Brakes

[fishwagon]

Thank you guys for all the input.

 

[PedalUma]

One alternative is to measure hose lengths and buy quality pre-blead brakes that are ready to go.
" It can adapt to a variety of riding sections, including urban roads, off-road mountain roads, jungle trails, beaches, and snow."
Would anyone want this on a mountain trail?

 

[John from Connecticut]

Good point about it being a new bike. Take it back to the dealer. It should be under warranty. Long-term, bleeding brakes is a routine job. Depending on your comfort level with simple mechanics, it is the kind of job that many people would do themselves.

TT

Agree, Bleeding the brakes etc is a routine job. My concern as I've mentioned prior. This a 'new' bike. New brake system shouldn't have a catastrophic failure...period.
If fishwagon can find a local bike shop that's willing to work on the bike ( which may be difficult from a liability standpoint ) I would want to know
specifically what caused the Hydraulic system to fail so soon. The odds are the no name provided brake system components were a major contributor.

'Fishwagon' ...Did your brakes slowly start to fail over minutes, hours etc or did they just fail ? That's important to know.

I see this as a potential life and death situation. If the shop says.... " We can bleed the system and then be on your way. We have no idea why your brakes
failed or if they will again " . My hope would be the shop would find a specific problem...but then where do they get parts ? and so it goes.

The no name battery 'scares' me as well from a fire /explosion stand point . If you check out the web you'll little assurance

Shengmilo MX02S (Black)

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John

 

[rob feature]

It's unlikely that any decent shop will work on this thing. It's a BSO (bicycle shaped object) - most likely made of the cheapest possible materials and super shady battery along with substandard assembly & setup. Can you get your money back?

 

[TrevorB]

I would suggest entry level Tektro brakes with motor cutout switches in brake lever. Shop should be able to source them

 

[m@Robertson]

It does sound as if a simple brake bleed and fluid top-up would be in order. But are these brakes using DOT fluid or mineral oil (a DIY job needs to know in advance)? The sudden loss of pressure across BOTH levers sounds like a dual failure of poor quality parts. Which is ordinarily highly unlikely since they are independent systems, but at this bicycle's price point, maybe not so much. Did the brakes fail or did they just both degrade severely at an equal level? It could be that, and I would not be the least bit surprised if some assembly line worker did a poor job of tightening the hose fittings to the calipers (plural) and the fluid leaked out. Did the leaky fluid instead come from a leaky piston inside the caliper? If so its extremely likely you can bleed all you want, and still have a problem due to contaminated pads that need replacing. No matter what the source of that leak has to be found and addressed.

This could definitely be a simple, routine bleed coupled to a torque check on the hose ends. Or it could be a lot worse. Depending on @fishwagon 's level of mechanical aptitude the first steps in correction could be very simple. But if he's not mechanically inclined, its definitely a shop job.

 

[Gionnirocket]

It does sound as if a simple brake bleed and fluid top-up would be in order. But are these brakes using DOT fluid or mineral oil (a DIY job needs to know in advance)? The sudden loss of pressure across BOTH levers sounds like a dual failure of poor quality parts. Which is ordinarily highly unlikely since they are independent systems, but at this bicycle's price point, maybe not so much. Did the brakes fail or did they just both degrade severely at an equal level? It could be that, and I would not be the least bit surprised if some assembly line worker did a poor job of tightening the hose fittings to the calipers (plural) and the fluid leaked out. Did the leaky fluid instead come from a leaky piston inside the caliper? If so its extremely likely you can bleed all you want, and still have a problem due to contaminated pads that need replacing. No matter what the source of that leak has to be found and addressed.

This could definitely be a simple, routine bleed coupled to a torque check on the hose ends. Or it could be a lot worse. Depending on @fishwagon 's level of mechanical aptitude the first steps in correction could be very simple. But if he's not mechanically inclined, its definitely a shop job.

If he's asked the question as he has... it's probably beyond his mechanics skill level at this point.
That said... None of this is rocket science and easily learned if you know what to do with tools.
I realize Hydraulic brakes make a great selling point but these low end bikes should have cable pull for reliability and ease of repair.

 

[m@Robertson]

That said... None of this is rocket science and easily learned if you know what to do with tools.

Thats what I was going for. A definite maybe to be sure.

I realize Hydraulic brakes make a great selling point but these low end bikes should have cable pull for reliability and ease of repair.

I dunno... the low end heavy ebikes with the stretchy cables and need to re-adjust every couple of weeks are their own sort of dangerous problem. Thanks to the Rad Runner lawsuit I think we are going to see a raft of cheap ebikes with cheap hydros coming from the factory ... which means this is probably a whole new class of common failure coming down the bike path to forums like this.

 

[Gionnirocket]

Thats what I was going for. A definite maybe to be sure.

