Street vs trail ?

[Mr. Coffee]

I called the local state police barracks yesterday and asked the question. I was told it would be up to the officer to decide whether to issue a citation. Not a definitive answer. I also sent an email to our local TV station which sponsors a local virus related question & answer program. So far, no reply.

My first reaction was, "that's a horrible answer". My second reaction was that it was obvious that nobody knows. So my advice would be (I am not a lawyer):

• Write a letter to the editor of your local paper describing this exchange. Make a copy of the letter and mail it to yourself. Don't open the letter you mail to yourself.
• Ride your bike. Don't be a jerk.
• If you encounter a police officer who tells you to go home, go home.
• If you have an encounter with a police officer who writes you a ticket, go to court. Show the judge your unopened letter (it is okay to open it for the judge).

Chances are in that case the fine will be waived or reduced to a ridiculously small amount. Again, I am not a lawyer but this would show a judge that you made a good-faith effort to figure out what the rules were and to obey them.

I think things are extremely confusing everywhere right now. Where I live:

• The road traffic is about 5 percent of normal.
• State parks, Sno-parks, and all state land are currently closed to public access. But this seems to be almost universally ignored.
  Nearly all rail-trails in the WA are administered by the state.
• USFS land is open, but all developed recreation sites (campgrounds, trailheads, &c) are closed. So you can in theory go on a hike or bike but you must park a discreet distance from the trailhead.
  In a lot of other places USFS land is currently closed to the public.
• National Parks are closed.

So I just ride my damned bike.

 

[kathik]

I called the local state police barracks yesterday and asked the question. I was told it would be up to the officer to decide whether to issue a citation. Not a definitive answer. I also sent an email to our local TV station which sponsors a local virus related question & answer program. So far, no reply.

Thanks for your advice though.

This coming Sunday is supposed to be nice. I am throwing my bike on the back of my car and going to drive to the Stony Valley rail trail on the Gold Mine Road side. Nobody ever goes there except for a couple of miles on each end. I have not been out since last fall and I am going crazy!

 

[Rick53]

Sounds like Churches are going to Be Open to do Drive in Easter : Praise the Lord some American Sanity

 

[6zfshdb]

I would just go. If a LEO is anal enough to issue a citation, thinking most judges have a lot more common sense - especially as you sought advice on the topic and received no straight answer (double talk). They'll dismiss it.

I was out riding a local trail on Tuesday along with a lot of other people. No one hassled me so I will likely continue to ride until specifically told otherwise. It just bothers me that no one can give me a straight answer on these conflicting regulations.

I'm also curious about similar regulations in other parts of the country.

 

[harryS]

Over in another bike forum, they're worried about the risk of aerosol transfer of virus particles, arguing that if you can smell someone's perfume after they pass, you can inhale a virus. Well, only if they sneezed, in my opinion.

I don't feel lucky, so that's why I'm off the bike paths. We pass a lot of people with only 3 feet distance, and sometimes we're stuck behind slow parties waiting for a clear passing lane. (It's that crowded).

 

[AHicks]

Over in another bike forum, they're worried about the risk of aerosol transfer of virus particles, arguing that if you can smell someone's perfume after they pass, you can inhale a virus. Well, only if they sneezed, in my opinion.

I don't feel lucky, so that's why I'm off the bike paths. We pass a lot of people with only 3 feet distance, and sometimes we're stuck behind slow parties waiting for a clear passing lane. (It's that crowded).

Not sure I'd be happy riding in those conditions either....

 

[6zfshdb]

Ok, I finally got an answer to my question as to whether it is permitted to drive to a park or trailhead under Covid19 driving restrictions. I sent the question via email to WNEP, one of our local TV stations here in northeast PA. They forwarded my question to Dr. Rachel Levine, the PA. surgeon general, who is responsible for instituting Covid19 restrictions. Her response was, it is NOT permissible to drive any significant distance to a state park for exercise. She did indicate however that a short drive would be ok. Not the answer I was hoping for but at least the question is open to interpretation as to what "significant" means.

WNEP did a news piece on the subject on their Saturday morning broadcast:

Local News, Weather and Sports from WNEP Northeastern and Central Pennsylvania | wnep.com

Download the WNEP app on your mobile device to get personalized weather. Text APP to (570) 826-1616.

www.wnep.com

 

[AHicks]

Your answer is typical coming from a govt. official. It's like they must graduate from an advanced double talk course prior to taking office.

