Sondors Fact Finding. Due Diligence. Scrutiny.

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3 hours ago
Good news! U.S. Customs is going A LOT smoother and quicker than initially thought. In fact, UPS tracking IDs are already starting to be assigned and emailed out to backers for the first few containers of Black Frame/Yellow Rims Sondors electric bikes that have made it through.

Remember to share when you get your tracking ID on social media and use hashtag #GoSondors. Happy Friday!
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Storm Sondors
 
For balance I wonder if and when EU backers or those in Switzerland will receive their bikes, and in the case of EU backers, a bill for £600?
 
One nice Chappie feels that if and when he receives his ebike it will totally destroy the concerns I have and others share - so he posted his UPS confirmation - 89lbs shipping weight #raisedeyebrows

Just looked it up on GoSondors - The bike weighs approximately 49lbs without the battery.

ok so battery and charger and 2.5lbs of packing weigh 40lbs?

Good luck lifting that one into the back of a van.
 
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@EULITTLB said:

For balance I wonder if and when EU backers or those in Switzerland will receive their bikes, and in the case of EU backers, a bill for £600?

It's not a good sign that Wave on IGG had to cancel their EU orders when they couldn't figure out how to get the bikes into the EU. Their bike was pretty high power, though. Hope for the best, but it won't be easy.

You've noticed, maybe, that IGG's new hot project is bailing out Greece.

People seem to feel the EU is not working, economically. Who knows what Britain will do. I don't know why the US wants to follow European ebike regs. Maybe because the companies that make a lot of money come out of Europe. Still, Sondors is left following the rules that exist.
 
Looks like the normal customs delay with a huge shipment of lithium batteries.. And the Sondors update stated tracking numbers are being sent out to the new owners for the first shipment. FB folks are posting their notifcations..lol Delivery should occur within the next week.

I'm really enjoying the trolls inventing new non existent issues only to be humiliated once again by Storm's remarkable performance as a first time cf project leader and creator.

Sondors has created the new price point for a desirable and popular electric bike that doesn't look like something a senior would own.. All those middlemen and retailer counting on fat margins selling $4000 to $7000 will be in for some belt tightening.

I love this country.. We always find a better cheaper way to mass market products.. even if they are born overseas!
 
One nice Chappie feels that if and when he receives his ebike it will totally destroy the concerns I have and others share - so he posted his UPS confirmation - 89lbs shipping weight #raisedeyebrows

Just looked it up on GoSondors - The bike weighs approximately 49lbs without the battery.

ok so battery and charger and 2.5lbs of packing weigh 40lbs?

Good luck lifting that one into the back of a van.

FYI the dimensional weight is 89lbs. It is not the actual weight of the box. All my bikes get a dim weight of 75lbs even though they weigh about 30lbs.

Thanks,
Yan
 
@EULITTLB said:

For balance I wonder if and when EU backers or those in Switzerland will receive their bikes, and in the case of EU backers, a bill for £600?

It's not a good sign that Wave on IGG had to cancel their EU orders when they couldn't figure out how to get the bikes into the EU. Their bike was pretty high power, though. Hope for the best, but it won't be easy.

You've noticed, maybe, that IGG's new hot project is bailing out Greece.

People seem to feel the EU is not working, economically. Who knows what Britain will do. I don't know why the US wants to follow European ebike regs. Maybe because the companies that make a lot of money come out of Europe. Still, Sondors is left following the rules that exist.

This may be difficult. I distributed my bikes in the UK and it was costly 20+% VAT+ 50+% anti dumping duty for Chinese bikes....really made it difficult to compete. I ended up paying just as much in duty and shipping as I did for the bikes. Now I ship bikes from the USA direct to Europe, it's cheaper.

Thanks,
Yan
 
I'm really enjoying the trolls inventing new non existent issues only to be humiliated once again by Storm's remarkable performance as a first time cf project leader and creator.

Next it will be complaints about the color of the box used for shipping and how that's so unacceptable and something must be done about that to save all the funders.
 
This may be difficult. I distributed my bikes in the UK and it was costly 20+% VAT+ 50+% anti dumping duty for Chinese bikes....really made it difficult to compete. I ended up paying just as much in duty and shipping as I did for the bikes. Now I ship bikes from the USA direct to Europe, it's cheaper.

