Short E-Bike Warranties: Are They A Problem?

[Gordon71]

So here you are, again, and here I am again, calling you out regarding your thoughts on warranties. There's nothing baffling to it in my mind. Why would I want to spend the time/frustration required to wade through all the BS and jump through the necessary hoops to get warranty on an inexpensive part? Or a labor operation I can complete in less time than it takes you to even contact whoever you need to talk with? Why would I insist my bike be put in line, possibly for weeks, to get something repaired, just because it's "under warranty"? The reason somebody might subject themselves to this is what I find baffling! For me, even if I was absolutely clueless, it would make MUCH more sense to at least attempt to learn enough to allow me to fix it myself...... if for no other reason than to justify the fact your bike is going to be in line to be worked on rather than under your butt being enjoyed. That's baffling.....

And representative responses? Really?

I have to agree. I knew pretty much nothing about bike repair/maintenance when I bought my Rover but did at least do enough research and watched enough videos to know that I could probably do it. I also joined this forum and have asked a lot of questions and gotten a lot of good advice. I bought my bike in Apr. 2020 in the middle of a pandemic. The only bike shop that sold Ebikes within a couple hundred miles of where I lived was about 40 miles away and sold Pedego brand but was also closed due to covid. Now if I had bought one of their bikes which is located in a summer tourist place called Bar Harbor,Maine and needed service I would have to travel 40 miles probably in the summer which would have probably taken me a couple of hours,left it there for who knows how long,and then go back and get it. On top of which I would have paid a lot more for a bike that was no better than the one I bought on line.

 

[Asher]

So here you are, again, and here I am again, calling you out regarding your thoughts on warranties. There's nothing baffling to it in my mind. Why would I want to spend the time/frustration required to wade through all the BS and jump through the necessary hoops to get warranty on an inexpensive part? Or a labor operation I can complete in less time than it takes you to even contact whoever you need to talk with? Why would I insist my bike be put in line, possibly for weeks, to get something repaired, just because it's "under warranty"? The reason somebody might subject themselves to this is what I find baffling! For me, even if I was absolutely clueless, it would make MUCH more sense to at least attempt to learn enough to allow me to fix it myself...... if for no other reason than to justify the fact your bike is going to be in line to be worked on rather than under your butt being enjoyed. That's baffling.....

And representative responses? Really?

Even name brand analog bikes typically have a 1 year warranty on drivetrain parts, so the issue is not about warranties on your derailleur or spokes. It's about frame and electric drivetrain parts. I agree the benefit is tenuous for most mechanical parts, especially because these parts are already so reliable, because they have been made in massive quantities for years by experienced companies, and they rarely cost much.

Oh, and there is one analog part that does constitute an expensive failure - the wheel, if you have high end wheels. And carbon wheels increasingly have lifetime warranties. https://www.bikemag.com/gear/components/wheels/in-deep-no-questions-asked/

So either these wheel companies know their customers, and that their customers value long warranties... Or they are making a huge mistake' and needlessly offering something their customers don't care about. Which one is it @AHicks?

 

[AHicks]

So either these wheel companies know their customers, and that their customers value long warranties... Or they are making a huge mistake' and needlessly offering something their customers don't care about. Which one is it @AHicks?

On the bold, I think they're betting on the odds of having much in the way of issues. Clear to me they're offering something they feel safe not many will be taking them up on?

 

[Widgets]

Who doesn't want the longest/best warranty on anything?

Think of it this way. The repairs under warranty are not free. The manufacturer will estimate their cost for proving the warranty and factor that into the purchase price. In effect you are paying for the 'average cost of warranty repairs, regardless of whether you need them. It is a gamble for them and for you. If the bike has few/no problems, you paid too much for repairs you did not need/use. If the bike is a lemon, you made a deal on the repairs. I suspect many in this latter situation will be unhappy with the lack of reliability of their bike and ditch it, instead of celebrating that they have a long warranty on their bike and the repairs are covered.

 

[Asher]

Think of it this way. The repairs under warranty are not free. The manufacturer will estimate their cost for proving the warranty and factor that into the purchase price. In effect you are paying for the 'average cost of warranty repairs, regardless of whether you need them. It is a gamble for them and for you. If the bike has few/no problems, you paid too much for repairs you did not need/use. If the bike is a lemon, you made a deal on the repairs. I suspect many in this latter situation will be unhappy with the lack of reliability of their bike and ditch it, instead of celebrating that they have a long warranty on their bike and the repairs are covered.

I think plenty of people will try to use the bike as long as the warranty is getting serviced, and then consider selling it if the issues seem likely to persist when the warranty expires.

