New here, dead bike

[Mike_V]

Too busy to call Rad on the telephone and speak to an employee about your concern?

"Radpower folks asked to make video of the following. Put on charger, push the state of charge button on the battery for over 3 seconds. (it showed all on 1 red 4 green). Then do the same with charger off. I did and all the lights came on and stayed on. Sent them video, no reply. "

 

[mtiberio]

Too busy to call Rad on the telephone and speak to an employee about your concern?

"Radpower folks asked to make video of the following. Put on charger, push the state of charge button on the battery for over 3 seconds. (it showed all on 1 red 4 green). Then do the same with charger off. I did and all the lights came on and stayed on. Sent them video, no reply. "

I did eventually. Since battery was actively failing, info changed. Person I spoke with was clearly low level tech reading from a menu of issues and solutions, there was some help. But after I supplied them w/everything they asked, crickets. From what the Internet tells me their battery bracket is proprietary and they do not sell it individually. Here I go with their $550 battery or I replace the battery and bracket with a $250 generic.

 

[JES2020]

8 hours is sufficient

From a lithium battery manufacturer:

(Note the 6 to 12 hours is for a 400ah battery, which is fairly small for an ebike).

"

• Extremely slow during balancing. Due to the low current during balancing (normally between 0.1A and 1A), it takes 6 to 12 hours to complete this phase. Here’s an example to help you understand what the real charging times are with this kind of system: in a 400Ah battery in which 300Ah were used up, a 100A battery charger restores the energy in 3 hours. Add to this 6 to 12 hours needed for balancing. Total charging time: 9-15 hours. "

 

[JES2020]

How many batteries have you sold, repaired, supported or owned?From how
many different manufacturers?

I may not have spent as much time futzing with bicycles as you, but ppl learn at vastly different rates and/or levels.

 

[JES2020]

your post the same instructions suggest charging at .1 to 1A

Wow just wow. That post is regarding what the BMS balance charges at. Come one man, Don't you know that?
That is exactly why it takes so long to balance charge, NOT the 8 hours as you posted.

 

[JES2020]

The article quoted recommended charging for 15 hours but at 0.1 to 1 A. Not something oem chargers can do

The article clearly stated that it's the BMS that controls the balance charge AND that the BMS balance charges at .1 to 1 amp (this is the third time you misquoted it)

 

[harryS]

Hi mtiberio,

Congrats on the wedding. Sorry to hear about your health. Good luck with the treatments.

You know, most five year old batteries are kinda tired. Consider that battery a goner.They're not designed to be repaired if a cell fails. Sometimes a connection breaks, or the protection circuits go bad, and that's about all you fix. Going to a new battery is your best move here, While an exact replacement is nice, you can buy any similar downtube battery with a mounting cradle. Use the new cradle, as you don;t need to put the old Radmini on it.

By the way, a 48V battery normally operates between 54.6V (full charge) and 40V. That's all you will measure om the outputs. A protection circuit in the battery isolates the internal cells if it detects any cell voltage problems. If you see 22V, that's just residual charge or leakage across the protection circuit. It does indicate a problem with a cell inside, That's never worth fixing, something I've learned from experience.

 

[JES2020]

Hi mtiberio,

Congrats on the wedding. Sorry to hear about your health. Good luck with the treatments.

You know, most five year old batteries are kinda tired. Consider that battery a goner.They're not designed to be repaired if a cell fails. Sometimes a connection breaks, or the protection circuits go bad, and that's about all you fix. Going to a new battery is your best move here, While an exact replacement is nice, you can buy any similar downtube battery with a mounting cradle. Use the new cradle, as you don;t need to put the old Radmini on it.

By the way, a 48V battery normally operates between 54.6V (full charge) and 40V. That's all you will measure om the outputs. A protection circuit in the battery isolates the internal cells if it detects any cell voltage problems. If you see 22V, that's just residual charge or leakage across the protection circuit. It does indicate a problem with a cell inside, That's never worth fixing, something I've learned from experience.

Yeah just throw it out, no sense in testing it to see if it can be brought back (doing a balance charge is sooo expensive).
And the landfills will readily accept your electronic waste. Win win.

 

[AHicks]

Yeah just throw it out, no sense in testing it to see if it can be brought back (doing a balance charge is sooo expensive).
And the landfills will readily accept your electronic waste. Win win.

I have to agree here. Before condemning a 5 year old battery completely, I would want to know what is wrong with it. That's me though, reasonably able when it comes to pulling something like that down and testing. Not for the faint of heart or anyone asking questions about how to use a VOM....

At that point, once the point of failure is known and deemed not worth fixing, I would have no trouble replacing a 5 year old battery.

 

[Gordon71]

I'm curious regarding battery age vs battery use. Yes the battery in question is a few years old but the bike only has 1234 miles on it. With that few miles it suggests to me that the battery was not properly cared for as in balanced on a regular basis or properly stored when not in use etc. But what about just plain age? Will that alone contribute to wear. Guess I'm asking out of curiosity should I need to order a new battery some day. Should I be concerned about the date it was made and/or whether it sat around in some warehouse for a long time prior to my purchasing it?

 

[JES2020]

I'm curious regarding battery age vs battery use. Yes the battery in question is a few years old but the bike only has 1234 miles on it. With that few miles it suggests to me that the battery was not properly cared for as in balanced on a regular basis or properly stored when not in use etc. But what about just plain age? Will that alone contribute to wear. Guess I'm asking out of curiosity should I need to order a new battery some day. Should I be concerned about the date it was made and/or whether it sat around in some warehouse for a long time prior to my purchasing it?

This is an interesting take on the subject.(link)
I can't imagine having to buy a new EV battery after just 8 years or less !

Expert: What You Know About Lithium Batteries Is Wrong, Can Last Up To 20 Years

A Good Thermal Active Management System, Like The One Found In The Chevrolet Volt, Should Extend Useful Life Past 8 Years Of Service Most end of life calculations for electric vehicles are based on an assumption of achieving 8 years of useful operation before falling below 80% of original...

insideevs.com

 

[AHicks]

The batteries WILL age just sitting on a shelf. We're using similar technology in radio control, and even with the absolute best of care, batteries WILL age out. There's no hard cut off date, but a 5 year old battery wouldn't raise much of an eyebrow here. I would still want to know what went wrong before tossing it....

 

[tomjasz]

I'm curious regarding battery age vs battery use. Yes the battery in question is a few years old but the bike only has 1234 miles on it. With that few miles it suggests to me that the battery was not properly cared for as in balanced on a regular basis or properly stored when not in use etc. But what about just plain age? Will that alone contribute to wear. Guess I'm asking out of curiosity should I need to order a new battery some day. Should I be concerned about the date it was made and/or whether it sat around in some warehouse for a long time prior to my purchasing it?

I have two 20AH batteries that completely aged out. Bad storage management and sat often unused at 100%

i have 50 GA cells stored at 3.7v/60F and another group of mj1 that are 6 years old and recently built small packs with them and so far resistance is great and no noticeable sag.

 

[LimboJim]

Yeah just throw it out, no sense in testing it to see if it can be brought back (doing a balance charge is sooo expensive).
And the landfills will readily accept your electronic waste. Win win.

www.Call2Recycle.org