Why aren't many ebike warranties tranferable?

[J.R.]

I was trying to figure that out. Are carmakers required to make their warranty transferable?

It's really complicated, Asher. Manufactures are required to warranty certain parts of a car even beyond the first owner. Not the whole car. Some emissions components, some safety components, etc... Getting coverage, as a second owner, can often be a fight. Once you get beyond some of the federal protections, some states offer consumer protections.

Regulations started getting tighter in the '70's. Many years of pressure from government, consumer groups, law suits changed the industry. Manufactures made cars better from the start to avoid as much liability as they could. When I bought my first car it was considered old, it was 6 years old and cost a tiny fraction of new. Kind of like the ebike market is today. My current F150 is nearly 10 years old, looks and drives new and is worth more, percentage wise, than my first car.

'How come there's never enough time to do it right the first time, but always enough time to do it over'

The slow March of progress. Man it can feel slow watching it

 

[BlackHand]

I'm a little surprised that none of the big name drivetrain companies sponsor 'certified' used ebikes from their qualified dealers:

Dealer inspects bike and battery, sends diagnostics to the manufacturer to verify current health, and pays a small fee to the manufacturer.

In return the manufacturer grants, say, a 1 year warranty on the drivetrain and battery and the dealer gets to sell the bike at a premium with warranty.

I imagine the ebike market will need to grow several times its current size for this to start to make sense for dealers and manufacturers.

 

[Alex M]

Because people will be more willing to by a used ebike if they know there is some warranty for it.

That’s not capitalism, that’s good service.

From the standpoint of business owner the added expense of a transferable warranty is only a good idea if it makes him more money.
Don't call it a "capitalism", - call it "common sense" or "greed" if this sounds better . The bottom line is - they don't do it because they don't want to.

 

[tomjasz]

Is that Wow for wow thats a low price or wow thats a high price or just wow!

A suspiciously low price.

 

[Taylor57]

I was thinking of buying an extra. I've seen many over 500 bucks each...

 

[tomjasz]

big name drivetrain companies

Several of the posters are lamenting a warranty on $899 eBikes. That will never happen. Essentially Walmart quality bikes with motors. Few if any parts are mainstream, and if the battery is truly $300 to replace they have to be using low-quality cells.

 

[tomjasz]

I was thinking of buying an extra. I've seen many over 500 bucks each...

A more realistic price for quality cells.

 

[Taylor57]

I will say that is something that Lectric XP has going for it-battery price. If your battery quits or you lose it somehow, 299 gets you back in the game...

 

[BigNerd]

From the standpoint of business owner the added expense of a transferable warranty is only a good idea if it makes him more money.
Don't call it a "capitalism", - call it "common sense" or "greed" if this sounds better . The bottom line is - they don't do it because they don't want to.

Yes... that's the common reason everyone has been stating.

But... if I wanted to continue to be a D2C model, I would try to think of things that would differentiate me from the other sellers who may have similar bikes that they sell for less.

Just like I said in that value bike thread, they should do an analysis on what is the most common after purchase warranty expense and figure out what would be the real cost if warranties were to transfer. Same goes for service, maybe tap into the VeloFix/VeloTooler network and partner up on mobile repairs on their brands so that eliminates the "no LBS support" from the equation. I understand some D2Cs have partnerships with LBS (like Aventon) but I prefer to create more market opportunity for "wrenchers" who can provide mobile support and sometimes better service than an LBS with the convenience of not having to drive to your store to get your bike looked at.

I should create another thread for this, but I think the mobile bike service sector is under utilized (at least in my area) and with many of my LBS quoting 2-3 weeks wait just for a tune-up, there is a need that can be filled and if partnered with D2Cs, there can be some type of alternate revenue stream created. For example, as an add-on, would the non-mechanically inclined consumer be willing to pay for a year's worth of mobile service that included X tune-ups for say $100-200 on a D2C purchase? Maybe some mobile services already provide this type of warranty program but I don't think many consumers know about them (I've seen many posts here that didn't know they can have a mobile service build/check their ebike).

