No throttle and no way home today... :(

[Djangodog]

Your legs are not a throttle. A throttle is on the handlebars in a twist or thumb variation that allows you to get off to a quicker or stronger start than your legs provide. It still amazes me how many fight the throttle!

It seems a bit strange to call this device a “throttle”. As I understand it, it is a control that engages an electric motor directly to the drive system and controls the speed of that electric motor, so it doesn’t fit the definition of a throttle. An “independent accelerator” would probably be more accurate, but not very catchy. That aside, I don’t know why some are pushing them so hard. I want my ebike to feel and behave like a bicycle, not a moped and not like an underpowered motorcycle.

I have enjoyed cycling nearly all my life. I plain out do not want a throttle. If someone wants one, that’s fine for them. Personally, the bikes with “throttles” don’t tend to appeal to me.

I don’t want a Class 3 bike either. Even fit cyclists don’t maintain 28 mph on a flat. Class 1 feels very natural to me. I rarely use more than the eco assistance level and I often slightly exceed the assistance speed on the flats. In eco, the transition from assistance to all me is seamless, and that’s the way that I alike it. I won’t judge anyone for wanting a class 2 or 3 bike. For me, the less I intrusive the drive the better.

I carry a chain tool and a “Missing Link”, along with a multi tool, spare tube, CO2 inflator and patch kit. I also carry a phone, so I don’t expect a “throttle” to be a critical too for me.

My final argument for class 1 is that nearly every state allows it to be ridden anywhere that a non-electric bike can. That’s not the case with class 2 or 3.

 

[PedalUma]

I like going over 20 so, that is class three. Different strokes for different folks. I am good with that. There are different strain gauges that do the same thing in slightly different ways. An electric car has one in the accelerator pedal. It is responsive to your foot. A thumb throttle has a strain gauge that measures twisting force, or torque. That strain gets amplified by the bike. Some bikes have a strain gauge that works just like the two pervious examples. It is located between the pedals and is just as responsive. It is called a torque sensor. Strain gauge = accelerator, in each of these examples.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Hear that FnF... Maybe change your name to Fidel

That's gold!
Heck... You may be my hero!

Hey, there's deep stuff there. Like how I can go +3000mi w/ out a flat and his bike has multiples?
It's like a different universe.
I really like my daily driver's throttle.

From the Controller out, I've replaced all the crappy 26 - 28AWG wiring with quality 22AWG and quality plugs.
That made a huge difference in response. This bike is in Domino territory.
On Level 3 (of 3), full Throttle while using full TS input is 'dangerous fast'.
The (digital) 'throttle engagement 'V' factor is still off - soon to be rectified with a 100ohm resistor.
I'm default "SPEED" input source, so no issues with sudden power surges - I don't need the 5-600ohm resistor.
Buttery smooth, and 'full throttle and full TS power' at the same time resolves in throttle input loss - but if you stop Torque Input, the throttle immediately resumes up to around 980ish watts.
The behavior is prefect, as predictably anticipated.
My controller allows over 1000watts for short periods and I'm set to 22amps Max, so at full charge I get over 1200watts.
I can say "do not treat this machine casually". lol. It is 100% legal and it rocks.

is pretty common. 31.9 is record - but display may not show any higher. It's not top end though. It's the whole range is beautiful.
Maybe I'll post some newer pics with the new RS Gold fork, Raceface pedals (now installed) and wiring harness completed, then you have something to worship.
September improvements include an Archer D1x wireless shifter and Box 4 - 8 derailleur w/ Box Four 8 Speed 11-42T Cassette/ Box chain.
-
Hopefully my Titanium WW will be here before I get to the October/ November Magura MT 5's
When my UC Pro is sorted out I'll put the Lm'td Unleashed up for sale to somebody that takes a shine.
Jut as I wear Carhartt and believe in contrived utility, I searched thoroughly and bought this machine to do exactly what I'm doing.
My totem's the Badger, not the Butterfly.

Not sure why that upsets butterflies?

Fn'F

 

[Taylor57]

It seems a bit strange to call this device a “throttle”. As I understand it, it is a control that engages an electric motor directly to the drive system and controls the speed of that electric motor, so it doesn’t fit the definition of a throttle. An “independent accelerator” would probably be more accurate, but not very catchy. That aside, I don’t know why some are pushing them so hard. I want my ebike to feel and behave like a bicycle, not a moped and not like an underpowered motorcycle.

