Ebike battery house fire in Australia

From the photo it appears to me to be a Bafang BBSxx motor.
On a side note... That photo was definitely set up to display like a reconstruction, not how it was found.
 
Timpo said:
What frustrates me is that, this sort of article does not help at all (because it gives no information) other than implanting an image of ebikes' propensity to explode.

We don't even know what cells were used, was it some kind of no-brand cells or brand name cell?
Was BMS used? Is so, which one?
What was the charger used? Did it have a correct voltage? Did the charger have safety feature?
What was the charging rate? Did they use the correct charger?
Was the battery pack amateur built? or was it professionally built?
Did the battery suffer any prior damage? Was it dropped? Dented?

I am not sure leaving it overnight would cause fire.. don't chargers have cut-off feature once the battery is full?
Or will charger keep charging regardless? 🤔
Click to expand...
Most have cut off features, I did read somewhere they used a different charger than OEM.
 
Looks like a BBS motor to me too. It was a really big battery, at least 91 cells. Probably a triangle pack, as I'm not sure you can get that many cells into a hard case. Maybe the pack took a fall or a hard hit and damaged a cell. Bad luck, no matter what happened.
 
I don't think there is anything inherently dangerous about generic chargers and batteries as long as the quality of the materials used are up to snuff and established standards are adhered to. Grin and EM3EV are good examples. The proprietary chargers and batteries add features but the safety features remain the same. Providing stable power and shutting down properly and not over charging/heating cells being the primary function and this is not new or cutting edge technology.
 
Timpo said:
I have no idea what they meant by OEM charger. 🤔

We think the motor was BBSHD, which indicates it is (most likely) custom built bike, judging by how externally mounted.
(Eunorau and Biktrix usually hide their motor in the frame compartment)
The question is though, who built that battery pack and what charger it was used.

The battery builders and charger companies are usually different.

As we know, many ebike companies sell different chargers. They're not charger manufactures, but they just pick one of those generic chargers with many brands.
Click to expand...
OEM= the charger that came with the battery 😎
 
ChezCheese:) said:
They don't mention the type of ebike or battery manufacturer or whether the charger was original manufacturer or not. That would be nice to know....

www.theguardian.com

E-bike left on charge blamed after fire engulfs Sydney home

More than 20 firefighters sent to three-level Darlinghurst terrace to put out the blaze
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
Click to expand...
Well I hope my metal tool box with fiberglass matting would at least slow a battery fire down! Hope I never have to find out!
 

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JES2020 said:
OEM= the charger that came with the battery 😎
Click to expand...
Here's the article from the BBC, (note the fire dept's statement about "OEM" chargers_).:

"An e-bike left on charge overnight is the suspected cause of a huge house fire in Australia, firefighters say.
The three-level house in Sydney became engulfed in flames and more than 20 firefighters were called to the scene.
All seven people in the house managed to escape the blaze.
New South Wales Fire and Rescue said four of them left the building safely, two others took refuge on a balcony and one stayed inside the home. Firefighters were able to rescue them.
Two of the residents required hospital treatment.
The BBC is not responsible for the content of external sites.View original tweet on Twitter
line

The fire department reminded people to only charge e-bikes with the genuine manufacturer's charger, to do so away from where people sleep, and to ensure damaged battery packs are fixed by an authorised repairer.

"Thankfully the occupants had a working smoke alarm which alerted them to the fire," it added."

​

 
Sure looks like the root cause was the battery pack since it’s way more blown apart compared to the charger and each battery cell looks the same. Frame is also looks blown apart and completely burned up. Maybe carbon fiber?
 
Gionnirocket said:
I don't think there is anything inherently dangerous about generic chargers and batteries as long as the quality of the materials used are up to snuff and established standards are adhered to.
Click to expand...

"I don't think there is anything inherently dangerous with non-doctors conducting surgery, as long as they use all the same equipment and procedures as professional surgeons."

Personally, if I were a landlord or property manager, I'd forbid tenants from storing DIY conversion bikes (unless a reputable local ebike mechanic did it for them, and that's no longer DIY). And of course Amazon and whoever will sell anything and everything until it bites them in the ass, and that's far from happening with ebikes. (It did with those hovermobiles a decade ago.)

These kinds of incidents are rare but then again, so are DIY ebikes.