I dunno... the low end heavy ebikes with the stretchy cables and need to re-adjust every couple of weeks are their own sort of dangerous problem. Thanks to the Rad Runner lawsuit I think we are going to see a raft of cheap ebikes with cheap hydros coming from the factory ... which means this is probably a whole new class of common failure coming down the bike path to forums like this.

You should have some skills to own one of these and at least the cable pull don't require any special tools and only a bit of common sense.
Even cheap cables will be done stretching within 3 - 4 months and from then are pretty easy.
I just don't think the average Joe can handle the specifics of Hydraulics and failure can be guaranteed if not done properly.

 

[TrevorB]

Issue isn't hydraulic brakes but the poor quality ones on this bike. Entry level Shimano, Tektro, Magura abd SRAM brakes can operate reliably for years without being serviced, even through it's not recommended.

 

[PedalUma]

I think that you are both right. It is so easy to replace the $1.25 cables on a Big Box bike with $8 or $12 ones. The cheap ones stretch, corrode with white powder and are rough. I just delivered a bike and walked a couple of miles of trail back and was thinking about this thread. Here is what I came up with:

Did you ever invest in cheap razors? How did that work out? Like a cheap bike it is a waste of good money.

 

[Gionnirocket]

I think that you are both right. It is so easy to replace the $1.25 cables on a Big Box bike with $8 or $12 ones. The cheap ones stretch, corrode with white powder and are rough. I just delivered a bike and walked a couple of miles of trail back and was thinking about this thread. Here is what I came up with:

Did you ever invest in cheap-ass razors? How did that work out? Like a cheap-ass bike it is a waste of good money.
View attachment 153310

Exactly... It's better to have this $10 razor that works and you can easily buy blades for

Then this $15 razor that is electric and sounds as if it's better until you put it on your face or it lasts a month before crapping out


And sure a name brand Hydraulic brake would be great... But on a $1400 bike I don’t think so as it hasn't happened yet.

 

[PedalUma]

I don’t think so as it hasn't happened yet

The thing IMO is STOPPING is one of those things that is necessary. 1) Avid mechanical MTB are $100 for the pair of calipers, $12 for the lever set and decent housings and cables another $40. A $152 investment to be able to reliably stop. The alternatives are 2) to not use the bike at all, or 3) death.

 

[Tars Tarkas]

I'd like to hear back from @fishwagon to hear what's going on.

TT

 

[John from Connecticut]

The thing IMO is STOPPING is one of those things that is necessary. 1) Avid mechanical MTB are $100 for the pair of calipers, $12 for the lever set and decent housings and cables another $40. A $152 investment to be able to reliably stop. The alternatives are 2) to not use the bike at all, or 3) death.

I've asked the poster several times how the brakes failed... Slowly, getting worse and worse or catastrophley with no warning, but haven't seen a reply.
If the brakes failed with no warning I would never ever ride the bike again. Even if they failed slowly over a short ride... Remember the bike is 'brand new" .
We're talking about the poster / rider potentially being killed. This is not a science project nor amateur night..."Try this and see if it works." Say it with me "Death "

Oh yes, The no name, no battery management system charger. Not in my home or garage !

 

[Gionnirocket]

I've asked the poster several times how the brakes failed... Slowly, getting worse and worse or catastrophley with no warning, but haven't seen a reply.
If the brakes failed with no warning I would never ever ride the bike again. Even if they failed slowly over a short ride... Remember the bike is 'brand new" .
We're talking about the poster / rider potentially being killed. This is not a science project nor amateur night..."Try this and see if it works." Say it with me "Death "

Oh yes, The no name, no battery management system charger. Not in my home or garage !

He may be dead already.

 

[John from Connecticut]

He may be dead already.

I really hope 'fishwagon' is ok ?? If you're out there please check in..

John

 

[kevinmccune]

Issue isn't hydraulic brakes but the poor quality ones on this bike. Entry level Shimano, Tektro, Magura abd SRAM brakes can operate reliably for years without being serviced, even through it's not recommended.

I would recommend the entry level Shimano Hydraulic brakes, just got a set ,only problem is no motor cutouts and the price is reasonable.

 

[PedalUma]

fishwagon' is ok

I might have been too harsh. I apologize.

 

[Rexlion]

I've asked the poster several times how the brakes failed... Slowly, getting worse and worse or catastrophley with no warning, but haven't seen a reply.
If the brakes failed with no warning I would never ever ride the bike again. Even if they failed slowly over a short ride... Remember the bike is 'brand new" .
We're talking about the poster / rider potentially being killed. This is not a science project nor amateur night..."Try this and see if it works." Say it with me "Death "

Oh yes, The no name, no battery management system charger. Not in my home or garage !

The OP said, in post #10:

I got the bike new about 4 months ago. I just put 300 miles on it. Yesterday the brakes were fine, today they weren't. I was going down the steepest hill in town, which is steep, I pumped on them and there was nothing.