The Sondors Bike is Unravelling a Bit

[wa5]

They are still saying Green wheels are available... and they are not... some not to happy campers there.. on the f/b page..
Get (1) Sondors eBike for $649. Save big in the final two days.

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Tomorrow is the LAST DAY.
Most affordable eBike EVER! Priced under $650 for a Limited Time. Offer Ends 04/02/15
indiegogo.com

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  Trevor ToneguzziGood to see the green wheels have made a comeback
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    (Link Removed - No Longer Exists)They are not available, they said they were. Then after you pay, they are not an option.
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    Trevor ToneguzziWell, that seems a little dishonest, doesn't it? I would think that if something were not available, they would make a large announcement and alter the website, and take the item out of advertising as in the picture above...
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  Nick HullGreen wheels? That's just plain ugly! We want orange!
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    Trevor ToneguzziOrange not available with black frame, what gives.. but at least the green gives more choice, will look cool with black frame.
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  (Link Removed - No Longer Exists)THE GREEN WHEELS ARE NOT BACK. You do not have that option, they say you do (I specifically asked three times) They said YES 'the colors are interchangeable' on the frames. You pay the money, then are only given a few choices. The green are not available. Not sure why they keep saying and posting that they are. If you want green don't buy this bike.
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[George S.]

Sondors is now going to use Samsung cells in the Sondstorm.

I've been trying to track down what Samsung cells people are using in these cheaper ebike packs. People are saying Samsung cells on packs that are around $300. Sondors offers the spares around $200. That's not much per cell.

Credit where credit is due. I hope.

 

[wa5]

Theodore Voltaire I like the cut of your jib....
(From IGG / Sondors page)
Theodore Voltaire
9 minutes ago
(QUOTE) Philip Hillis 3 hours ago
In consideration of how slim the profit margin probably is after averaging out the $499 bikes with the $649 bikes I will gladly offer any left over shipping for Storm to keep with my blessing. The man deserves to make a profit. (END)…. Right there ladies & Gents, if you needed any proof this bloke is a Shill, here it is.

(END Quote)..

Couldn't have said it any better myself........

 

[pxpaulx]

That post on the sondors comment section gave me a laugh too. I think sondors will make out quite alright even if they take the back breaking step of not pocketing the padded cost people have paid for shipping.

They should absolutely, unequivocally refund the shipping overage payments to their thousands of buyers (whatever that amount is). They said they would do as much, if they try to hide their true cost to ship someone will find out what it was and they will have another kind of storm on their hands, no doubt!

 

[PowerMe]

 

[pxpaulx]

Theodore Voltaire I like the cut of your jib....
(From IGG / Sondors page)
Theodore Voltaire
9 minutes ago
(QUOTE) Philip Hillis 3 hours ago
In consideration of how slim the profit margin probably is after averaging out the $499 bikes with the $649 bikes I will gladly offer any left over shipping for Storm to keep with my blessing. The man deserves to make a profit. (END)…. Right there ladies & Gents, if you needed any proof this bloke is a Shill, here it is.

(END Quote)..

Couldn't have said it any better myself........

Geez - see Mr Hillis' response to that comment? That comment section is worse than any forum I've ever participated on the internet. Honestly, you'd think the campaign owners would step in and address those people already (of course, the droning silence from them appears to ring quite loudly...).

 

[wa5]

"(bike)Nut"... never has there been a more apt username... Freudian slip on phils part perhaps?

 

[flymeaway]

That post on the sondors comment section gave me a laugh too. I think sondors will make out quite alright even if they take the back breaking step of not pocketing the padded cost people have paid for shipping.

They should absolutely, unequivocally refund the shipping overage payments to their thousands of buyers (whatever that amount is). They said they would do as much, if they try to hide their true cost to ship someone will find out what it was and they will have another kind of storm on their hands, no doubt!

Looks (to me) that they are shipping the bike directly from China to each customer. I just started paying attention to this Sondors bike recently and at first assumed that they would be bring container loads of product into the USA. A 40 ft. container from the port of Shanghai to LA would be about $3,000. I couldn't reconcile the outsized shipping charge until I read a Q&A on the gosondors website that says shipping direct to you. The higher shipping cost makes more sense if the bikes are shipped direct from China to the customer.

Court J.

 

[pxpaulx]

Looks (to me) that they are shipping the bike directly from China to each customer. I just started paying attention to this Sondors bike recently and at first assumed that they would be bring container loads of product into the USA. A 40 ft. container from the port of Shanghai to LA would be about $3,000. I couldn't reconcile the outsized shipping charge until I read a Q&A on the gosondors website that says shipping direct to you. The higher shipping cost makes more sense if the bikes are shipped direct from China to the customer.

Court J.

I'm not sure that is the case, at least, it probably wasn't the original plan. The reason I think that is because the Radrover (the newer indiegogo bike, of which I decided to contribute to that campaign) also has a $195 shipping cost - the campaign owner has however detailed the specific expectation of actual pricing for shipping as follows in their campaign details:

Shipping will be based on location and the # of bikes and other perks you have ordered. If you would like to contact us at [email protected] and provide us with your desired order items and your address we can email you a shipping quote! The more bikes that are ordered, the lower the shipping costs will be with quantity discounts with UPS and FedEx. For example if we sell 400 bikes shipping bwill be 10-20% less expensive for everyone. If we sell 1000 bikes shipping will be 20-30% less expensive (this is an estimate based on rate charts). If you are on the West Coast of the U.S. your shipping will likely be around $120-150 while east coast backers will be somewhere between $150-$190 (this is the base rates, the more bikes we sell better deal we will get on shipping and shipping discounts will be applied to backers. (https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/radrover-electric-fat-bike#home - details close to the bottom of the listing).