I have enjoyed cycling nearly all my life. I plain out do not want a throttle. If someone wants one, that’s fine for them. Personally, the bikes with “throttles” don’t tend to appeal to me.

I don’t want a Class 3 bike either. Even fit cyclists don’t maintain 28 mph on a flat. Class 1 feels very natural to me. I rarely use more than the eco assistance level and I often slightly exceed the assistance speed on the flats. In eco, the transition from assistance to all me is seamless, and that’s the way that I alike it. I won’t judge anyone for wanting a class 2 or 3 bike. For me, the less I intrusive the drive the better.

I carry a chain tool and a “Missing Link”, along with a multi tool, spare tube, CO2 inflator and patch kit. I also carry a phone, so I don’t expect a “throttle” to be a critical too for me.

My final argument for class 1 is that nearly every state allows it to be ridden anywhere that a non-electric bike can. That’s not the case with class 2 or 3.

Fair enough

 

[Fast n' Furious]

In sharing with folks interested in throttles for ebikes, I never intended reaching out to folks that drool and ask "what's a throttle"? No idea why they input.
It's a serious topic and opinions should be accompanied by serious cites.
I'm stunned by Billy Bob chastising me for not being grateful for wild guesstimating of admitted no-nothings - until I saw it was from Michigan. Something in the water, for sure.
I'm not smart, just tenacious, do my homework until I get it. Hell yes I have little use for the physically/ mentally lazy parasites.
Why get an ebike then pretend you are riding an old 10 speed?
There's so many reason's for having a good throttle and knowing how to use it, it's an indefensible, 'Urkel' level faux pas to think to the contrary.
In fact most of us non-puritans uses typically the throttle to start forward, then shift to the appropriate gear through intersection, out of traffics way.
You might think you look cool with those tight pants on an /bicycle ebike, butt up in the air, standing up and trying mightily to press down those pedals (in the wrong gear), your face red with exertion and a look of determination, and the front wheel wobbling, holding up traffic.
I'd say it's debatable.
Where I live there are more ebikes on the road than bicycles. Bicycles are obsolete and losing fast. This is about transportation, not recreation.
Oh, we see tightly clad geriatric High-Tails in clumps, on weekends. Usually stopped, discussing some nebulous concept of fixing something, leaning over, one stiff leg (oops, there goes another delusion out the window).
I pull up. Stop. Gauge the traffic and drive off, shifting to the gear I require as I go - often they notice the light is green and begin to wobble forth, but hey ... I removed my rear-view mirror, so I can't look back and watch the light turn Red with those guys still in the intersection.
What screws me up is I still can't figure why they're always inspecting those skinny tires?
Approaching 5000 miles riding this machine, I 100% prefer to come to a stop in gear 4th or 5th.
I never have "wrong gear frustration". Never.
As I reach 15mph I'm shifting and using my pedals for torque input.

BTW: The Box 8Sp is perfect gearing for a City ebike (go 11 on the small cog), where you can fly.
When I built gas engines I'd say "stay on the cam", by which I mean "on the powerband", with max torque input via the cranks, fully supplemented by max throttle in the gaps (Isn't epistemology fun? I say "fly" and some visually being a 'housefly', not an Eagle).
My point is: You cannot do that with Cadence so 50% of purists never get to even taste it.
How can they address it? Only through warped lenses clouded by ground in expectations.
That's another aspect left out of this conversation.
If you're running Cadence, that's for long haul riding, for pace. You one 'a those 'leg-torture' guys w/ the buffed calves. How romantic.
Torque Sensor is for multiplying your pedaling power - when you input it. Accelerating, Stop sign to Stop sign work. Not keeping a pace.
Like a gas pedal, I can us TS and crank one side doubling my force input (from the pedal) to the wheel - even in a turn.
Cadence is for those long stretches of pristine railroad tracks going up our coast.
Torque Sensor's for driving through the Downtown Jungle on a mission.

FnF

 

[Fast n' Furious]

How often?

Roughly every 400miles on an Ultra Mid Drive

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Totally agree. If I may add just a bit- Build it right, (learn to) maintain it properly. Don't ride like a dumbass. Mid drive is every bit as reliable as a hub motor.

Again ... Your "mid-drive" may be as reliable - not 200Nm of Ultra mid-drive.
Even 160Nm Frey riders ain't getting rear hub-drive kind of durability on the overall drivetrain.
It's not your "drive" anyway. It's the transmission that leads to it, like the chain.

