Are all Bosch mid-drive systems Class 1 only and... is that good or bad?

Sorry to have been silent for so long, wasn't getting notifications until this morning. Thank you to all of you who have posted so much helpful information (most of you 😉 ). Since I posted, I have found out about Adaptive Biketown which fits and rents adaptive bikes and ebikes and happens to sit right at the head of one of my favorite rides from Portland to Oregon City. So, while she is recovering, we will make use of that. Thank you all for your help!
 
People curse me for advising to put your motor on Sport or Turbo when starting, especially if needing to cross traffic. Then why not just leave it in turbo?

Cursing me that I am ruining my motor by riding in Turbo 98% of the time. Curses from my LBS as well. But for those who try it, they understand. Speed (controlled) is my joy of riding. My Trek Techs give me thumbs up.

8,450 miles (13,600km) on the Performance Speed motor — I will strongly attest to its reliability. It is an outstanding motor with narry a hiccup. Pushed by 1,125 watts of stored electrons. And I ride it as hard as I can.
 
People curse me for advising to put your motor on Sport or Turbo when starting, especially if needing to cross traffic. Then why not just leave it in turbo?

Cursing me that I am ruining my motor by riding in Turbo 98% of the time. Curses from my LBS as well. But for those who try it, they understand. Speed (controlled) is my joy of riding. My Trek Techs give me thumbs up.

8,450 miles (13,600km) on the Performance Speed motor — I will strongly attest to its reliability. It is an outstanding motor with narry a hiccup. Pushed by 1,125 watts of stored electrons. And I ride it as hard as I can.
I dont like the feel in turbo one its just too easy I only use it when I am really sick. I can accelerate so fast that turbo would actually slow me down because you cant shift fast enough. I can get to 14mph in two peddle strokes on tour or sport.
 
I don’t know if you have Wisper bikes where you are, but they do a full throttle legal version in the UK.

May be worth investigating.

DG…
 
I don’t know if you have Wisper bikes where you are, but they do a full throttle legal version in the UK.

If you register it as a moped, wear a full-face helmet and do not ride bike paths then they are legal :) As any moped.
 

If you register it as a moped, wear a full-face helmet and do not ride bike paths then they are legal :) As any moped.
No, they have managed to make them legal up to 15.5 mph with the DVSA.
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I think the only manufacturer in the UK to this.

DG…
 
No, they have managed to make them legal up to 15.5 mph with the DVSA.
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I think the only manufacturer in the UK to this.

DG…
I'd love to see the UK definition of a bicycle by the Road Code. I'm almost sure it is so similar to the Euro one.

I think Wisper has Type Approved its e-bikes. Which doesn't make its e-bikes "pedal assisted bicycles" you are riding.
 
So, just an update. According to the doctor, it's likely she blew out her knee as a result of biking, as a new biker, in the lowest level of assist. She had wanted to get exercise, lose weight, etc..., but overstressed her knees, which were already marginal. She has gotten hyaluronic acid injections in her knees and lost some weight, so we tried doing things starting in Turbo. So far, it's working well. Over time, we hope to lower the level of assist as she builds muscle. Thanks all for the discussion!
 
I'd love to see the UK definition of a bicycle by the Road Code. I'm almost sure it is so similar to the Euro one.

I think Wisper has Type Approved its e-bikes. Which doesn't make its e-bikes "pedal assisted bicycles" you are riding.
Found some more information from Wisper.

“Wisper are now offering a limited run of their 806, 705 and 905 electric bike models with a full throttle capable of powering the bikes up to 15.5mph without pedalling.

David Miall, Founder and Director of Wisper, says: “I am particularly excited to be able to offer full throttle bikes again. They are more inclusive than standard e-bikes, enabling those that need a little more help to discover, or return to the joys of cycling.”

To be able to offer this capability Wisper has had a batch of the models tested and type approved by the DVSA as 250W Low Powered Mopeds.

