Announced: Yamaha Civante - 28mph

[PedalUma]

Yes. This is not a bike for novices. The motor and battery pop out and it can be ridden acoustically. Pop them back in and it is a lithe assisted ride. Did you see the weight numbers?
On our group ride yesterday one bike was 90 pounds. Light bikes do not require large batteries and motors. A gull will out fly a turkey. The turkey ran out of juice. It had a 21.1Ah 48V battery. My bike out ran it with a 10.5, 36.

 

[Oski1997]

There's also the Ex E+ from Giant, albeit a flat bar urban/hybrid style, at $3900. Deore.

Yeah, that’s more of a city/touring bike. The more you go away from being a road bike, the cheaper bikes get. It also depends how how many miles you want to ride bc the battery is only 375w. Which will prob get you 35 miles using the highest settings (and if you’re under 190lb and in decent shape, not necessarily fit) if you’re going on a 3 hour ride at 20+ mph for 1-hr, climbing for 1 hour of those 3 hours, and then going for 1-hr on flat roads. If you need more than that, then you’ll need a 500w battery. I’m just using my own experience here as an approximation bc I don’t like it when people say “range all depends on many factors like wind, tire pressure, weight, etc). Lol - that kind of answer never really helped me. But please take my example with a grain of salt. I’m sure others will give you other battery ranges and examples.

 

[Oski1997]

There's also the Ex E+ from Giant, albeit a flat bar urban/hybrid style, at $3900. Deore.

Crow doesn't say it's a Class 3, so I'm going to assume it's not. Pet peeve of mine, how bike companies can be so damn cryptic about their vehicles top speed. It should be obvious and prominent in every single US ebike listing.

I looked up their motor, and i did find one site that said Fazua now does make a class 3 bike. So maybe only some of the 2021 motors are a class 3.

 

[Asher]

Yeah, that’s more of a city/touring bike. The more you go away from being a road bike, the cheaper bikes get. It also depends how how many miles you want to ride bc the battery is only 375w. Which will prob get you 35 miles (if you’re under 190lb and in decent shape, not necessarily fit) if you’re going on a 3 hour ride at 20+ mph for 1-hr, climbing for 1 hour of those 3 hours, and then going for 1-hr on flat roads. If you need more than that, then you’ll need a 500w battery. I’m just using my own experience here as an approximation bc I don’t like it when people say “range all depends on many factors like wind, tire pressure, weight, etc). Lol - that kind of answer never really helped me. But please take my example with a grain of salt. I’m sure others will give you other battery ranges and examples.

The 2021 version has a 500wh battery.

 

[Oski1997]

There's also the Ex E+ from Giant, albeit a flat bar urban/hybrid style, at $3900. Deore.

On my 500w battery with 70nm of torque. I used 90% of my battery. This 42-mile ride was almost 3 hours with an elevation gain of 3,800ft. I used the 2 highest settings (1.5 hrs on the highest and 1.5 hrs on the 2nd highest). This is just an example of one ride and the battery range a 500w battery can have using the highest settings.

 

[Oski1997]

The 2021 version has a 500wh battery.

That is great!

 

[FlatSix911]

Just discovering this bike now. The Yamaha dealer network looks a bit sparse, but otherwise seems like a great value. Now, if they just made a flat bar version with wider tires...

Yamaha Civante Ebike Review

We review the Yamaha Civante, a zippy Class 3 electric road bike with pedal assist up to 28 mph and offered at a reasonable price point.

www.cyclevolta.com

The $3,400 price saves us plenty of money to buy add-ons. The next least expensive class 3 road bike (with at least a Tiagra group set) with a minimum of 70nm of torque and a 500w battery is the Giant E+Pro (with Ultegra) at $4,700

Yamaha seems to currently offer the best value combination for reliability and price on the market for Class 1 and 3 mid-drive bikes.

 

[PedalUma]

Yamaha seems to currently offer the best value combination for reliability and price on the market for Class 1 and 3 mid-drive bikes.

Nice. Any idea of Yamaha's rank in the top tier for sales?
I suspect we will see more of the trend for modularity such as range extenders for the percentage of rides where the added weight upside is wanted. The idea of yanking out the motor and the battery is cool with the Fazua. Great for securely shipping the bike too.

 

[Asher]

Anyone know what the max tire clearance is for this bike?

BTW you can shave off an easy 700g by switching to Continental Grand Prix Urban tires. Maybe shave another 300-500g with a BYO alloy wheelset.

The Yamaha rear light/fender/rack setup is oddly expensive at $260 and the frame warranty is 3 years only, an FYI.

 

[Oski1997]

Anyone know what the max tire clearance is for this bike?

BTW you can shave off an easy 700g by switching to Continental Grand Prix Urban tires. Maybe shave another 300-500g with a BYO alloy wheelset.

The Yamaha rear light/fender/rack setup is oddly expensive at $260 and the frame warranty is 3 years only, an FYI.

Who provides a longer than 3-year warranty on the battery and motor? I agree, the fender/light setup is expensive. I like the Continental tire suggestion. It only has 2 reviews on Amazon. Do you own these tires? Is the puncture resistance better than the Level 5 protection of the CST XPEDIUM AMPERO 700 x 35c?