Okay, fine. I'll wipe everything I know.
So now from the outset, how do I convince myself a drive transferring power to the rear wheel via a chain won't wear the chain/ driveshaft/ belt more than a drive that's the rear axle and does not use those components ????
Bad logic from the outset.

 

[rayray]

Again ... Your "mid-drive" may be as reliable - not 200Nm of Ultra mid-drive.
Even 160Nm Frey riders ain't getting rear hub-drive kind of durability on the overall drivetrain.
It's not your "drive" anyway. It's the transmission that leads to it, like the chain.

Okay, fine. I'll wipe everything I know.
So now from the outset, how do I convince myself a drive transferring power to the rear wheel via a chain won't wear the chain/ driveshaft/ belt more than a drive that's the rear axle and does not use those components ????
Bad logic from the outset.

None of that matters to me. I only ride about 1,000 miles per year, purely for pleasure, though I also appreciate the exercise value. I ride a mid-drive (Creo), and I couldn’t care any less about the life of my components. I’ll get what I get out of them, and gladly buy new when they become worn or broken. As to throttles, to each their own, but I don’t need one. I don’t struggle to get going, and I’m not worried about a broken chain. Maybe I’ll feel differently when I get really old (only 68 now) and fat (well, I am a little bit fat), but for now I love my throttle-less Class 3.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

What topic?

 

[Fast n' Furious]

Watch dis.

Watch what? A 'jpg.file'?
A picture?

 

[Fast n' Furious]

I was searching 'throttle' topics.
Not much here. I'm pretty selfish. Nothing to learn, I'm gone.
Loser's Clubs have no appeal

 

[Fast n' Furious]

BIGGEST TURNOFF - NO PICS

 

[Dave Rocks]

 

[Rexlion]

A throttle is a tool that I might find handy now and then. So I will have a throttle. An incremental one, not just on/off. That, and a torque sensor. Because I want to, and because I can.

 

[Fast n' Furious]

2nd worst is photoshopper fakes

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Roughly every 400miles on an Ultra Mid Drive

You mean you're crippling your derailleur every 400 miles? My point was such an occurence were very rare.

 

[Djangodog]

In sharing with folks interested in throttles for ebikes, I never intended reaching out to folks that drool and ask "what's a throttle"? No idea why they input.
It's a serious topic and opinions should be accompanied by serious cites.
I'm stunned by Billy Bob chastising me for not being grateful for wild guesstimating of admitted no-nothings - until I saw it was from Michigan. Something in the water, for sure.
I'm not smart, just tenacious, do my homework until I get it. Hell yes I have little use for the physically/ mentally lazy parasites.
Why get an ebike then pretend you are riding an old 10 speed?
There's so many reason's for having a good throttle and knowing how to use it, it's an indefensible, 'Urkel' level faux pas to think to the contrary.
In fact most of us non-puritans uses typically the throttle to start forward, then shift to the appropriate gear through intersection, out of traffics way.
You might think you look cool with those tight pants on an /bicycle ebike, butt up in the air, standing up and trying mightily to press down those pedals (in the wrong gear), your face red with exertion and a look of determination, and the front wheel wobbling, holding up traffic.
I'd say it's debatable.
Where I live there are more ebikes on the road than bicycles. Bicycles are obsolete and losing fast. This is about transportation, not recreation.
Oh, we see tightly clad geriatric High-Tails in clumps, on weekends. Usually stopped, discussing some nebulous concept of fixing something, leaning over, one stiff leg (oops, there goes another delusion out the window).
I pull up. Stop. Gauge the traffic and drive off, shifting to the gear I require as I go - often they notice the light is green and begin to wobble forth, but hey ... I removed my rear-view mirror, so I can't look back and watch the light turn Red with those guys still in the intersection.
What screws me up is I still can't figure why they're always inspecting those skinny tires?
Approaching 5000 miles riding this machine, I 100% prefer to come to a stop in gear 4th or 5th.
I never have "wrong gear frustration". Never.
As I reach 15mph I'm shifting and using my pedals for torque input.

