Bosch Battery Keys in the USA!
- Thread starter NoDTMF
- Start date
Shea N Encinitas
Active Member
Funny mine is like an inverse key, straight on the edges with a path milled in the middle, this key would not work. Came with a spare BTW. -S
NoDTMF
Active Member
The markings are: Ilco X179 SUZ12
Apparently it is for Suzuki Motorcycle.
http://mysecuritypro.com/SuzukiSUZ12MotorcycleKeyBlanks.aspx
My E-system is Bosch Gen 2 active line with 400wh battery.
EddieJ
Well-Known Member
Until now, I have never looked at the keys of my two Bosch bikes.
Oddly one set of keys is made by Abus, and one set by Axa.
What I will say about Bosch locks, is that they are a pain in backside. I could pretty much name countless people who have had issues with Bosch locks. Every time that you go to use the lock, you first wonder how much hassle will it be this time to get the key in and turn it, and how much hassle is going to be to get the key back out again. Bosch go to great lengths to place a rubber cap over the USB slot on the console, a rubber cover over the battery charging point, and yet the battery, lock is left exposed. Yet another example of poor Bosch design.
Oddly one set of keys is made by Abus, and one set by Axa.
What I will say about Bosch locks, is that they are a pain in backside. I could pretty much name countless people who have had issues with Bosch locks. Every time that you go to use the lock, you first wonder how much hassle will it be this time to get the key in and turn it, and how much hassle is going to be to get the key back out again. Bosch go to great lengths to place a rubber cap over the USB slot on the console, a rubber cover over the battery charging point, and yet the battery, lock is left exposed. Yet another example of poor Bosch design.
stevenast
Well-Known Member
Reading these Bosch forum threads, if I read something slamming Bosch, it is surprising how often your name is found at the top. Sorry that you have had such bad experiences compared to so many others having excellent results!
NoDTMF
Active Member
Interesting comment "stevenast!"
I have been reading the various forums, including UK ones, and EdieJ really seems to hate these motors. This has caused me concern about buying a a bosch motor.
I live in the Santa Cruz mtns in California.
I rode Limerick trail to Priest Rock trail to Kennedy trail and stopped at a lookout at 2500 ft for those who know the area. I just found out it is referred to as Dog Meat as very few people can make it up due to how steep it is and how dusty. Total altitude climbed was just shy of 2000 feet in 47 minutes and about 3.6 miles. I thought my heart was going to pop out of my chest a few times. I would have never gotten up there on a normal bike. I also came down very fast bouncing around all over.
The motor worked great, no chain rap, no chain slap, etc I have the active line, I assume the performance line would be awesome. I now have about 500 miles on the bike, KTM Macina Action Plus 27.5 Its a hard tail because I use it for commuting and wanted a rack, adding a ThrudBuster seem to really help.
Well I hope it lasts, I find it works well. Also I see people slamming the sample rate saying its over kill. When you ride this steep hills it seems to be helping very dynamically. I certainly rather error on the high side vs low side of sampling. (I am a computer scientist since the 80's, I will not get into an argument about sample rates)
Oh yeah, so total loop was 7 miles and I had 1/2 a battery charge left. I used Turbo mode quite often. However under range it said I had about 4 miles left on Sport mode. Seem like you always want to ride up, and when the battery gets really low..turn around.
Anyway now I am not so concerned!
I have been reading the various forums, including UK ones, and EdieJ really seems to hate these motors. This has caused me concern about buying a a bosch motor.
I live in the Santa Cruz mtns in California.
I rode Limerick trail to Priest Rock trail to Kennedy trail and stopped at a lookout at 2500 ft for those who know the area. I just found out it is referred to as Dog Meat as very few people can make it up due to how steep it is and how dusty. Total altitude climbed was just shy of 2000 feet in 47 minutes and about 3.6 miles. I thought my heart was going to pop out of my chest a few times. I would have never gotten up there on a normal bike. I also came down very fast bouncing around all over.
The motor worked great, no chain rap, no chain slap, etc I have the active line, I assume the performance line would be awesome. I now have about 500 miles on the bike, KTM Macina Action Plus 27.5 Its a hard tail because I use it for commuting and wanted a rack, adding a ThrudBuster seem to really help.
Well I hope it lasts, I find it works well. Also I see people slamming the sample rate saying its over kill. When you ride this steep hills it seems to be helping very dynamically. I certainly rather error on the high side vs low side of sampling. (I am a computer scientist since the 80's, I will not get into an argument about sample rates)
Oh yeah, so total loop was 7 miles and I had 1/2 a battery charge left. I used Turbo mode quite often. However under range it said I had about 4 miles left on Sport mode. Seem like you always want to ride up, and when the battery gets really low..turn around.
Anyway now I am not so concerned!