But really the main benefit of the warranty is that it incentivizes the manufacturer to NOT cut corners, to design a product that is durable so they won't have to pay a fortune in warrantied repairs. History is littered with manufacturing and construction where a couple bucks were saved in the short run, followed by huge property damages or even lives lost. Therefore, the warranty becomes more than just a cost/benefit probability calculus, it influences product design, especially at companies that have been around a few years to encounter long term reliability issues.

A manufacturers warranty can be bad for consumers if it somehow encourages irresponsible, exceptionally destructive behavior beyond the product's intended capabilities, because then you're paying for someone else breaking their bike doing something unintended by the maker. But this can mostly be addressed through tailoring the warranty to the product, restricting the warranty to sanctioned uses, etc.

 

[AHicks]

I think plenty of people will try to use the bike as long as the warranty is getting serviced, and then consider selling it if the issues seem likely to persist when the warranty expires.

But really the main benefit of the warranty is that it incentivizes the manufacturer to NOT cut corners, to design a product that is durable so they won't have to pay a fortune in warrantied repairs. History is littered with manufacturing and construction where a couple bucks were saved in the short run, followed by huge property damages or even lives lost. Therefore, the warranty becomes more than just a cost/benefit probability calculus, it influences product design, especially at companies that have been around a few years to encounter long term reliability issues.

A manufacturers warranty can be bad for consumers if it somehow encourages irresponsible, exceptionally destructive behavior beyond the product's intended capabilities, because then you're paying for someone else breaking their bike doing something unintended by the maker. But this can mostly be addressed through tailoring the warranty to the product, restricting the warranty to sanctioned uses, etc.

On that my friend, we can agree.

 

[BlackHand]

I'm curious if anyone has had an opportunity to make use of the extended warranty that some credit cards offer on purchases?

In theory I have an extra year warranty on my bike through the card I paid with. In reality, I think its doubtful the claim would be approved as they exclude motorized devices( most ebikes are not legally motorized) and consumables like batteries (even though the batteries are rechargeable and should clearly have a lifespan longer than the warranty period).

 

[Widgets]

It all depends. I agree with the hopes that manufacturers will be responsible, but I have seen products where a large margin to cover expected warranty repairs was added to the price. This extra cost elevated the product to appear premium and it had a longer warranty than the peer premium products. (See Curtis Mathes televisions)

I would prefer for the manufacturer charge a higher price for premium components vs funding a repair department. Our job as consumers is to do our research to try to determine which approach the manufacturer is taking.

 

[Gordon71]

It all depends. I agree with the hopes that manufacturers will be responsible, but I have seen products where a large margin to cover expected warranty repairs was added to the price. This extra cost elevated the product to appear premium and it had a longer warranty than the peer premium products. (See Curtis Mathes televisions)

I would prefer for the manufacturer charge a higher price for premium components vs funding a repair department. Our job as consumers is to do our research to try to determine which approach the manufacturer is taking.

Might depend on whether premium components work better or last longer.

 

[Asher]

I'm curious if anyone has had an opportunity to make use of the extended warranty that some credit cards offer on purchases?

In theory I have an extra year warranty on my bike through the card I paid with. In reality, I think its doubtful the claim would be approved as they exclude motorized devices( most ebikes are not legally motorized) and consumables like batteries (even though the batteries are rechargeable and should clearly have a lifespan longer than the warranty period).

Lol yes that would be fraud since it's not covered.

It all depends. I agree with the hopes that manufacturers will be responsible, but I have seen products where a large margin to cover expected warranty repairs was added to the price. This extra cost elevated the product to appear premium and it had a longer warranty than the peer premium products. (See Curtis Mathes televisions)

I would prefer for the manufacturer charge a higher price for premium components vs funding a repair department. Our job as consumers is to do our research to try to determine which approach the manufacturer is taking.

How do you research something that you can't document? Manufacturer's, whether it's Bosch or Toyota, have a very very good idea of how often their parts fail, at least within the warranty period, because they're the ones servicing it. You, joe blow, have no idea. The consequences: average people lose their money and the landfills swell with more avoidable garbage.

Manufacturers tend to like it this way - if a manufacturer makes unreliable products, people will still buy them, and even if their products have a good reputation, they can charge a branding premium for it. The concept of buyer beware when clear information is simply unavailable is just a license for alternately shoddy quality, pricey branding, or both . This is why government's have passed lemon laws, because the playing field is extremely uneven between buyer and maker.