Aussies do like a fiery DIY ebike:

 
Timpo said:
This sounds like you have no problems with DIY kit, rather, you just want to make sure the DIY kit was installed properly.
Click to expand...
If you were a local mechanic with a reputation to uphold, you would a) have a good sense of which component suppliers are trustworthy and b) wouldn't risk your reputation to save $50 on batteries that could burn a customer's house down. A reputable mechanic is a self-regulating entity, a DIYer is a loose Cannon. Maybe most DiYers do a fine job, but when the risk is burning down a building with people in it, most isn't good enough.

There probably is bad DIY kit, so it's not just a matter of the installation. But it's about how the person chooses too.
 
Asher said:
"I don't think there is anything inherently dangerous with non-doctors conducting surgery, as long as they use all the same equipment and procedures as professional surgeons."

Personally, if I were a landlord or property manager, I'd forbid tenants from storing DIY conversion bikes (unless a reputable local ebike mechanic did it for them, and that's no longer DIY). And of course Amazon and whoever will sell anything and everything until it bites them in the ass, and that's far from happening with ebikes. (It did with those hovermobiles a decade ago.)

These kinds of incidents are rare but then again, so are DIY ebikes.

Aussies do like a fiery DIY ebike:

Click to expand...
I didn't say DIY... I said GENERIC and gave examples of what I meant so again try to keep to your skill level and keep with counting up to 10.
C'mon, I'll get you started... a One... a Two....
The article made a point of using manufacturer matched chargers and batteries and my point was matching a generic charger like Grin to a generic battery like EM3EV I don't think to be a problem.
Do I need to use words with fewer syllables?
 
Timpo said:
Well WattWagons for example, is not a battery manufacture / builder. (many ebike companies are not)

As far as I know, they use EM3EV battery packs, which is also used in DIY projects.
But I don't think anyone was ever concerned about WattWagon's reliability or craftsmanship.
I guess it's about how they choose the components, as you mentioned.

WattWagons offer a few charger options, all the way up to 10A fast charger, but I don't think EM3EV build their own charger, they're battery builder.

Many other ebikes companies like Biktrix, DOST, among other use battery with Hailong(or similar) casing (I don't know who built them) for dual battery set up.
Click to expand...
Building a DIY battery pack takes the proper skills, tools and experience which in my opinion is best left to a manufacturing facility such as EM3EV... Same goes for a charger.
Generic manufacturers will also have some accepted standard of testing for thier products so I do not think they can be lumped together with DIY
There was definitely errors made here, the obvious being leaving a battery to charge unattended and overnight.
 
Dallant said:
Well I hope my metal tool box with fiberglass matting would at least slow a battery fire down! Hope I never have to find out!
Click to expand...
Curious... How are you implementing the tool box. Are you placing the battery inside to charge?

Personally I don't go that far, but I do take steps to be careful when charging.
I charge in the middle of my basement floor which is concrete and has a 10' ceiling.
I keep a fire extinguisher in the adjacent room.
I use a low amperage charger (2a) to charge slowly.
I typically charge to around 80% using my diy solar charge controller mostly to extend cycle life but it also adds a layer of safety as overcharging is when this type of failure would probably occur.
I also have charging set up in home automation that will shut everything down in 5 hours and sends me a notification at start up and a reminder at 4 hours in... my typical charge time.
I keep an old wifi camera in the room that allows me to see what's going on.
Occasionally I measure the battery case and charger temperature near the end of a charge with a non contact gun to see if anything is above normal.
This all may seem like a lot... But I actually enjoy this approach and I don't find it inconvenient at all.
 
Gionnirocket said:
There was definitely errors made here, the obvious being leaving a battery to charge unattended and overnight.
Click to expand...
If you have a battery that can't be left unattended to charge, you have a bomb waiting to go off. And hardware that's a cruel joke unfit for mass use.
 
Asher said:
If you have a battery that can't be left unattended to charge, you have a bomb waiting to go off. And hardware that's a cruel joke unfit for mass use.
Click to expand...
Can't be 100% positive but I believe just about every battery charger/ battery I've seen no matter the device... the instructions state to Not Charge Unattended and to not charge near combustible materials.
That said I agree with you... One can't stand in front of a battery for 8 hours watching it charge. The things that I do act as a measure of attention.
 
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Timpo said:
I agree.

I never watch my battery getting charged.
That would be a huge waste of time.

I don't know anyone who sits right beside the battery getting charged for hours.

That's a bit unrealistic expectation if we can't leave the charger unattended.
Click to expand...
I think the concept of unattended is being taken too literally. I think the intent is to not plug it in and forget about it and/or leave it plugged into the charger to be always top' d off.
I've always taken it as don't leave the house and be available to unplug not long after the charge is completed.
 
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