Wisper explain that ‘250W LPM 250 Watt Low Powered Mopeds’ are “a sub-group of Low Powered Moped that meets the criteria laid down in the Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycle Regulations 1983 (SI 1983 No. 1168) and as amended by:

SI 2015 No. 24. The requirements are that the vehicle:

  • Be fitted with pedals by means of which it is capable of being propelled.
  • Be fitted with no motor other than an electric motor, which has a maximum continuous rated power, which does not exceed 250 watts and cannot propel the vehicle when it is travelling at more than 15.5 mph.”
Wisper further clarifies that type approval of these electric bikes allows them to be ridden legally on roads and private land within the UK at speeds of up to 15.5mph using just the throttle. These bikes will be sold directly from Wisper’s HQ in Sevenoaks, Kent with plans to roll out these bikes nationally over the coming year. Wisper hopes that offering such e-bikes will allow for people who may have difficulties riding a standard pedal assist electric bike to be able to enjoy the same freedom and flexibility as others.”

“Wisper said it hopes that offering such e-bikes will allow for people who may have difficulties riding a standard pedal-assist electric bike to be able to enjoy the freedom and flexibility of bikes. The bikes will also offer a quick, eco-friendly and cost-efficient option for city commuters.”

“Full Throttle eBikes from Wisper

Why We Offer Wisper Full Throttle eBikes

  1. Full Throttle eBikes offer a quick, eco friendly and cost efficient option for city commuters at a time when everyone is looking to save on rising fuel and transport costs.
  2. Full Throttle eBikes offer commuters better control and enhanced safety when moving slowly in traffic.
  3. Full throttle eBikes offer immediate power when accelerating especially useful at traffic lights or on hills.
  4. Full Throttle eBikes allow a rider to “take a breather” and cool down from time to time during a journey, particularly useful when commuting in hot weather.
  5. Full Throttle eBikes make cycling even more inclusive, enabling those of us with for example impaired movement to enjoy the benefits and freedom eBikes bring.

Fully Legal in the UK

Continuing our journey of pro-active leadership, innovation and progression within the e-bike industry we are proud to be able to offer fully UK legal, full throttle eBikes that will power our bikes up to 15.5mph without pedalling.

As well as making our bikes safer and more easily controlled at low speeds, offering faster acceleration from stand still, Wisper full throttle electric bicycles make cycling even more inclusive than ordinary eBikes, enabling those that need a little extra help when discovering, or returning to the joys and freedom cycling offers.

How It Works

Once we receive your order for a Wisper full throttle bike we arrange to have your bike tested by the DVSA and Type Approved as an L1e in the category 250W LPM (250Watt Low Powered) Moped. This can take between 2 and 8 weeks as the bike has to be taken to a specially approved MVSA centre for the Type Approval tests to be carried out. The tests are to make sure our standard eBike is safe and complies to current EAPC (Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycle) regulations. Once these tests have been completed we are presented with a British National Type Approval, Minister’s Approval Certificate bearing your bike’s frame number, this ensures the certificate can only be used in conjunction with your specific Wisper bike. The certificate must be kept in a safe place just like an MOT certificate although we and the Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency will keep a record of your Bike’s Type Approval.

Unlike an MOT Certificate, the Type Approval Certificate lasts for the lifetime of the bike and does not need to be renewed.

Full throttle eBikes will continue to work in exactly the same way a standard eBike works when the throttle is not used. The rider only uses the throttle when needed, it will not effect any other standard EAPC function.

Exclusions

To obtain Type Approval bikes must be fitted with front and rear lights operated together on one switch. Because the Tailwind Trail, Tailwind City and Wayfarer Mountain do not have lights these bikes cannot yet be Type Approved. We are working on a solution and hope to offer these bikes with a full throttle by mid 2023.

The Regulations

L1e electric bikes are a sub-group of Low Powered Moped that meets the criteria laid down in the Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycle Regulations 1983 (SI 1983 No. 1168) as amended by SI 2015 No. 24. The requirements are that the vehicle:

  1. Be fitted with pedals by means of which it is capable of being propelled
  2. Be fitted with no motor other than an electric motor, which has a maximum continuous rated power, which does not exceed 250 watts and cannot propel the vehicle when it is travelling at more than 15.5 mph
In essence, our bikes, when Type Approved, can be ridden legally on roads and private land within the UK at speeds of up to 15.5mph using just the throttle.