 

[Asher]

I'm a little surprised that none of the big name drivetrain companies sponsor 'certified' used ebikes from their qualified dealers:

Dealer inspects bike and battery, sends diagnostics to the manufacturer to verify current health, and pays a small fee to the manufacturer.

In return the manufacturer grants, say, a 1 year warranty on the drivetrain and battery and the dealer gets to sell the bike at a premium with warranty.

I imagine the ebike market will need to grow several times its current size for this to start to make sense for dealers and manufacturers.

It all comes down to the same root cause. Ebike sales are strong, and the customers aren't insisting on long term resale value. The low end of the market caters to people who see ebikes as toys and don't care (thus the demand for $1k ebikes, akin to a $10k car). The high end is the likes of Bosch who are making fat profits and have no incentive to change.

I think there's also the problem of a severe absence of ability to actually work on the electric bits. It doesn't seem like battery repacking is that hard, but good luck finding any local shops that will do it.

You see the same struggles with repairability in consumer electronics, which I've started to follow. Experts say it's not even hard to make many gadgets like true Wireless earphones more repairable, but customers aren't insisting on it. Personally, I blame the review websites where everyone gathers their information for not making this a more central criterion, in the consumer electronics sector. I'm not sure there even are good review websites for e-bikes (think like the Wirecutter, Tom's Hardware) that compare all options with sound advice.

It will be interesting though to see how brands that do more in house work, like Specialized and Vanmoof, respond. Perhaps when you buy a Specialized bike, Specialized feels more of a responsibility to keep maintenance needs reasonable instead of just telling you to throw money at Bosch.

It's plausible that a company could champion repairability and resellability (IMO closely related) that forces other brands to compete - or doesn't, if consumers simply don't care.

 

[Taylor57]

It all comes down to the same root cause. Ebike sales are strong, and the customers aren't insisting on long term resale value. The low end of the market caters to people who see ebikes as toys and don't care (thus the demand for $1k ebikes, akin to a $10k car). The high end is the likes of Bosch who are making fat profits and have no incentive to change.

I think there's also the problem of a severe absence of ability to actually work on the electric bits. It doesn't seem like battery repacking is that hard, but good luck finding any local shops that will do it.

You see the same struggles with repairability in consumer electronics, which I've started to follow. Experts say it's not even hard to make many gadgets like true Wireless earphones more repairable, but customers aren't insisting on it. Personally, I blame the review websites where everyone gathers their information for not making this a more central criterion, in the consumer electronics sector. I'm not sure there even are good review websites for e-bikes (think like the Wirecutter, Tom's Hardware) that compare all options with sound advice.

It will be interesting though to see how brands that do more in house work, like Specialized and Vanmoof, respond. Perhaps when you buy a Specialized bike, Specialized feels more of a responsibility to keep maintenance needs reasonable instead of just telling you to throw money at Bosch.

It's plausible that a company could champion repairability and resellability (IMO closely related) that forces other brands to compete - or doesn't, if consumers simply don't care.

So basically buying a low end Ebike is akin to buying a low end Microwave oven. You use the crap out of it and then when it breaks, you toss it..

 

[wings02]

First a question, then a comment: What is the dollar or percentage amount a manufacturer puts in the cost of their bikes when formulating their retail price?

Now my 2 cents: I totally think manufactures know the nature of the beast with ebikes. They are nothing more than a large number of semi complicated electrified moving parts, manufactured overseas, that they the seller never even puts a hand or eye on. No matter how you look at it, these bikes are doomed for some amount of failure and these bike companies KNOW that! They would be crazy to offer a transferable warranty. They don't need the hassle no matter how much good PR it would possibly bring. IMO, the ebike market (especially the lower end models) have gotten so diluted with new start-up companies, they are producing bikes with the business model of more is better.
Sorry to generalize but I can see the scenario of a couple of friends getting together to have a beer or SOMETHING (???), see an ebike wiz by and look at each other and say, wow, let's start a company..... The buying frenzy that presently exists in this sector, really fuels these existing and start-up companies. Yes, I know there are several really good companies in this market but even they are forced to push the envelope because of all of the competition.
Ok, more like 4 cents worth...