 

[WattsUpDude]

Anyone know what the max tire clearance is for this bike?

BTW you can shave off an easy 700g by switching to Continental Grand Prix Urban tires. Maybe shave another 300-500g with a BYO alloy wheelset.

The Yamaha rear light/fender/rack setup is oddly expensive at $260 and the frame warranty is 3 years only, an FYI.

I have the Urban Rush (basically Class 1 version of the Civante). I have 38mm tires under 45mm fenders. Without fenders, I can confidently say 43mm would fit.

I like the more integrated Yamaha rack but I really like my Axiom Stream Liner rack / SKS aluminum fenders and Garmin RTL515 rear tailight & radar.

 

[Asher]

Who provides a longer than 3-year warranty on the battery and motor? I agree, the fender/light setup is expensive. I like the Continental tire suggestion. It only has 2 reviews on Amazon. Do you own these tires? Is the puncture resistance better than the Level 5 protection of the CST XPEDIUM AMPERO 700 x 35c?

I said frame. Frame warranties are often lifetime from top tier brands.

I don't own these tires but Continental's Grand Prix line are the best tires of their kind. See the website Bicycle Rolling Resistance. I own Conti GP 5000 TL in 32 mm. I imagine the Urbans are similar to the non-tubeless GPs, albeit with more protection.

The CST probably works fine but a few extra dollars on tires goes a long way. Probably most cost effective upgrade you can do on any bike. (Pedals, and handlebars/grips on a flat bar bike too.) Level 5 protection is a meaningless term the maker made up.

Another option would be the Marathon Supreme or Schwalbe Almotion, though they're heavier.

 

[Oski1997]

I said frame. Frame warranties are often lifetime from top tier brands.

I don't own these tires but Continental's Grand Prix line are the best tires of their kind. See the website Bicycle Rolling Resistance. I own Conti GP 5000 TL in 32 mm. I imagine the Urbans are similar to the non-tubeless GPs, albeit with more protection.

The CST probably works fine but a few extra dollars on tires goes a long way. Probably most cost effective upgrade you can do on any bike. (Pedals, and handlebars/grips on a flat bar bike too.) Level 5 protection is a meaningless term the maker made up.

Another option would be the Marathon Supreme or Schwalbe Almotion, though they're heavier.

Giant manufactures the frame for Yamaha (probably bc Yamaha manufactures the motors for them). Maybe that’s why the frame doesn’t have a lifetime warranty?? Not sure. Yeah Schwalbe and Continental seem to be on all the high end bikes. Nice suggestions. I have the Shimano PD-M540 clipless pedals that I use with the Specialized Recon shoes. My next upgrade is going to be carbon fiber wheels and the Ultegra group set for brakes /derailleurs /cassette. I need to find out which carbon wheels are compatible with the Civantes rear hub (12 x 142 Shimano freehub).

 

[ChrisMartis]

Anyone know what the max tire clearance is for this bike?

BTW you can shave off an easy 700g by switching to Continental Grand Prix Urban tires. Maybe shave another 300-500g with a BYO alloy wheelset.

The Yamaha rear light/fender/rack setup is oddly expensive at $260 and the frame warranty is 3 years only, an FYI.

Hi Asher,

I'm running Kenda 35mm tires under Planet Cycle fenders which work fine. I run them at 2.5 front and 3bar rear for use on fire-roads and cinder trails. Very comfortable.

The Yamaha fenders do not fit on the bike with these tires and actually might not fit at all. I bought a rear Yamaha fender but was unable to install it properly as the fender is made of light-weight plastic which is packaged with two folds in the fender -- go figure. It's seemly impossible to get the bends out.

I've installed an Old Man Mountain rack but needed to use a different size thru-axle than the one recommended by OMM.

With the integrated speed sensor on the rear wheel, I'm not sure how to switch wheels to another brand. Maybe it could be adapted somehow?

Chris.

 

[Oski1997]

Hi Asher,

I'm running Kenda 35mm tires under Planet Cycle fenders which work fine. I run them at 2.5 front and 3bar rear for use on fire-roads and cinder trails. Very comfortable.

The Yamaha fenders do not fit on the bike with these tires and actually might not fit at all. I bought a rear Yamaha fender but was unable to install it properly as the fender is made of light-weight plastic which is packaged with two folds in the fender -- go figure. It's seemly impossible to get the bends out.

I've installed an Old Man Mountain rack but needed to use a different size thru-axle than the one recommended by OMM.

With the integrated speed sensor on the rear wheel, I'm not sure how to switch wheels to another brand. Maybe it could be adapted somehow?

Chris.

I believe all Yamaha bikes (except the new YDX-Moros) use the 12 x 142 Shimano rear freehub. I’m sure any bike shop can easily help you find compatible wheels. Have you asked your LBS for recommendations?

