DaveMatthews
Well-Known Member
Interesting, and odd... cheers!
What assist levels do you usually use on e-road bikes?
- Thread starter Katrina92
- Start date
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
The reason is Shimano has never accepted anything above Class 1 or 32 km/h while Yamaha had no issue with Class 3 (only in the U.S.) I guess.
jabberwocky
Well-Known Member
Giant rebranded the Shimano EP8 as a Syncdrive (just like they rebrand various Yamaha motors as Syncdrive Plus/Pro/whatever). If its a Shimano the product description says something like "Giant Syncdrive powered by Shimano". AFIAK no US spec Revolts did Shimano motors, but they've used them in Canada and maybe some countries in Europe?
BlackHand
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Western WA
I think this is largely true - roadies have been conditioned for years, decades really, that less is more. It's no wonder that they are hesitant to think that more can indeed be more.
I think the brands are seeing better adoption in the gravel segment with slightly heavier more powerful bikes (Fazua, TQ, Bosch SX, SL2) The full power road format is pretty much superceded by the new light (but not super light) bikes. The SL bikes are largely aimed at cyclists who may not appreciate the benefits or may worry (like you) that the lightest ebikes don't have enough grunt to justify switching.
I can't tell you if the X20 is powerful enough for you, but to your original question on my full power Bulls Desert Falcon I mostly stay in Eco which is 60% assistance. I actually wish the lowest mode was 30-40% or so. ECO has been enough to get up a 28% hill. Very little need for anything over Tour mode which is handy if you are trying to maintain class 3 speeds, like on a commute.
Last weekend's ride: 43.5 miles, 2800ft ele., roughly 220wh used from the battery. Bike weighs a bit over 40lbs and I'm 140, so about the same as you and the Scott ebike would be., but still an apples to oranges comparison.
PedalUma
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Petaluma, CA
The last X20 I rode, you could put it in low gear at full power, pedal with zero effort at a cadinene off 10 and it would top out at a full speed of 15.3 mph and take a crap there and the battery died at 12.2 miles. People were kitting out in spandex to do that.
Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
I have looked to the Giant U.S. site. It is the Defy Advanced E+ Elite AR offered at the moment. The hub drive motor is named SyncDrive Move and it has 25 Nm. The battery is 400 Wh to save the bike weight. Of course Giant juggles the torque number and says it is 75 Nm effective, which as we already know is meaningless.
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www.giant-bicycles.com
Defy Advanced E+ Elite AR (2025) | Endurance bike | Giant Bicycles US
www.giant-bicycles.com
This one continues to garner strong reviews. All carbon frame, forks, one piece handlebar and stem & seat post for a total weight of 28lbs/12.7kg. Either in a road or gravel configuration. It's not for sale in Europe unfortunately and probably never will with the great orange one's new tariff regime and as a US brand I'm not familiar with Ride1UP except on here. But I have to say hats off for producing such a good looking well built bike at that price. It does raise a question as to why other brands cannot do similar bikes at this low price?
PCeBiker
No-Hands No-Pedaling No-Credentials
- Region
- Canada
Katrina, please Ignore PCebiker. He is even not pedalling his e-motorcycle
@Katrina92
I'm not trying to convince you to buy a 100 pound e-motorcycle and not pedal, but I do think not having to pedal to get to work should be considered as an option.
I used to pedal my Raliegh 10-speed to work, then I got a motorcycle and used that to get to work.
I didn't enjoy my trip to work regardless of how I got there.
I just needed to get to work and the only advantage of the motorcycle was that it was faster.
If it was raining out I struggled to get to work on time because I had to bring a change of clothes and change before work.
I think a trip to your LBS for a few test rides of different bikes is a good idea.
Make sure that you arrive at the LBS first thing in the morning when it's cold and raining out for your test rides.
Don't have your morning coffee, so you're half asleep and being hungover is even better.
Then test ride a few bikes on 10% hills without pedaling, because knowing that your commuter bike can get you to work when you're late or you're simply Not in the mood is important.
If the LBS says that the e-bike you like can't be ridden in the rain without pedaling, then find one that can be.
You may not need an ebike that can be ridden in the rain without pedaling, but it's nice to know that it could be and could get you to and from work if the need arises.
I didn't like commuting to work on two wheels whether it was a ten speed, mountain bike, sport motorcycle or street legal dirt bike.
I preferred a car that kept me out of the rain, and had a heater.
Base
Bike nerd
- Region
- Europe
- City
- in the exact center of the Netherlands
^ in contrast to above
for the office commute I could take the direct route by bike which would be like 12 a 13 minutes. By car it would take at least 25 minutes. I ride to the office and back home with a d-tour through the fields and forests so I can wine down from the daily hectic and usually ride for roughly an hour. That on either an analogue traditional bike but mostly on some sort of e-bike (EN15194, so a bicycle with support). So indeed that is causing me to set the alarm clock a tad bit earlier but it gives me more time on the bike (2 hours a day typically) which is healthy and helps for the mental health. Also I do not go there in lycra just in the office clothes like every dutchie would do.