Last edited:
EddieJ
Well-Known Member
Steven I'm not slamming Bosch at all. I'm merely pointing out issues that myself and others have had with the system, along with design failures. This is in the hope that Bosch might decide to take some of what is being said by myself and many users from the German pedelec forum on board.
It's up to the user or potential user to decide about whether they want to take on board or ignore my comments. I'm actually pretty indifferent to the system, and can certainly see from an engineering point of view, where significant changes could and should be made.
I could make quite a list of issues if pushed, but just taking the classic line motor as an example, like many other European users, I was quick to point out the issue of a dry outer bearing. This issue was seemingly dismissed, but now look, owners are being offered free replacement motors. Chain jumping on the Classic line motor was another point that I along with other European users raised. From my understanding, that issue was in part what lead to Bosch opting for a small front sprocket. By doing so, they have swapped chain jumping for both chain suck, which an across bike manufacturer issue, and to a system that places an undue wear rate on the drive train system as a whole, and in my case outer bearing failure which I am told is potentially linked to the chain suck issue. Internal motor gearing is also proving to be an issue for some European e-mtb users, many of whom are swapping out rear cassettes to try to compensate. I could go on and on, and even touch on Nyon, but clearly there is no point. I'll leave the Bosch forum alone from now on.
Not from this thread but another, and not aimed at you Steven, what also needs to be remembered is that Bosch are very pro active with marketing their product for e-mtb use, including very muddy wet conditions. You don't have to look very far to see this, Youtube, Face Book and even a forth coming e-mtb race event. If the product is marketed and actively encouraged in this way, then it is asking much for the product to meet the standards for intended use. I'll leave this thread there.
It's up to the user or potential user to decide about whether they want to take on board or ignore my comments. I'm actually pretty indifferent to the system, and can certainly see from an engineering point of view, where significant changes could and should be made.
I could make quite a list of issues if pushed, but just taking the classic line motor as an example, like many other European users, I was quick to point out the issue of a dry outer bearing. This issue was seemingly dismissed, but now look, owners are being offered free replacement motors. Chain jumping on the Classic line motor was another point that I along with other European users raised. From my understanding, that issue was in part what lead to Bosch opting for a small front sprocket. By doing so, they have swapped chain jumping for both chain suck, which an across bike manufacturer issue, and to a system that places an undue wear rate on the drive train system as a whole, and in my case outer bearing failure which I am told is potentially linked to the chain suck issue. Internal motor gearing is also proving to be an issue for some European e-mtb users, many of whom are swapping out rear cassettes to try to compensate. I could go on and on, and even touch on Nyon, but clearly there is no point. I'll leave the Bosch forum alone from now on.
Not from this thread but another, and not aimed at you Steven, what also needs to be remembered is that Bosch are very pro active with marketing their product for e-mtb use, including very muddy wet conditions. You don't have to look very far to see this, Youtube, Face Book and even a forth coming e-mtb race event. If the product is marketed and actively encouraged in this way, then it is asking much for the product to meet the standards for intended use. I'll leave this thread there.
stevenast
Well-Known Member
Please don't leave the Bosch forum. Everyone's experiences are valuable. We need to hear the good and bad.
That said, so many ebike brands are plagued with motor/electric system problems in light use. Meanwhile, Bosch has earned a reputation for reliability in normal use.
Someone described the Bosch system as a Porsche. I am not going to be slinging my "Porsche" through the mud. Just because you saw it advertised that way, does not make that behavior smart. I saw a car ad where they drove off a cliff ... do not attempt, lol!
Stick around, and I hope you will call me out too, if I say something absurd: "I jammed the Bosch system with mud and then it had problems". Absurd.
Bosch makes a solid product, and while not perfect, it offers value and reliability, by consensus, when all accounts are heard.
J.R.
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Piedmont Highlands
I may not be remembering correctly but I didn't think @stevenast you were at all interested in this type of bike. If I'm wrong, I apologize, but I thought you didn't yet own an ebike and were shopping for a stealth ebike to ride on improved and paved bike trails undetected because it is not yet legal where you live. I personally would rather read someone's real world experience than someone's analytical opinion of an opinion. The Bosch system isn't being marketed as a Porsche, it's being marketed as a Humvee. You don't buy a sports car to go off road, you do buy a KTM to go off road because they are "off road bikes". I've read @EddieJ posts, both here and on the Pedelecs forum and don't want to see those extreme use posts end here. I don't see it as slamming, I see it as a critique. Better to critique a product than a person, we get far too much of that on the internet.
stevenast
Well-Known Member
You are correct about one of the factors I was looking at, everything else about me you are wrong. One thing we certainly agree on: all opinions need to be heard. It's you that suggests that the debate should not be about personalities and I agree with you 100%!