Thanks,
Yan

Yan,

I owned one of your bikes for quite few years. It was a very handy little thing. I finally decided all my bikes were going to have motors. Maybe you can come up with something? :)

George
 

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Yan,

I owned one of your bikes for quite few years. It was a very handy little thing. I finally decided all my bikes were going to have motors. Maybe you can come up with something? :)

George

Thanks for the kind words. I would like to launch an electric bike in 2016. I was planning on supplying someone with bikes for an ebike conversion, but that does not look so promising anymore. I am considering a crowd funding option.

Honestly I think Storm has done a horrible job thus far and has instilled fear ( of being ripped off ) in a large number of customers...hence the infighting. There is no reason in this fear. I believe all of you deserve much better.

Thanks,
Yan
 
and has instilled fear ( of being ripped off ) in a large number of customers

The fear being instilled is from a few people who decided that this particular campaign is the absolute bane of their existence. I'm not saying the campaign is good or even that the eventual product will be any good, as it's just a cheaply made Chinese bike, but the level of fear and paranoia you reference is really a few people with a lot of non de plumes who became absolutely obsessed with this campaign as there were some others obsessed on the other side, touting this bike. The obsessed naysayers went on their own campaign to spread FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt). The obsessed Sonders-fans did everything they could to drown out the negative propaganda and continue spreading their own. Cray-Cray met Crowdfunding and the results are before you.
 
The fear being instilled is from a few people who decided that this particular campaign is the absolute bane of their existence. I'm not saying the campaign is good or even that the eventual product will be any good, as it's just a cheaply made Chinese bike, but the level of fear and paranoia you reference is really a few people with a lot of non de plumes who became absolutely obsessed with this campaign as there were some others obsessed on the other side, touting this bike. The obsessed naysayers went on their own campaign to spread FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt). The obsessed Sonders-fans did everything they could to drown out the negative propaganda and continue spreading their own. Cray-Cray met Crowdfunding and the results are before you.

The fear is actually somewhat logical. Storm knows nothing about bikes. He has no idea what a frame size means ( EBR video test at the beach ) and it is incorrectly stated on the website...hence his support staff have no idea either. His claims have been inconsistent at best, and many of his pictures and videos are staged. I feel bad seeing this.....that a customer has to buy something from a company that has no expertise in the field and has been deceitful on a consistent basis.

FYI there are low end factories in China that charge under $50 for completely assembled bikes ( I do not use them ). So there is lots of profit to be made by an honest business importing low end products. Even so, I find it highly likely that this campaign will not end well for a solid percentage of customers.

Thanks,
Yan
 
I feel bad seeing this.....that a customer has to buy something from a company that has no expertise in the field and has been deceitful on a consistent basis.

Who *had* to buy this bike or contribute to this campaign? Why are the adults who chose to fund this campaign thought of like mentally incapacitated minors who need to be protected from themselves? I really don't understand this. Crowdfunding is a risk, it says so right in the T&Cs. Most people jumped on the bandwagon based on word-of-mouth. But I guarantee everyone who ponied up at least $1 had to sign on the dotted line (so to speak) that they read and understood the terms of this campaign and IGG.
 
Who *had* to buy this bike or contribute to this campaign? Why are the adults who chose to fund this campaign thought of like mentally incapacitated minors who need to be protected from themselves? I really don't understand this. Crowdfunding is a risk, it says so right in the T&Cs. Most people jumped on the bandwagon based on word-of-mouth. But I guarantee everyone who ponied up at least $1 had to sign on the dotted line (so to speak) that they read and understood the terms of this campaign and IGG.

ok I still feel bad.

Thanks,
Yan
 
ok I still feel bad.

Thanks,
Yan

i can understand your position, personally i will only feel bad if people dont get what they purchased. whether what they purchased is any good in terms of quality is as much on the buyer as it is on the seller.

i dont doubt that this bike can be made, and cheaply. i did argue from the start it makes less than zero sense as a fat bike, was a dumb idea from conception and will be a dog to ride, good luck getting home if the battery dies! none of that however makes me care enough to want it all to fail, and that is what it seems a few here would like to see.
 
Next it will be complaints about the color of the box used for shipping and how that's so unacceptable and something must be done about that to save all the funders.

