Question for Specialized SL 1.1 motor owners

[Rupert6021]

Hi guys

I have a Vado SL, it's done 100 miles and I've noticed a noise inside the gearbox as the cranks engage the motor. I didn't notice it when it was new but maybe I wasn't listening. I posted a video below, just turning the cranks by hand gives you an idea of the noise. It's the same with the chain off. Is it normal? Or should I plan a trip to the dealer?

Thanks guys

 

[BEC111]

I get that sound when I stop peddling and coast. If that’s what’s happening for you, it’s normal. Disconcerting, but normal

 

[Rupert6021]

thanks Bec, this helps

 

[avandalen]

I would like to use the Creo Turbo for my solar-powered bike, the Maxun One, but I have my own electronics because I want to ride with motor support, with a throttle assist, but without pedaling and thus with the bottom bracket not turning.

So, does the SL1.1motor has a double freewheel, so that in principle it is possible that the motor runs without the pedal turning?

 

[Stefan Mikes]

so that in principle it is possible that the motor runs without the pedal turning?

The 1.1 motor requires the pedals to turn. It is a bike, not a motorbike.

 

[BEC111]

I don’t know. Too technical an issue for me. What I know is I can easily ride my SL with the power off or at the zero assist level (these are different modes).

 

[Stefan Mikes]

This is so simple. The bottom bracket is equipped with torque sensor. If you pedal, the motor will engage and as much of electricity will be delivered to the motor as to ensure fluent and natural pedalling assistance. If no torque on the cranks, no motor action.

It is irrelevant if the SL e-bikes allow unassisted pedalling or not. The 1.1 motor requires pedalling to engage. That's it.

 

[avandalen]

It is irrelevant if the SL e-bikes allow unassisted pedalling or not. The 1.1 motor requires pedalling to engage. That's it.

I have find it out, it has no double freewheel

 

[BEC111]

This is so simple. The bottom bracket is equipped with torque sensor. If you pedal, the motor will engage and as much of electricity will be delivered to the motor as to ensure fluent and natural pedalling assistance. If no torque on the cranks, no motor action.

It is irrelevant if the SL e-bikes allow unassisted pedalling or not. The 1.1 motor requires pedalling to engage. That's it.

I understand that the motor requires peddling to engage. But if you don’t need it engaged, either set to zero assist or powered off, and there doesn’t appear to be motor drag, how does that work in the context of the question.

There are several ways to understand the question, “in principle it is possible that the motor runs without the pedal turning”? Does this mean that the motor is using battery power even if shut off or does the motor turn when you pedals?

Another way of asking. I assume the motor itself rotates if the pedals turn: they are directly connected after all. Does this have an electrical effect? Isn’t an electric motor a dynamo with the ledes reversed: power in vs power out?

Just asking.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Isn’t an electric motor a dynamo with the ledes reversed: power in vs power out?

Only with the Regenerative Braking Direct Drive hub motors. The 1.1 is a mid-drive (non-regenerative braking) motor.

Another way of asking. I assume the motor itself rotates if the pedals turn: they are directly connected after all.

The crank and the mid-drive motor are not necessarily directly connected. As far as I can understand the whole idea behind SL e-bikes is to disengage the 1.1 motor from the crank (pedals) with a clutch whenever the motor does not work. It is why you can so easily pedal your SL with the power off or above the speed restriction.

how does that work in the context of the question.

As I can understand the question, the OP would like to replace Torque-Based Pedalling Assistance with a throttle. He thinks it is possible not to pedal on an SL e-bike and control the assistance with a throttle. That won't work.

 

[avandalen]

Only with the Regenerative Braking Direct Drive hub motors. The 1.1 is a mid-drive (non-regenerative braking) motor.

The crank and the mid-drive motor are not necessarily directly connected. As far as I can understand the whole idea behind SL e-bikes is to disengage the 1.1 motor from the crank (pedals) with a clutch whenever the motor does not work. It is why you can so easily pedal your SL with the power off or above the speed restriction.


As I can understand the question, the OP would like replace Torque-Based Pedalling Assistance with a throttle. He thinks it is possible not to pedal on an SL e-bike and control the assistance with a throttle. That won't work.

Throttle control is still possible with Yamaha mid drive and many other brands (when you change the motor driver electronics). I updated my page here:

All e-bike mid-drive motors compared

Here, I share technical solutions that arised during the development of my solar-bike.

www.avdweb.nl

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Use the Yamaha motor then.