Testing at your LBS is always a good idea.
- a friend of mine who is a real bike enthusiast does his commute to work once a week (one day at the office) by bike, route is roughly 90 km one way -
for the office commute I could take the direct route by bike which would be like 12 a 13 minutes. By car it would take at least 25 minutes. I ride to the office and back home with a d-tour through the fields and forests so I can wine down from the daily hectic and usually ride for roughly an hour. That on either an analogue traditional bike but mostly on some sort of e-bike (EN15194, so a bicycle with support). So indeed that is causing me to set the alarm clock a tad bit earlier but it gives me more time on the bike (2 hours a day typically) which is healthy and helps for the mental health. Also I do not go there in lycra just in the office clothes like every dutchie would do.
Testing at your LBS is always a good idea.
- a friend of mine who is a real bike enthusiast does his commute to work once a week (one day at the office) by bike, route is roughly 90 km one way -
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jabberwocky
Well-Known Member
Honestly its a pretty good deal if you want a light, low assist ebike. Sram rival groupset with hydraulic discs, carbon frame and fork, offered in two reasonably specced builds (road with narrower bars and rims and road tires, or gravel with flared bars and wider rims and tires). Its hub motor, no idea on the quality of their motor system and lots of generic parts elsewhere, but a decent option if its the sort of bike you want.
I'm sure the wheels are quite heavy, and only two sizes. Their small is a little big for me, generally, though might work with the 90mm stem.
jabberwocky
Well-Known Member
Oof, yeah, I missed that. Light road ebike is definitely something you want decent torque sensing on.
PedalUma
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Petaluma, CA
Another biggie; The battery is not removable and is proprietary. So when it takes a dump you are screwed. There are several things you want in a battery: It must be external and easily removeable. It must have an On/Off switch. It must have a USB port to safely take down the charge and to safely jump the BMS. It must have an aluminum case, not plastic. When the tech changes, you can use any battery you choose by splicing it in. There are other things such as the quality of the cells and BMS. If you are stuck with only one source, that is bad. A lack of access and control, that is bad.
The battery is not removable and is proprietary. So when it takes a dump you are screwed.
Are you reporting from 1995? Half the quality ebikes out there have non removable and proprietary batteries including all the SL lightweight bikes - It allows the manufacturers to control quality and efficiency and so avoid any DIY style fires and get most efficient use. Four and a half year old Vado SL here with proprietary non removal battery still going strong. And for heaven's sake who is going to risk 'splicing in a battery' on a carbon road bike?
I first saw this bike when reviewed by Electric Bike Journal and the lack of torque bothered me, but the reviewer said:
this uses the R1CBC a Current based Cadence sensor. Although not a torque sensor it has a very comfortable pedaling characteristic unlike more generic lesser sophisticated cadence sensors.I wouldn't be surprised to see this bike evolve to get some of the new tech that the Roadster V3 got.
So looking it up, the Roadster V3 has a torque sensor, so wonder why not the Racer1? Cost? Or the fact the Roadster has a different hub motor. Anyway would love to try it and see how the assist delivers.
PCeBiker
No-Hands No-Pedaling No-Credentials
- Region
- Canada
I'm Completely Wiped Out after a 90 km ride, and that's without pedaling.
My two batteries weigh 28 pounds.
I'm thinking @Katrina92 already has a road bike that she loves, and should consider an aluminum option for a commuter ebike.
If bike weight is important, try everything available that's within her weight limit and take it for a test ride.
See what it feels like to pedal unpowered, then see if it will pull itself up a 10% hill without pedaling.
I personally don't like carbon fiber.
It tends to spontaneously fail with no warning.
Aluminum has a better chance of giving some warning before failing.
Steel can scream for attention for months before it fails.
PedalUma
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Petaluma, CA
You also want a non-proprietary charge port, so you are not stuck there either. You are correct all of the high-end bikes at stores have internal proprietary batteries so you are stuck, like having only one source for a toner cartage with no right to repair. Those bikes are nice until they are not. You cannot even change basic settings such as speed or wheel diameter. Then you are forced to get updates which are mostly downloads of your data, so you don't own that either. Any decent eBike mechanic uses a soldering iron. It is true most shops lack basic skills and cannot repair, only swap parts. It is all done through central command. A good splice is not visible and does not have a connector.
I live in the wine country in Nor. Cal. And was in that industry. I will be the first to admit that everyone has different tastes. The same with bikes. I will sell moped throttle bikes or hub-drives, if that is what someone wants. The same with overly priced anemic bikes that users do not control.
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