 

[BigNerd]

So I may have found a workaround here.

Why not purchase Velocare? It covers most of the stuff that the "manufacturer" doesn't and it's transferrable.

It's relatively cheap, $105 for 3 years for bikes that cost up to $999. $155 to $2499, and $205 for up to $3999.

It's partnered with numerous LBS locations so you can get service locally.

Bicycle extended warranty | Velocare

velocare.com

I know warranties are sometimes dicey as they will say "this is not covered" or "you did not properly maintain it" but the price is relatively cheap.

I only found one thread about this in 2018. Anyone use Velocare?

 

[rich c]

So I may have found a workaround here.

Why not purchase Velocare? It covers most of the stuff that the "manufacturer" doesn't and it's transferrable.

It's relatively cheap, $105 for 3 years for bikes that cost up to $999. $155 to $2499, and $205 for up to $3999.

It's partnered with numerous LBS locations so you can get service locally.

Bicycle extended warranty | Velocare

velocare.com

I know warranties are sometimes dicey as they will say "this is not covered" or "you did not properly maintain it" but the price is relatively cheap.

I only found one thread about this in 2018. Anyone use Velocare?

It doesn't cover the battery or charger. Also doesn't cover the frame, tires, tubes, and brake pads. And as you said it doesn't cover anything you don't perform maintenance on. So that would be all the bearings, motor, and the whole drivetrain if you don't take the bike in for yearly maintenance. Feels pretty weak to me.

 

[Taylor57]

So I may have found a workaround here.

Why not purchase Velocare? It covers most of the stuff that the "manufacturer" doesn't and it's transferrable.

It's relatively cheap, $105 for 3 years for bikes that cost up to $999. $155 to $2499, and $205 for up to $3999.

It's partnered with numerous LBS locations so you can get service locally.

Bicycle extended warranty | Velocare

velocare.com

I know warranties are sometimes dicey as they will say "this is not covered" or "you did not properly maintain it" but the price is relatively cheap.

I only found one thread about this in 2018. Anyone use Velocare?

I think those prices are based on acoustic bikes, no?

 

[Art Deco]

Because people will be more willing to by a used ebike if they know there is some warranty for it.

That’s not capitalism, that’s good service.

Specialized considers it good business. Frame warranty is for life and Transferable for a few more years to a buyer at an estate sale, I guess.
BTW Specialized service is only through your LBS.

 

[FlatSix911]

So I may have found a workaround here.
Why not purchase Velocare? It covers most of the stuff that the "manufacturer" doesn't and it's transferrable.
It's relatively cheap, $105 for 3 years for bikes that cost up to $999. $155 to $2499, and $205 for up to $3999.
It's partnered with numerous LBS locations so you can get service locally.

Bicycle extended warranty | Velocare

velocare.com

I know warranties are sometimes dicey as they will say "this is not covered" or "you did not properly maintain it" but the price is relatively cheap.
I only found one thread about this in 2018. Anyone use Velocare?

Thanks for sharing this information... sounds like a good deal for new bikes (within 30 days of purchase).

FAQ

• Can my bike be serviced by an out-of-network bike shop?​

• Yes, these are the steps that must be taken in order to receive a reimbursement when working with a dealer outside of the Velocare service center network: Take your bike into your local or preferred shop and request a repair estimate Submit the repair estimate to [email protected] and we will...

• What is the value of my Velocare policy?​

• Whether you purchase a 3 or 5 year plan, Velocare will reimburse claims during that time up the original purchase price of your bike.

• Does Velocare cover E-bikes?​

• Yes. Velocare covers everything on an E-bike that is covered on a regular bicycle, including the motor, wiring system, and control panel. Velocare does not cover batteries or the charging system.