It can't be a coincidence that they asked for the same initial shipping value for their bikes. Additionally, Radrover is allowing local pickup which would further indicate the bikes are arriving in the US, and the shipping cost is for the US end-to-end shipment cost (though the int'l portion may in both cases be built into the $195/$194 requested payments).

Perhaps the Storm bike has changed their shipping and will be shipping direct from customers - the logistics of handling 2 or 3 containers vs 25 or 30 would be a significant difference, perhaps something they hadn't considered when they set out with their $75,000 initial campaign goal.

 

[flymeaway]

I'm not sure that is the case, at least, it probably wasn't the original plan. The reason I think that is because the Radrover (the newer indiegogo bike, of which I decided to contribute to that campaign) also has a $195 shipping cost -

I just calculated shipping an ebike with a $1,000 declared value from LA/CA to Nashua/NH and the price was $72....how they charge $194 is beyond me??????? Look the cost up here http://www.shipbikes.com/

I think the delivered price is quoted from China, if not $194 is a highly inflated price.

Court J.

 

[pxpaulx]

I just calculated shipping an ebike with a $1,000 declared value from LA/CA to Nashua/NH and the price was $72....how they charge $194 is beyond me??????? Look the cost up here http://www.shipbikes.com/

I think the delivered price is quoted from China, if not $194 is a highly inflated price.

Court J.

It isn't the bike that inflates the cost, it is the battery. Just as an example, when I built up my cart at em3ev.com (this is an int'l example) - all items minus the battery cost $98, however when a battery was added to the kit, the cost jumped to $227 (I do remember that value - it was a lot!). This was a motor/controller/battery kit, not a full bike kit, shipped from Hong Kong. (edit: it looks like the addition of the battery itself adds about $80-90 to the shipping costs after actual weight is removed from the equation)

 

[flymeaway]

It isn't the bike that inflates the cost, it is the battery. Just as an example, when I built up my cart at em3ev.com (this is an int'l example) - all items minus the battery cost $98, however when a battery was added to the kit, the cost jumped to $227 (I do remember that value - it was a lot!). This was a motor/controller/battery kit, not a full bike kit, shipped from Hong Kong. (edit: it looks like the addition of the battery itself adds about $80-90 to the shipping costs after actual weight is removed from the equation)

The price I calculated on their website was for an ebike delivery. Ground delivery of Lithium batteries fall under a different labeling and handling regulation then air delivery.

Yes international delivery standards are different. If you deliver via air it's very expensive, if delivered by ocean freight it's relatively cheap. The $194 delivery charge would be excessive if shipped by ground within the USA.

Court J.

 

[stevenast]

The $194 delivery charge would be excessive if shipped by ground within the USA.

Just another shady way of increasing revenue

 

[flymeaway]

Just another shady way of increasing revenue

Perhaps. I'm not a fan of crowd funded bikes, but the $194 is probably about right for shipping a bike with lithium batteries from China direct to USA customers.

 

[Brambor]

I actually think its not too excessive if it was shipped from Wes coast to east coast for that price.

 

[wa5]

Apparently 50 miles is achievable IF you go at a snails pace and IF you barely use the throttle...

Philip Hillis
12 hours ago


This is how 50 mile range is achieved. Cruising at a normal beach cruiser speed of 8 mph, with light pedal assist you’ll be using approximately 50w of battery power. The battery is 350wh so @ 50w consumption that will take 7 hours to drain the battery completely. 7 hours @ 8 mph = 56 miles range.

Even though most people won’t ride 7 hours, and go 50 miles it doesn’t matter. The claim is honest because less riding time will still work out to 50 miles mathematically.

 

[EULITTLB]

In response to your last email htf can Hillis assess what the drag will be and what the battery consumption will be, the weight of the rider and gradients/road surface will all impact on his assumed 50w per hour battery drain claim.

 

[George S.]

Well, I don't know what it means, but if you go to the Sondors Indiegogo page, Colonel Sondors is no longer part of the team. It's now Agency 2.0 and nothing else, at the top of the page where they put the team. At the bottom there is still a picture of Storm. Hopp disappeared a while back.

 

[EULITTLB]

An associate said to me some time ago that he wondered if he thought Sondors was just a fall guy.......... hmmmmmm

 

[wa5]

Storm is still at the bottom of the page, listed as a co founder, could this just be part of the transition from IGG to Storms own website / company... given that storm has taken part in the campaign up to this point, I'd be very surprised if he left now. it wouldn't make sense.

One would hope that by moving into the drivers seat and hopefully leaving behind the questionable influence of IGG and 2.0. He might become a bit more approachable, and start addressing the concerns of customers and busybodies alike.

funny thing is, Theres enough cultists / true believers in the owners club who would fall all over themselves to handle PR with hardly any imput required from Sonders, I'm a little surprised he hasn't formed a relationship with one of them.. and one of the less extreme supporters (so definitely not Mesers Hillis Choate or Gin) could be an asset to him. One of the more level headed supporters, given the right pictures and some honest time with Storm could, with a pragmatic approach, help to restore confidence. it would have to be somebody who was able to see past the shiny bike itself to the mistakes and downright false statements that have been made, and be willing to address those things honestly and most importantly openly... I cant see it happening though ..