Repeated Flats

[mgilbert]

I rode my Ride1Up 700 440 miles without a flat, then had one a few days ago, just as I got to work. I patched it at work, and it got me the twelve miles back home. But, the next morning, the same tire (rear) was flat again. The tire is a 27.5" X 2.4", but all I had was a 26" tube, but hey, it's rubber. It'll stretch and work, right? I installed it, and by the next morning, the tire was about halfway flat, again. So, I went and bought a Goodyear, 27.5" tube, for tires up to 2.3" wide. Thought surely that would work. It's supposed to be 30% thicker than a standard tube to boot. And, you guessed it - 6.5 miles from home, another flat. I patched it, and it got me home.

Now, looking at the first tube I patched, it appears that there is a hole in the patch? I've got a sneaking suspicion what you're going to say, but I want to hear it from experienced bikers...

What's going on here???

 

[theemartymac]

All rubber has tiny holes, so if you over inflate a tube, you increase the size of those microscopic holes and get steady leakage. Also, undersized tubes are stretched very tight and more prone to abrasion and have less ability to accept deformation, including pinch flats. Oversized is probably better than undersized if you are stuck making that choice.

But the other thing is to check the tire very carefully and make sure you don't have embedded debris still in there. Small glass or metal may not be apparent until you load up the pressure and deform the tire in use. Is the puncture rim side or tread side? Pinch flat or road debris puncture?

 

[DaveMatthews]

Yup... whatever flattened your tire in the first place is still in the tire. I got 3 flats from blackberry thorns and then went tubeless.

 

[Tars Tarkas]

Yup... whatever flattened your tire in the first place is still in the tire. I got 3 flats from blackberry thorns and then went tubeless.

Yes, a hole in the patch is a pretty big clue. As for tubeless, yeah, if you want to, and already have tubeless ready rims. Instead of going tubeless, which can be expensive, just put some sealant in your tubes. Or is there something I don't understand about tubeless tires? What makes them flat resistant is the sealant in the tires, right?

TT

 

[mgilbert]

All rubber has tiny holes, so if you over inflate a tube, you increase the size of those microscopic holes and get steady leakage. Also, undersized tubes are stretched very tight and more prone to abrasion and have less ability to accept deformation, including pinch flats. Oversized is probably better than undersized if you are stuck making that choice.

But the other thing is to check the tire very carefully and make sure you don't have embedded debris still in there. Small glass or metal may not be apparent until you load up the pressure and deform the tire in use. Is the puncture rim side or tread side? Pinch flat or road debris puncture?

The tires are rated for 55 PSI, and that's where I've run them, since mile 1. I don't overinflate them. The holes in all three tubes are in about the same place - in the center of the tread, almost halfway around the tire from the valve. And the holes are perfectly round - looks like a nail hole. In that same place on the tire, I can barely make out what might be a tiny tear in one of the tire's grooves - less than a quarter inch long, and barely visible. Could it be that there is a hole in the tire, and it is causing the holes in the replacement inner tubes? If so, how do I fix that?

I will remove and inspect the tire thoroughly tomorrow - I'm worn out tonight. If I don't find anything, I'm not sure what to do next.

 

[Tars Tarkas]

There is probably a bit of glass or a thorn, or something, on the inside of the tire. You have to feel around the inside of the tire, very carefully, every time you repair a flat. Unless you can see the problem and remove it from the outside.

Aside from all that, I really recommend Slime tire sealant. I use Slime, and I know it works very well, but there are several other brands. I haven't had a flat in hundreds of miles.

TT

 

[DaveMatthews]

Yes, a hole in the patch is a pretty big clue. As for tubeless, yeah, if you want to, and already have tubeless ready rims. Instead of going tubeless, which can be expensive, just put some sealant in your tubes. Or is there something I don't understand about tubeless tires? What makes them flat resistant is the sealant in the tires, right?

TT

Yes, you need tubeless ready rims and tires. Then a valve with a removable core. Tape the rims, and put in the required amount of sealant.
Luckily my rims and tires were already tubeless ready. Cheap to do at that point.

 

[mgilbert]

There is probably a bit of glass or a thorn, or something, on the inside of the tire. You have to feel around the inside of the tire, very carefully, every time you repair a flat. Unless you can see the problem and remove it from the outside.

Aside from all that, I really recommend Slime tire sealant. I use Slime, and I know it works very well, but there are several other brands. I haven't had a flat in hundreds of miles.

TT

Slime has a 27.5" X 2.4" inner tube, with the sealant already in it. Sounds like it might be time to buy at least a couple of them! It there is a nail hole in the tire, do I need to be concerned with it? Could tire pressure inside the tube where the hole is cause a tube to develop a hole? I've never heard to such a thing, but someone else mentioned it.

 

[DaveMatthews]

Slime has a 27.5" X 2.4" inner tube, with the sealant already in it. Sounds like it might be time to buy at least a couple of them! It there is a nail hole in the tire, do I need to be concerned with it? Could tire pressure inside the tube where the hole is cause a tube to develop a hole? I've never heard to such a thing, but someone else mentioned it.