 

[BEC111]

I think I understand better. It’s an interesting experiment, then.

 

[JP Stromer ST1]

This is so simple. The bottom bracket is equipped with torque sensor. If you pedal, the motor will engage and as much of electricity will be delivered to the motor as to ensure fluent and natural pedalling assistance. If no torque on the cranks, no motor action.

It is irrelevant if the SL e-bikes allow unassisted pedalling or not. The 1.1 motor requires pedalling to engage. That's it.

Hi, I was thinking about posting a torque sensor question. But you with same bike as me and in-depth Specialized knowledge might know....?
Will my authorized Specialized dealer/service point (or myself with relevant programming tools) be able to adjustments the sensitivity of the torque sensor?
In Mission Control terms I would like to set support beyond Turbo, to 125% or 150%.
I understand that that this will drain the battery and put extra pressure on the motor, BUT SOMETIMES IT WOULD BE NICE TO CRUISE IN +40Km/t without getting to warm yourself.
Even though this challenges the properties and non trottle status of Class 3/S-pedelec.

(I was able to go into programming mode on my Stromer and do this adjustment.)

thx for any comment

 

[BEC111]

I don’t know about being able to modify those settings, but the fellow who created the BLEvo app may, as the app has the ability to make changes to the bikes. Also, he may be able to remove the European class 3 limits to US levels.

Perhaps, that’s a start.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Specialized dealers never act against the law (at the cost of losing their dealership).

 

[BEC111]

No. He can’t.

Thanks for the clarification. Just fantasizing I guess

 

[JP Stromer ST1]

Specialized dealers never act against the law (at the cost of losing their dealership).

Sorry for my lack of knowledge, but could you please elaborate on the legal issues here.
I`m not suggesting any motor help beyond 45km/t.

So based on your reply can I assume there is some kind of (minimum) pedal power vs motor power ratio limitation expressed in torque or watthours? specified i requirements for s-pedelec?

Or are you pointing to Specialized policy of not participate in any action altering the specifications, lack if warranty if any kind of tuning har been don to the bike etc

If it`s the last issue I would still like to investigate if the possibilities of getting more motor power from less leg power

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Sorry for my lack of knowledge, but could you please elaborate on the legal issues here.
I`m not suggesting any motor help beyond 45km/t.

So based on your reply can I assume there is some kind of (minimum) pedal power vs motor power ratio limitation expressed in torque or watthours? specified i requirements for s-pedelec?

Sorry, I misread your original question, which I think was:

In Mission Control terms I would like to set support beyond Turbo, to 125% or 150%.

The answer is: 100% Turbo means the maximum motor power (240 W for 1.1) and maximum rated torque. There is no way to supercharge this motor. If you wanted more power and torque, you should have gone for Vado 5.0 (non SL) The 1.3 motor has maximum peak power of 550 W and torque of 90 Nm.

 

[jodi2]

Will my authorized Specialized dealer/service point (or myself with relevant programming tools) be able to adjustments the sensitivity of the torque sensor?
In Mission Control terms I would like to set support beyond Turbo, to 125% or 150%.
(I was able to go into programming mode on my Stromer and do this adjustment.)

If it`s the last issue I would still like to investigate if the possibilities of getting more motor power from less leg power

You are thinking to much in settings like our Stromer bikes... ;-)
But it's not correct for Stromer bikes that they simply give more or less power only due to the sensiblity of the torque sensor. This changes only the point/the force in the crank/on the chain, where the motor starts to support. If this is set to low, it's a little bit annoying. And if it's set to high the motor "overreacts" to the slightest crank movement with almost no force on the chain and you feel like loosing control. But it does not really increase the amount of support or motor power, this is also on Stromer bikes influenced mainly by the silders in the app.
For the SL drive there are similar settings like in the Stromer app, see attachment. I haven't used the sliders "Peak Power" and "Acc. Response" much yet. But it's similar to Stromer, they are already great in the default setting and if you put them to low, it's bad, and if you put them high, you do not really increase the amount of support. That's done with the "Support" slider and 100% is 100%.

But it seems that you don't have a SL bike yet, so why do you ask? Don't expect Stromer motor power with a SL drive. But expect half of the weight of a Stromer... ;-)