Too busy concentrating on blatantly false specs, Sondors previous and upcoming fraud related court cases, Sondors passing $190k in bad cheques, not answering questions as he was contractually required to do, The five hundred plus thousand dollars he owes agency 2.0 and how that will impact on customers bikes (both quality and delivery), to worry about the boxes, they certainly look sturdy enough.

The fear being instilled is from a few people who decided that this particular campaign is the absolute bane of their existence. I'm not saying the campaign is good or even that the eventual product will be any good, as it's just a cheaply made Chinese bike, but the level of fear and paranoia you reference is really a few people with a lot of non de plumes who became absolutely obsessed with this campaign as there were some others obsessed on the other side, touting this bike. The obsessed naysayers went on their own campaign to spread FUD (fear, uncertainty, doubt). The obsessed Sonders-fans did everything they could to drown out the negative propaganda and continue spreading their own. Cray-Cray met Crowdfunding and the results are before you.

I post under wa5 almost everywhere, except on facebook where I use my real name, Trevor Toneguzzi, the only exception to that is on the IGG site, wher I posted under "Theodore Voltaire" simply to piss Phillip Hillis off, because he had called me a liar amongst other things. Whats your real name btw?

Obsessed with this campaign? Perhaps, but no more than you seem to be obsessed with my (and a few others) interest in it.

Who *had* to buy this bike or contribute to this campaign? Why are the adults who chose to fund this campaign thought of like mentally incapacitated minors who need to be protected from themselves? I really don't understand this. Crowdfunding is a risk, it says so right in the T&Cs. Most people jumped on the bandwagon based on word-of-mouth. But I guarantee everyone who ponied up at least $1 had to sign on the dotted line (so to speak) that they read and understood the terms of this campaign and IGG.

I know some very clever people who would fall for the "wallet inspector" (its a Simpsons thing).. I also know a few people who never finished high school who are true geniuses, we all have different strengths and weaknesses, judging by some of the comments by funders, they obviously didn't know what they were getting into, as to reading all the terms and conditions each time you click "yes" on the web, seriously, does anybody do that?

Things like Ivars / Storms fraud case and subsequent name change are not something people would pick up on by simply visiting the IGG site.. so I tried to let them know.
Why do I feel the need to warn people who you feel should know better, because I try to be a decent person and do unto others, I'd hope that people would similarly warn me if I were walking into something that wasn't kosher, dangerous or somehow not good for me.

I'm here because I don't like shysters, fraudsters, cheats, who prey on those who they feel they can easily fleece. why exactly are you here?
 
@wa5 please dont start with the whats your real name, and why are you really here bits with regular forum members. that line of questioning is going to lead you down the exact same path the crazy supporters went down around here. honestly, we are just a bit tired of the constant barrage, mostly because there are no longer the hardcore trolls around with which you are even arguing against!

at this point next to nobody is buying the bike, and people who decided they want their money back are going down that road i am sure. there just doesnt seem to be anything left for the righteous and good patrol to be in full in your face mode at this point. you are probably better off waiting for some real i told you so moments when the bikes start arriving to backers.
 
The fear is actually somewhat logical. Storm knows nothing about bikes. He has no idea what a frame size means ( EBR video test at the beach ) and it is incorrectly stated on the website...hence his support staff have no idea either. His claims have been inconsistent at best, and many of his pictures and videos are staged. I feel bad seeing this.....that a customer has to buy something from a company that has no expertise in the field and has been deceitful on a consistent basis.

FYI there are low end factories in China that charge under $50 for completely assembled bikes ( I do not use them ). So there is lots of profit to be made by an honest business importing low end products. Even so, I find it highly likely that this campaign will not end well for a solid percentage of customers.

Thanks,
Yan

Lets say that 100% of the bikes are delivered and are of reasonably good quality;

--Product liability insurance? Where is it
--Post sales support? Where is it

--Will there be a company remaining to support a brand? Unlikely, given the lawsuit and the preexisting track record.

This is a pump and dump at best.
 
Lets say that 100% of the bikes are delivered and are of reasonably good quality;

--Product liability insurance? Where is it
--Post sales support? Where is it

--Will there be a company remaining to support a brand? Unlikely, given the lawsuit and the preexisting track record.

This is a pump and dump at best.

Then the buyers will be happy. These bikes were bought through a middle man and get no support, direct from China. That is what was paid for, and what they are getting. Those who expect the same support as their lbs will be out of luck.

That is what you get for five hundred bucks.
 
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