As Benjamin Franklin wrote:
There are a great many Retailers, who falsly imagine that being Historical (the modern Phrase for Lying) is much for their Advantage; and some of them have a Saying, That ’tis a Pity Lying is a Sin, it is so useful in Trade

 

[ruffruff]

So here you are, again, and here I am again, calling you out regarding your thoughts on warranties. There's nothing baffling to it in my mind. Why would I want to spend the time/frustration required to wade through all the BS and jump through the necessary hoops to get warranty on an inexpensive part? Or a labor operation I can complete in less time than it takes you to even contact whoever you need to talk with? Why would I insist my bike be put in line, possibly for weeks, to get something repaired, just because it's "under warranty"? The reason somebody might subject themselves to this is what I find baffling! For me, even if I was absolutely clueless, it would make MUCH more sense to at least attempt to learn enough to allow me to fix it myself...... if for no other reason than to justify the fact your bike is going to be in line to be worked on rather than under your butt being enjoyed. That's baffling.....

And representative responses? Really?

Well I get that and I'm a DIY, fixit myself guy, but I still want the best warranty possible to pay for parts, etc.
Especially for big repairs/parts. I'd be totally PO'ed if I had to replace a motor or something in the first year or two on my own dime.

And if I'm going to mod things and void the warranty I tend to ride/use as is until warranty has run out then I have it.

 

[hoggdoc]

On e-bikes, there's obviously more that can go wrong, and at great cost. Catastrophic crashes from part failures are rare, but the financial impact of motors or batteries failing prematurely due to manufacturer defect can easily be $500+ if not under warranty.

And yet on many of the popular direct sale e-bike brands, the warranty is paltry, often one year for not just parts but the frame as well.

It's a bit shocking that frame warranties are so short, especially when big bike brands usually warranty frames for life, including on e-bikes.

I recognize that warranty servicing, especially for direct sales, can be costly to operate, but even then warranties may not cover labor, just parts. An approach like Wing's of charging you extra for a longer warranty on parts seems reasonable, (although warranties sold separately can often be overpriced).

Does it matter that warranties are so short? Should it matter? Are you willing to pay an extra 5-10% for a year or two more of warranty on parts?

Online direct sales ebike brands:

1 year (all parts):
Blix
FLX
Juiced
Lectric
Magnum
Rad Power
Ride1Up
Rize
Sondors
Super 73 (high end models have a 2 year warranty for just batteries)
Wing (but can pay extra for up to 3 years)

3 year frame, 1 year parts:
Espin
Surface 604

3 years, frame and parts:
Vanmoof

Lifetime frame, 1 year parts:
Biktrix (90 days for Swift Lite)

For the most part you are dealing with offshore Chinese companies that from what I have read are not doing a good job when it comes to warranty claims. This also goes for "name brand" bikes bought at the local bike shops with costs many times more. Parts availability seems to be the biggest problem. That's why I bought a bike with very universal type components.

The fancier and more expensive bike seem to have batteries designs that may not be available anywhere but the MFG as long as they support that model. As far as motors, hub or mid-drives they can be replaced even if you have to re-lace the wheel. Brakes, gear sets, shifters are all easy to source with a little work. As far as the frame unless you are riding extreme X games type of trails I think most will hold up just fine.

 

[hoggdoc]

My take may not be popular here but I don't see anything wrong with a 1 year warranty for ebikes. I'm a dealership technician for BMW. Some of their cars sell for six figures and only have a 4yr/50k mile warranty. Now that is a tragedy. Especially given the amount of failures their new cars are prone to and what it costs after the warranty has expired.

I guess what I'm getting at is the cost of an ebike is comparatively low to a car, ditto for repairs. I think one year is sufficient given the costs of purchase and repair.

*I apologise to those offended by my analogy

That's why most new BMWs are leased instead of purchased. They are notorious for expensive maintenance and out of warranty repairs. Personally I don't know why people keep driving them.

 

[hoggdoc]

Pedego

I'm curious what was the price compared to a direct marketed bike with similar specs. I would hazard a guess at least twice as much. When you look at that way kinda makes the warranty look really expensive IMHO.

Who doesn't want the longest/best warranty on anything?

I have always said a warranty is only as good as the company offering. Most of these Chinese bike companies really don't have the ability nor desire to properly support what they sell.

 

[AHicks]

Well I get that and I'm a DIY, fixit myself guy, but I still want the best warranty possible to pay for parts, etc.
Especially for big repairs/parts. I'd be totally PO'ed if I had to replace a motor or something in the first year or two on my own dime.

And if I'm going to mod things and void the warranty I tend to ride/use as is until warranty has run out then I have it.

Which makes the brand of the motor used in your new bike pretty important. If you were to have a problem with your Bafang motor (pretty unusual) you can buy parts for them, or many of them at least. Check out parts availability for the way more expensive European bikes - which are pretty much non existent. They're considered proprietary parts - available through a dealer or the manf. only. Same with the batteries used on those bikes. Proprietary! On those type bikes, for sure, the best, longest warranty is the best plan.