Real Range? What can you get from a charge?

[prof_fate]

I've read a lot and got the parts coming for my bike - 1000w hub motor, pas and throttle, 20ah battery. From what I've read that should be 30mph/30 miles.

What I've NOT read, seen in vidoes, or anyone talk about is REAL RANGE!

When I road bike trails on leg power alone I might do 20 miles or so. Most here are old RR lines so if you plan right you ride up grade to start and can have a much easier ride back when you're tired - 20 mph easy pedaling, 25 if you work at it some.

If I ride the roads here the hills do me in. 10% grades are common, and I live at one of the highest points i the county. So I don't ride much - hence the desire for an electric leg.

****

SO what is a realistic range? Does using pas vs throttle extend it? How much? I see most controllers have 3 to 5 assist levels - does using a lower assist level (either going slower or pedaling some) extend range and by how much?

I know in a car 55-60mph will give you 10%, or more, improvement in mileage (range) than driving 70-75 (alas, the speed limit). Is there a point on bikes where you lose more range than you gain in speed?

 

[AHicks]

Real range, ridden mostly in PAS 1 with a little PAS 2, nearly all paved, hilly coastal area, and low speeds. Like 9-12mph. 48v. 675 ah battery

1500w direct drive rear hub - a reliable/no worry 25 miles.

Same bike, same riding, no changes w/1000w+ MAC 12t geared hub - a reliable/no worry 35 miles, and much "sportier" performance.

 

[Browneye]

What kind of bike are you going to ride at 30mph? Have you done that before?
Is this on or offroad?
Who makes a 1000w hub motor?

We get thirty to fifty miles with our ebikes, further if you pedal more, not try to ride over 20 constantly.

 

[rcdanner]

My 550watthr battery gets about 70miles on Tucson Bike Loop. Fairly level paved path. Pedaling in lower PAS. Averaging 14mph for the 4 hr ride. Doing some fairly hard pedaling at top PAS averaging 26mph I can get about 20 mostly level miles.

 

[prof_fate]

What kind of bike are you going to ride at 30mph? Have you done that before?
Is this on or offroad?
Who makes a 1000w hub motor?

We get thirty to fifty miles with our ebikes, further if you pedal more, not try to ride over 20 constantly.

LOTS of 1000w hubmotors!
Yes, 30 is stupid fast - motors are 470 rpm, 26" - the math I did came up with 36mph, but i'm sure that RPM is no -load.

Amazon.com : 1000w hub motor

 

[Mr. Coffee]

...

What I've NOT read, seen in vidoes, or anyone talk about is REAL RANGE!

...

I know in a car 55-60mph will give you 10%, or more, improvement in mileage (range) than driving 70-75 (alas, the speed limit). Is there a point on bikes where you lose more range than you gain in speed?

The reason you won't find that information is that there are too many variables to provide a realistic answer.

Amongst the factors that affect range and can't be easily parametrized are:

• Temperature (55F to 75F seems to be the sweet spot)
• Road surface (generally very smooth roads produce the greatest range, rough and unpaved roads might knock your range back by a third)
• Elevation gain and steepness. Steeper climbs usually hit your battery the hardest
• How much you weigh and how much stuff you carry with you

Probably the biggest factors are how fast you are riding (past a certain speed air resistance completely dominates the equations and your precious electrons are just pushing the wind around) and what level of pedal assist (higher levels eat the battery faster) -- but keep in mind that pedal assist levels vary bewilderingly between bike brands and some e-bikes allow customization, so it is again impossible to generalize in any helpful way.

I find the Bosch Range Assistant helpful in exploring all of the variables.

 

[prof_fate]

550 wh? only seen batts rated at AH.
So at 36v that's 15ah, at 48v 11.5 ah

20mi with pedaling...on level..discouraging.

My 550watthr battery gets about 70miles on Tucson Bike Loop. Fairly level paved path. Pedaling in lower PAS. Averaging 14mph for the 4 hr ride. Doing some fairly hard pedaling at top PAS averaging 26mph I can get about 20 mostly level miles.

 

[rcdanner]

Doing 20 miles or so at 26-28 mph avg in PAS 5 takes a lot amps even with pedaling on some rolling hills roughly equating to mostly level altitude gain in Tucson. Battery is Reention Dorado Max 48V 11.6Ah. And that's discouraging??

 

[dodahman]

I use 10-13 wh per mile and ride in semi hilly area. I think range is roughly figured on 20wh per mile.
It is going to depend on many factors.

 

[prof_fate]

26-28mph, no, not discouraging!

Doing 20 miles or so at 26-28 mph avg in PAS 5 takes a lot amps even with pedaling on some rolling hills roughly equating to mostly level altitude gain in Tucson. Battery is Reention Dorado Max 48V 11.6Ah. And that's discouraging??

ok, so the math on that is .41ah/mile, or if I could use ALL the 20amp pack, 48 miles. Hills can cut that in half, at least on the up-hill side of the ride, and figure 80% drain (?) that's 20-22 miles.

Using 13wh and same 80%, that's 59 miles. THAT would be impressive.