• Does Velocare cover labor cost on parts replaced under manufacturer's warranty?​

• No, labor on parts covered by manufacturer's warranty must be covered by the bicycle owner. Velocare will cover labor on parts that are out of manufacturer's warranty and are covered by Velocare.

• How do I make a claim for service?​

• Take your bike to your local Velocare service center and they will take care of everything for you. If you need help selecting a service location, you can contact customer service at [email protected] or call us at 760-313-3393 (Business hours: Monday-Friday 9:00 AM - 6:00 PM EST/EDT).

• What happens if I want to cancel my Velocare plan?​

• Visit your Velocare dealer to request a cancellation and prorated reimbursement. If you encounter any issues or questions please don’t hesitate to call your Velocare representative at 760-313-3393 or email [email protected].

• I want to upgrade the part that wore out, how do I go about that?​

• Velocare will provide reimbursement value equivalent to the original worn out part. Any upgrades and extended cost must be worked out with your authorized Velocare dealer.

• Can I get my bike serviced at any Velocare location or just the dealer I purchased it from?​

• The bike can be serviced by any Velocare service location, however, if the plan owner is in an area where there are no Velocare dealers, we can make arrangements to get your bike fixed by a local shop.

• What isn't covered by my Velocare policy?​

• Velocare does not cover tires, tubes, brake pads, batteries, or any claims within the first 90 days of ownership. Also no claims may be made on issues due to accidental damage or lack of maintenance. Frames are always covered by the manufacturer warranty.

• Is a Velocare policy transferable with the bike?​

• Yes, the purchaser has 15 days to register with Velocare as the new owner of the bicycle. Email a proof of purchase provided by the seller and all contact information for the new owner to [email protected].

• Can I purchase Velocare for a bike I already own?​

• Yes. You may purchase a Velocare policy on any bike as long as it was purchased new within the last 30 days. Show your receipt to any Velocare dealer for proof.

 

[Art Deco]

First a question, then a comment: What is the dollar or percentage amount a manufacturer puts in the cost of their bikes when formulating their retail price?

Now my 2 cents: I totally think manufactures know the nature of the beast with ebikes. They are nothing more than a large number of semi complicated electrified moving parts, manufactured overseas, that they the seller never even puts a hand or eye on. No matter how you look at it, these bikes are doomed for some amount of failure and these bike companies KNOW that! They would be crazy to offer a transferable warranty. They don't need the hassle no matter how much good PR it would possibly bring. IMO, the ebike market (especially the lower end models) have gotten so diluted with new start-up companies, they are producing bikes with the business model of more is better.
Sorry to generalize but I can see the scenario of a couple of friends getting together to have a beer or SOMETHING (???), see an ebike wiz by and look at each other and say, wow, let's start a company..... The buying frenzy that presently exists in this sector, really fuels these existing and start-up companies. Yes, I know there are several really good companies in this market but even they are forced to push the envelope because of all of the competition.
Ok, more like 4 cents worth...

two cents plus inflation.and a pretty good rant for that

 

[BigNerd]

I think those prices are based on acoustic bikes, no?

I believe it's for ebikes too.

 

[Alaskan]

Ah ok, that's a fair point, and an interesting suggestion, especially if there's a warranty transfer fee (2-5% of bike value ?)

One barrier I've usually heard to transferable warranties is that manufacturers don't know what the previous owner did. Hard to say if this is real or just an excuse.

However, you could work out an agreement with the used bike buyer to simply do warranty claims yourself, and that the bike would be 'on loan' to the bike buyer for the duration of the original warranty. It's not even that hard since everything is remote anyway. There's still a risk for the used bike buyer, because you could just ignore him when he asks you to make a warranty claim.

All that said, brands have affiliate programs to let you try out the bike from current owners. They want to minimize returns anyway unless they're defective bikes, and then of course it should just be returned.

That is just plain dishonest and a fraud.