 

[Alaskan]

I have not ridden a drop handle bar for three decades but recently purchased a Cannodale Topstone Neo Carbon 3 e-gravel bike. I was apprehensive about the drop bar. Rather than replace it with a flat bar and all the changed components that would require (levers, shifters and cables), I chose to try the Richite WCs Venturemax which has a very short, 102mm drop and a good flare in the drops. It has turned out to be a very good choice for me. I can comfortably ride the drops as they do not drop down so low as to make me uncomfortable and it was a far less costly transition that it would have been to flat bars. It also has a decently aero shape and is quite lightweight at 270 grams versus around 230 grams for the carbon version which costs 3 times as much. Note the early Venturemax (not the WCS Venture max) has the same drop and flair dimensions but does not have the aero/comfort shape of the WSC version.

The WCS beacon gravel bar has just an 80mm drop and even more flair. This is the handlebar that comes on the Crow gravel bike.

I have also rediscovered the multitude of hand/ride positions offered by a drop bar and really like it. I have had issues with all flat bars, eventually causing circulation and numbing issues on longer rides. With the Richie bar I can shift hand positions and make it go away quickly where with the flat bars, I had to either stop or ride one handed for five minutes every half hour while shaking the numb hand till circulation was restored.

If you get that bike, try this handlebar (or something similar) it might just work as well for you as it has for me

 

[ChrisMartis]

I believe all Yamaha bikes (except the new YDX-Moros) use the 12 x 142 Shimano rear freehub. I’m sure any bike shop can easily help you find compatible wheels. Have you asked your LBS for recommendations?

No. I haven't considered changing the wheels. But is it common to have a hub-based speed sensor?

 

[Oski1997]

No. I haven't considered changing the wheels. But is it common to have a hub-based speed sensor?

It is the best kind of speed sensor bc itprovides zero cadence motor support, which is most beneficial on steep climbs and quick stop-and-go situations. This kind of rear hub sensor is patented by Yamaha so I don’t believe anyone else can use this kind of sensor. The speed sensor is not attached to the Shimano freehub. Since Giant uses a variant of this motor (the more powerful PWX-2 variant), I would start by finding out which wheels Giant uses on their ebike, and then find similarly rated wheels from other brands using the Giant wheel as a baseline (for safety reasons). The wheels on Trek bikes that use the 4th gen Bosch Performance Line Speed motor would also have wheels that are safe to use with the Yamaha Civante.

Yamaha Zero cadence support with 2 freewheels​

Most mid-drive motors (like the Bosch) have just one freewheel, this is used for pedaling without turning the motor. With just a single freewheel, the motor can never drive the rear wheel without the pedals turning, this requires an extra freewheel.

The Yamaha has 2 freewheels, so we can do both:

• Pedaling without turning the motor
• The motor can drive the rear wheel without the pedals turning
  
  This kind of rear hub sensor is patented by Yamaha so I don’t believe anyone else can use this kind of sensor.

 

[Asher]

Hi Asher,

I'm running Kenda 35mm tires under Planet Cycle fenders which work fine. I run them at 2.5 front and 3bar rear for use on fire-roads and cinder trails. Very comfortable.

The Yamaha fenders do not fit on the bike with these tires and actually might not fit at all. I bought a rear Yamaha fender but was unable to install it properly as the fender is made of light-weight plastic which is packaged with two folds in the fender -- go figure. It's seemly impossible to get the bends out.

I've installed an Old Man Mountain rack but needed to use a different size thru-axle than the one recommended by OMM.

With the integrated speed sensor on the rear wheel, I'm not sure how to switch wheels to another brand. Maybe it could be adapted somehow?

Chris.

Ah I completely forgot about the integrated speed sensor. Good point. Front wheel replacement only then.

 

[WattsUpDude]

I have not ridden a drop handle bar for three decades but recently purchased a Cannodale Topstone Neo Carbon 3 e-gravel bike. I was apprehensive about the drop bar. Rather than replace it with a flat bar and all the changed components that would require (levers, shifters and cables), I chose to try the Richite WCs Venturemax which has a very short, 102mm drop and a good flare in the drops. It has turned out to be a very good choice for me. I can comfortably ride the drops as they do not drop down so low as to make me uncomfortable and it was a far less costly transition that it would have been to flat bars. It also has a decently aero shape and is quite lightweight at 270 grams versus around 230 grams for the carbon version which costs 3 times as much. Note the early Venturemax (not the WCS Venture max) has the same drop and flair dimensions but does not have the aero/comfort shape of the WSC version.
View attachment 81854
The WCS beacon gravel bar has just an 80mm drop and even more flair. This is the handlebar that comes on the Crow gravel bike.

View attachment 81857

I have also rediscovered the multitude of hand/ride positions offered by a drop bar and really like it. I have had issues with all flat bars, eventually causing circulation and numbing issues on longer rides. With the Richie bar I can shift hand positions and make it go away quickly where with the flat bars, I had to either stop or ride one handed for five minutes every half hour while shaking the numb hand till circulation was restored.

View attachment 81860

If you get that bike, try this handlebar (or something similar) it might just work as well for you as it has for me

That's the exact bar I've been looking for. Shallow drop and just enough flare and width for varying terrain.