I'm estimating my rolling load will be 290lbs..me (230), bike (25-30?) and batt/motor (30?).


[quote ="dodahman"]
I use 10-13 wh per mile and ride in semi hilly area. I think range is roughly figured on 20wh per mile.
It is going to depend on many factors. [/quote]

 

[Browneye]

I surely hope it's all that you hoped it would be.
You might browse my thread on converting one of our bikes here: https://electricbikereview.com/forums/threads/specialized-roll-hub-conversion-q-a.31055/

 

[tomjasz]

SO what is a realistic range?

It'll be what you get if you take a typical ride and run to Low Voltage Cutoff. To many variables to give an accurate number. Pedaling and using PAS will always get you further than heavy throttle use.

Which hub motor are you running?

 

[prof_fate]

voilamart gearless brushless 1000w rear.
Probably typical unbranded chinese rear hub motor. They sell alot on ebay and amazon, good reviews. Cheap. Almost scary cheap...but I've bought scary cheap from china before and rarely had an issue and when I have, they've stood behind the product.

I'm a DJ and have uplighting coming from china - slower, but 15% cheaper even with $140 in shipping than buying it in the US, and it's the exact same item.

It'll be what you get if you take a typical ride and run to Low Voltage Cutoff. To many variables to give an accurate number. Pedaling and using PAS will always get you further than heavy throttle use.

Which hub motor are you running?

 

[Trail Cruiser]

The general rule of thumb is that the battery range is roughly 5-10% (in miles) of the battery capacity (in Watt-Hours), depending on how much motor assist you are using.

For example, if you have a 500wh battery, your range may vary from 25 miles to 50 miles depending on how much motor assist you are using on your ride.

If your average speed is roughly 10 mph, then you may get near 50 miles. If your average speed is somewhere near 20 mph (or if you riding on hilly terrains), you may get about 25 miles.

 

[rich c]

On factor not discussed is your weight and the weight of the bike. Anything over 20mph and the air resistance goes up exponentially. I wouldn't be confident of making it 30miles at 30mph.

 

[Marci jo]

The general rule of thumb is that the battery range is roughly 5-10% (in miles) of the battery capacity (in Watt-Hours), depending on how much motor assist you are using.

For example, if you have a 500wh battery, your range may vary from 25 miles to 50 miles depending on how much motor assist you are using on your ride.

If your average speed is roughly 10 mph, then you may get near 50 miles. If your average speed is somewhere near 20 mph (or if you riding on hilly terrains), you may get about 25 miles.

Hmmm...not so sure on this data.
My class 1 Trek has a 500 wh battery and if I kept the speed at 10 mph (riding on Eco) I could easily get 80-100 miles, which is probably longer than my legs would hold out.
Mostly flat. Minimum wind. I’m around 135 lbs.

 

[Browneye]

Speed kills. Oops... I mean, speed costs.

 

[Trail Cruiser]

Hmmm...not so sure on this data.
My class 1 Trek has a 500 wh battery and if I kept the speed at 10 mph (riding on Eco) I could easily get 80-100 miles, which is probably longer than my legs would hold out.
Mostly flat. Minimum wind. I’m around 135 lbs.

If I just ride at about 10 mph then I could use a regular light weight non electric bike with limitless range.

 

[Beardystarstuff]

If I just ride at about 10 mph then I could use a regular light weight non electric bike with limitless range.

I tend to ride on back country county roads, some of which are nice black top and on those I tend to ride at PAS 2 or 3 at about 16 mph. But I also do a lot of riding on dirt and gravel roads that are more enclosed with woodland scenery and on those I tend to ride much more slowly, typically between 8 and 11 mph where I keep it at PAS 1. I’m not out for speed so much as enjoying a ride and I adjust my speed according to the surroundings. My current favorite ride is about 32 miles and I’m eyeing an extension of that ride which will put it at about 50 miles. Speaking for myself I’m on an electric bike because I have knee issues and even though I’m currently able to pedal very consistently I’ve had problems in the past and I don’t know when or if I’ll be able to get back on a non-assisted bike. So for those of us that might have health issues an electric bike is important and riding long rides is often better enabled at lower pedal assist levels. If a person’s priority is faster ride that’s fine but they won’t have the extended range that might be useful for longer, casual rides. Riding style is likely to be a reflection of the purpose of the ride and will have an affect on the range.

 

[prof_fate]

Old saying "Speed costs money. How fast can you afford to go?"

Speed kills. Oops... I mean, speed costs.

Hmm..48v 20ah is 960wh...so 48 to 96 miles? Seems a bit unbelievable, but I can hope it's true!

The general rule of thumb is that the battery range is roughly 5-10% (in miles) of the battery capacity (in Watt-Hours), depending on how much motor assist you are using.

For example, if you have a 500wh battery, your range may vary from 25 miles to 50 miles depending on how much motor assist you are using on your ride.

If your average speed is roughly 10 mph, then you may get near 50 miles. If your average speed is somewhere near 20 mph (or if you riding on hilly terrains), you may get about 25 miles.