When EddieJ makes repeated comments like " yet another example of poor Bosch design" that goes beyond sharing his experiences, sounds more like a campaign. Once again I will say, I'm sorry he's had problems after abusing his bike, but that doesn't make it a poor product.
As for the Humvee analogy, let me try to illustrate my point again with another analogy: if I use a certain deodorant beautiful women will flock to me. I think you see the point, common sense has to apply when you look at marketing media.
Coating an electric bike drive system with mud and then being surprised when it has problems is ridiculous.
No one is slamming a person here - what Eddie has to say is marketing in its own way, negative marketing, a campaign against Bosch, that's all I'm speaking out against.
I'll ride with either of you anytime!
Last edited:
J.R.
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Piedmont Highlands
Steven, you read far too much into my post, it wasn't about you, it was about high end mountain bikes, of which @EddieJ has years experience with and you do not. I'm not wrong in the two issues I attribute to you. You have stated numerous times you do not yet own an ebike and you also stated that you want a stealthy ebike to remain elusive on bike trails/paths because as you've stated you can't ride on bike trails and paths with assist. I enjoy watching the process of those searching for their first ebike and have enjoyed watching your process and reading your posts. You've contributed significantly in your short time here, but I've been reading @EddieJ posts on two sites for almost a year and wished you had characterized his contributions in the proper context.You are correct about one of the factors I was looking at, everything else about me you are wrong. One thing we certainly agree on: all opinions need to be heard. It's you that suggests that the debate should not be about personalities and I agree with you 100%!
When EddieJ makes repeated comments like " yet another example of poor Bosch design" that goes beyond sharing his experiences, sounds more like a campaign. Once again I will say, I'm sorry he's had problems after abusing his bike, but that doesn't make it a poor product.
As for the Humvee analogy, let me try to illustrate my point again with another analogy: if I use a certain deodorant beautiful women will flock to me. I think you see the point, common sense has to apply when you look at marketing media.
Coating an electric bike drive system with mud and then being surprised when it has problems is ridiculous.
No one is slamming a person here - what Eddie has to say is marketing in its own way, negative marketing, a campaign against Bosch, that's all I'm speaking out against.
I'll ride with either of you anytime!
stevenast
Well-Known Member
Point me to a positive Bosch post from @EddieJ. He apparently abused his bike, then, when it broke he went on a vendetta against Bosch.
I characterize his posts as a negative campaign vs Bosch. Everything I've seen indicates that is a fair evaluation.
A lot of folks read this forum for solid, real- life reviews to help them decide. A campaign of negatives doesn't help.
@Bambor I wish you would reconsider your last post. I highly respect what you have to say, and the @J.R. post you liked was not that solid. For one thing, he tried to minimize me as a "non-owner". More Importantly, he fails to recognize the facts I presented much earlier in this thread.
Look at the original post - it is about keys!! The snide remark(" yet another example of poor Bosch design") by @EddieJ was unnecessary and uncalled for.
I personally don't care if you have a " cool kids club" that stands together, for all it doesn't effect me. But, for the sake of others looking for guidance in making an expensive purchase, I will call out the ongoing, unwarranted negative campaign vs Bosch, and I hope you will see it for what it is.
I could be wrong, and if I am I will apologize, but I have tried to read all the Bosch forum posts, and all I see by Eddie is a negative campaign against Bosch that I view as unfair, based on how the bike was treated.
Brambor
Well-Known Member
@stevenast - I have no staunch allegiances but Eddie's posts have so much real world experience that it would be a shame to lose him. It is far more valuable than 'Bosh is great...I ride the paved path 2 miles and back' posts. Anyone in their right mind will understand from Eddie's posts that he rides his bikes hard although one might argue that if a bike is designed to be an off road bike then Eddie's usage should be the right measurement for such gear.
stevenast
Well-Known Member
Read the whole thread and you will see I agree about Eddie's value. We need all opinions.
However, also read my comments about marketing and using common sense.
Shea N Encinitas
Active Member
In case this image has faded in your memories, mud puppy R&D division:(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
J.R.
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Piedmont Highlands
Eddie is gone and it's a shame! Try to view his profile, gone. @stevenast You've read far too much into my post as I've stated. I didn't "minimize" anything you said, I put some context into the thread. No matter how hard we try, we can't read someone else's mind.
Many here would think it crazy what I've put my bicycles through over the years. I think it's crazy what road racers put themselves and their equipment through. You place a value judgment on someone when you call it abuse. We are many and varied, an attempt at understanding others experiences is required for a civil community on the internet.
Steven, I don't think you are the reason Eddie left, there's always more than meets the eye. I hope he comes back, I value his experiences. He'll likely come back after some time off, on to a new thread. I also value watching your experiences with your search for an ebike. I don't like internet wars and won't take part. Think twice, type once.
Similar threads