Yup, depends on how big the hole is.
At 51psi there is a possibility that the tube is trying to force itself out the hole and creating a bit of a pimple.
You could try patching the tire inside at that location, or using a boot.

 

[Tars Tarkas]

Slime has a 27.5" X 2.4" inner tube, with the sealant already in it. Sounds like it might be time to buy at least a couple of them! It there is a nail hole in the tire, do I need to be concerned with it? Could tire pressure inside the tube where the hole is cause a tube to develop a hole? I've never heard to such a thing, but someone else mentioned it.

I've never used the pre-Slimed tubes so I don't know, but a lot of people say they don't do as well as regular tubes with Slime added. I suppose you can always add more Slime to them. For what it's worth, I always use about 20 -25% more Slime than they recommend.

TT

 

[mgilbert]

I've never used the pre-Slimed tubes so I don't know, but a lot of people say they don't do as well as regular tubes with Slime added. I suppose you can always add more Slime to them. For what it's worth, I always use about 20 -25% more Slime than they recommend.

TT

I've heard people say that Slime can gum up the tire's valve?

 

[mgilbert]

Okay, I found the problem. I removed the tire from the wheel, and I located a very tiny piece of very stiff wire sticking straight out, inside the tire. It was less than 1/4" long, and smaller in diameter than a sewing needle. I found it by touch. I could barely see it. In forty years of riding, and plenty of flats, I've never seen anything like it. If there is a hole through the tire, it is unimaginably small. And yeah, it had already poked a hole through the patch I had just applied to the tube. Wow - three inner tubes with holes in 'em.

 

[DaveMatthews]

Okay, I found the problem. I removed the tire from the wheel, and I located a very tiny piece of very stiff wire sticking straight out, inside the tire. It was less than 1/4" long, and smaller in diameter than a sewing needle. I found it by touch. I could barely see it. In forty years of riding, and plenty of flats, I've never seen anything like it. If there is a hole through the tire, it is unimaginably small. And yeah, it had already poked a hole through the patch I had just applied to the tube. Wow - three inner tubes with holes in 'em.

Good job. Next time you flat that's the routine.

 

[mgilbert]

Good job. Next time you flat that's the routine.

Yeah, lesson learned, the very hard way. I'm sixty, and have been riding since I was a child, and I've never had this happen. I've had flats, and have always just replaced the tube, and gone on my way, and never had a problem, until now.

 

[reed scott]

I've heard people say that Slime can gum up the tire's valve?

So what? You just pull the valve and clean it. Or replace it. Maybe use a cue tip and clean the stem a bit too. I swear by slime in my 2.8" tires. Lots of thorns around here and I got my first flat one hour after getting my first bike. Zero flats since I started using the Slime for tubed tires. ( there's three kinds of slime ) I also never have to add air as with slime my tires hold pressure almost forever.

 

[DaveMatthews]

Yeah, lesson learned, the very hard way. I'm sixty, and have been riding since I was a child, and I've never had this happen. I've had flats, and have always just replaced the tube, and gone on my way, and never had a problem, until now.

I know how you feel. I'm 64 and my last acoustic bike never gave me a flat ever!

 

[Mike TowpathTraveler]

Okay, I found the problem. I removed the tire from the wheel, and I located a very tiny piece of very stiff wire sticking straight out, inside the tire. It was less than 1/4" long, and smaller in diameter than a sewing needle. I found it by touch. I could barely see it. In forty years of riding, and plenty of flats, I've never seen anything like it. If there is a hole through the tire, it is unimaginably small. And yeah, it had already poked a hole through the patch I had just applied to the tube. Wow - three inner tubes with holes in 'em.

Everytime you get a flat, you just have to ensure you run your fingers (carefully, of course) in the tire to ensure there is no surprise waiting for your freshly patched tube. It becomes part of the tire patch repair routine.

It also pays to keep a good, sharp eye on the road ahead while out riding. The amount of debris laying on the shoulder of our roadways is substantial, including all kinds of nails, machine screws, sheet metal screws and glass of all shapes and sizes.

 

[mgilbert]

Thanks to everyone. This place, and the people who participate, and a priceless resource. Again, thank you...

 

[Tars Tarkas]

Thanks for the reporting the solution! The feedback is really valuable.

I've never had a problem with Slime clogging valves. I would think that if there's any Slime in there it would be pushed into the tube very easily by just about the smallest amount of air pumped through. Worst case, as Reed said, unscrew the valve core, rinse it (Slime is water soluble), run a qtip or something through the valve stem. Everybody's got one of these, don't they?

TT

 

[reed scott]

Thanks for the reporting the solution! The feedback is really valuable.

I've never had a problem with Slime clogging valves. I would think that if there's any Slime in there it would be pushed into the tube very easily by just about the smallest amount of air pumped through. Worst case, as Reed said, unscrew the valve core, rinse it (Slime is water soluble), run a qtip or something through the valve stem. Everybody's got one of these, don't they?

View attachment 92886

TT

Got three or four of them and half dozen slime bottle caps that are themselves valve tools .... for when I can't find the real pictured tool.