Leaving me with 2 questions. How far is it to the park, and are you going to ride/drive to get there? You know what my answer would be....

 

[6zfshdb]

Your answer is typical coming from a govt. official. It's like they must graduate from an advanced double talk course prior to taking office.

Leaving me with 2 questions. How far is it to the park, and are you going to ride/drive to get there? You know what my answer would be....

I drive from 10 to 40 miles to do day trip rides on my "local" trails. Going by bike isn't safe or practical due to the high speed highways involved. My "interpretation" is, these are short drives by my standards and I'm going to keep riding.

According to Dr. Levine, the main reason for the driving ban is to keep people out of gas stations where they might give or get the virus from employees during the payment process or in rest rooms. I have a 40 gallon tank in my pickup which I filled due to the relatively low gas prices before the driving ban went into effect. I should easily be able to drive to the parks for the next month without needing gas. Even if I did, I use "pay at the pump" via credit card. I wear disposable gloves while fueling and don't get near anyone or use the rest room.

Even though I may technically be in violation of the driving ban, my conscience is clear since I've mitigated the possibility of giving or getting the virus.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

Based on observation's from yesterdays ride, I'm guessing USFS roads will also be closed very soon. Relatively few trails are open because most of them are full of snow, but the few I passed had too many cars parked nearby to be safe or prudent to visit.

Advice here in WA is if you have to drive to where you want to take a walk or ride your bike, it is too far away.

 

[Sierratim]

Based on observation's from yesterdays ride, I'm guessing USFS roads will also be closed very soon. Relatively few trails are open because most of them are full of snow, but the few I passed had too many cars parked nearby to be safe or prudent to visit.

Advice here in WA is if you have to drive to where you want to take a walk or ride your bike, it is too far away.

California's stay at home order allows local outdoor recreation. Newscasters report that the highway patrol is stopping people for 'lectures' about this rule when they are spotted on the empty highways with rec gear (bikes, kayaks, etc). Even before this our last out of the area trail ride found so many people on the trail as to be impossible to follow the social distancing rule. Combine this with the inexerienced cyclists and it wasn't safe; a teen pulled out in front me unable to hear my bell and warning shouts due to his stereo ear-buds. Just missed him.

We're confining our riding to the local streets and back country roads that we can ebike to from home for the duration.

 

[Cowlitz]

There are no bike trails here unless I drive 40 miles to ride 7 miles total. I notice a bit of a decrease in traffic, but Friday afternoon and the weekends are just about the same for the road near my house. I suspect the kids are celebrating the nicer weather by driving around--fast. Speed of cars and trucks has increased. I don't see as many cops about either.

I will continue to do like normal--ride on the roads.

 

[6zfshdb]

Unfortunately, there are no trails within 10 miles nor are there any local streets to ride near where I live. My bike is like a neon sign when carried on my vehicle and it's only a matter of time before I'm cited for unnecessary driving. So far, I've been lucky but I'm afraid it won't last if this goes on much longer. I'm told the fine could be as much as $500!

 

[Art Deco]

6zfshdb (what an easy user name!)
I am also from PA, and going nuts. Thanks for your post and I believe you are correct about 1. being legal driving to your closest open trail, and 2. being stopped and lectured by highway patrol anyway.

Don't argue with them. The minimum ticket in PA. is around 3 or 400 hundred dollars because of fees added to the ticket. How do I know that? Yep.

 

[pmcdonald]

Over in another bike forum, they're worried about the risk of aerosol transfer of virus particles, arguing that if you can smell someone's perfume after they pass, you can inhale a virus. Well, only if they sneezed, in my opinion.

I don't feel lucky, so that's why I'm off the bike paths. We pass a lot of people with only 3 feet distance, and sometimes we're stuck behind slow parties waiting for a clear passing lane. (It's that crowded).

Alas, it doesn't take a sneeze to transmit, nor is particle travel limited to a 3-6 foot radius. There's a reasonably concise and interesting summary of the research here:

Radiolab: Dispatch 4: Six Feet https://www.wnycstudios.org/podcasts/radiolab/articles/dispatch-4-six-feet