officer about your right to be on an e-bike you could respectfully give them the relevant sections of state law that specifies your rights and responsibilities as an operator of an e-bike.
 
Mr. Coffee said:
One really constructive idea would be for someone to make up 3x5 cards (or rather PDF files you could print onto 3x5 cards with a photo printer) that had the relevant e-bike regulations for each state and certain municipalities. That way if you get into a conversation with a police officer about your right to be on an e-bike you could respectfully give them the relevant sections of state law that specifies your rights and responsibilities as an operator of an e-bike.
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Would be a great thing to hand out to your average person as well. Those people that would argue... :)
 
I think Captain Kirk should show up with his e-bike anyway and bring his phaser.
 
This is where celebrity status has some value in getting the attention of the "powers that be" and the general public. The same comment from someone like me without name recognition would probably go unnoticed.
 
john peck said:
[QUOTE Contributors to the EBR forums will disagree with Grant's argument against giving us ebike riders "most or all of the privileges of a bicycle".
Click to expand...

Grant Petersen is just trying to protect the market for his grossly overpriced snobcycles. There will always be 2 wheel jackasses riding like idiots &
making things tough for responsible riders. The best way to fight it is to ride courteous.
 
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