Costs and Warranty

Anyone can take their Wisper bike to an approved MVSA centre and apply for Type Approval. The cost of the test and certification is £55.00 which is payable to the DVSA and needs to be paid at the time of booking the test appointment. If you chose to have your bike Type Approved yourself, please contact us with the TA details and we will for a fee of £45.00 upgrade your bike’s software, this has to be done physically at our Kent HQ. If you would like your warranty to be extended to cover your bike with a full throttle we will make a further charge of £45.00. This does not extend the time line of your warranty which will remain at 24 months from the time you originally purchased your Wisper bike.

We offer the full TA certification service for a fee of £300.00 on top of the price of a new Wisper bike or £350.00 on a used Wisper bike. We only offer this service on Wisper bikes as we know they are fully legal EAPCs.

Our charges include the test fee, upgrading the software on the bike, one of our technicians driving the bike to the test centre, waiting whilst the test is done and bringing the bike back to our HQ in Kent. Importantly it also includes, a £45.00 charge to extend our two year warranty to include full throttle riding. We charge the extra £50 on used Wisper bikes to service the bike before we take it to the test centre.

If you are intending to take your Wisper bike out of the UK, it is your responsibility to check it may be used legally at your destination. We can for a £55.00 fee re-restrict your bike for you whilst you are out of the UK and de-restrict it for you when you get home, this work has to be done physically at our HQ in Kent.

Please note that a full throttle does not make your ebike more powerful than a standard bike, you may still need to pedal on steep hills.

All prices include VAT.

You can view our complete range of compatible ebikes in our Full Throttle Electric Bikes category.

If you have any further questions please contact [email protected] or call Wisper HQ on 01732 762393.”

Makes for an interesting read.

DG…
 
A low powered moped. Type Approval. Very interesting. Because it is not an electrically assisted bicycle. It is a moped.

The L1e-B mopeds such as R&M HS or Specialized Vado 6.0 or Trek Allant+ S are Type Approved by the brand (taking all the effort and cost) , and need to be registered, insured etc etc.

I still think Wisper is not saying the full truth. They specifically do not say what L1e-letter it is.
 
A low powered moped. Type Approval. Very interesting. Because it is not an electrically assisted bicycle. It is a moped.

The L1e-B mopeds such as R&M HS or Specialized Vado 6.0 or Trek Allant+ S are Type Approved by the brand (taking all the effort and cost) , and need to be registered, insured etc etc.

I still think Wisper is not saying the full truth. They specifically do not say what L1e-letter it is.
This is interesting, finding out further information regarding UK law.

More details;

“Electric mopeds and motorbikes
Electric motorbikes, like conventionally powered motorbikes and mopeds, are categorised by power and speed and different laws apply for different kinds of bikes. The same rules apply to tricycles and light quadricycles.

15.5mph or less​

If an electric motorbike or moped has pedals, a maximum top speed of 15.5mph and a motor with an output of less than 250W, it's treated the same as an eBike. This means you can legally ride one anywhere you can ride a normal bicycle. You don’t need a car or bike licence, a number plate, tax disc or MOT. The rider needs to be over 14 years of age.”

DG…
 
I dont like the feel in turbo one its just too easy I only use it when I am really sick. I can accelerate so fast that turbo would actually slow me down because you cant shift fast enough. I can get to 14mph in two peddle strokes on tour or sport.
Yes, and I can get to 20+mph in two pedal strokes. I shift frequently but no more than 2 gears. I just like to ride fast. This is just one reason I don’t prefer a throttle for myself — it is unnecessary and could slow me down.
 
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As far as the USA goes, I believe, the marketplace has made the decision in favor of a throttle on an ebike.
All those DTC bikes have throttles, and home built kit bikes go 30+ mph on throttle! Tough to sell an ebike without a throttle to someone who has ridden a bike with a throttle.

Once someone experiences a motorcycle --- there's no going back. 😎
 
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