BTW: The Box 8Sp is perfect gearing for a City ebike (go 11 on the small cog), where you can fly.
When I built gas engines I'd say "stay on the cam", by which I mean "on the powerband", with max torque input via the cranks, fully supplemented by max throttle in the gaps (Isn't epistemology fun? I say "fly" and some visually being a 'housefly', not an Eagle).
My point is: You cannot do that with Cadence so 50% of purists never get to even taste it.
How can they address it? Only through warped lenses clouded by ground in expectations.
That's another aspect left out of this conversation.
If you're running Cadence, that's for long haul riding, for pace. You one 'a those 'leg-torture' guys w/ the buffed calves. How romantic.
Torque Sensor is for multiplying your pedaling power - when you input it. Accelerating, Stop sign to Stop sign work. Not keeping a pace.
Like a gas pedal, I can us TS and crank one side doubling my force input (from the pedal) to the wheel - even in a turn.
Cadence is for those long stretches of pristine railroad tracks going up our coast.
Torque Sensor's for driving through the Downtown Jungle on a mission.

FnF

You seem to know what you want from an ebike. Others know what they want. Being condescending won’t change that.

I am still a roadie. I raced xc during the early days of mountain biking. I still ride my road bike. I am a cyclist, but I don’t fit your fantasy of someone wobbling through an intersection in the wrong gear.

If getting your jollies by putting down people that love and understand cycling, then that is your issue. If you can’t generate enough power to get moving , even with pedal assist or remember to shift down, then maybe the problem isn’t the drivetrain.

My wife and I bought ebikes so that we could ride together. We enjoy it. We don’t need or want an unnatural amount of power. We don’t want to ride bikes that can’t go every where that non-electric bikes are allowed. If I wanted a lot of torque, speed and a throttle, I would go back to motorcycles. It’s that simple.

 

[AHicks]

You seem to know what you want from an ebike. Others know what they want. Being condescending won’t change that.

I am still a roadie. I raced xc during the early days of mountain biking. I still ride my road bike. I am a cyclist, but I don’t fit your fantasy of someone wobbling through an intersection in the wrong gear.

If getting your jollies by putting down people that love and understand cycling, then that is your issue. If you can’t generate enough power to get moving , even with pedal assist or remember to shift down, then maybe the problem isn’t the drivetrain.

My wife and I bought ebikes so that we could ride together. We enjoy it. We don’t need or want an unnatural amount of power. We don’t want to ride bikes that can’t go every where that non-electric bikes are allowed. If I wanted a lot of torque, speed and a throttle, I would go back to motorcycles. It’s that simple.

Talk about condescending. Who's calling the kettle black here?

If you are as comfortable in your own space as you would like others to believe, I'm left wondering about the purpose of your note?

Ride how/what you like, and move on. Others could likely not care any less.

 

[Djangodog]

Talk about condescending. Who's calling the kettle black here?

If you are as comfortable in your own space as you would like others to believe, I'm left wondering about the purpose of your note?

Ride how/what you like, and move on. Others could likely not care any less.

Did you not read the post that I was replying to???? This guy with his illegal e-moped was crapping all over cyclists. If he needs a motor and throttle because he can’t remember to shift down before stopping, then good for him. If he needs the biggest motor he can find to make up for other inadequacies, that’s fine too. If he is so unfit that he relies on the throttle, then the throttle is probably more of a problem than a solution.

If he wants to crap all over people that make an attempt to be fit or that enjoy cycling without assistance, then I will come to the defense of those cyclists of which I am still one.

 

[AHicks]

Did you not read the post that I was replying to???? This guy with his illegal e-moped was crapping all over cyclists. If he needs a motor and throttle because he can’t remember to shift down before stopping, then good for him. If he needs the biggest motor he can find to make up for other inadequacies, that’s fine too. If he is so unfit that he relies on the throttle, then the throttle is probably more of a problem than a solution.

If he wants to crap all over people that make an attempt to be fit or that enjoy cycling without assistance, then I will come to the defense of those cyclists of which I am still one.

I'm not going to disagree with what you're saying. My point is more about encouraging the us vs. them thing. When it comes to bike riding, I could give a damn about throttle vs. no. I would MUCH rather see either than somebody sitting on a couch with a game controller in their hand, no?

As far as big motors, unless they are clearly abusing the trail/path/road they are on (e.g. weaving in and out of pedestrians) it's really none of your business. Some, myself included, can justify that power requirement with the area we ride in. You don't want/need it? That's awesome, but that does NOT mean I don't.....

You like riding for your health? You go boy! I could give a damn there to. I ride because I enjoy riding. Again, you are never going to be in a position to judge! You want to turn me into the health police because I'm not riding for the same reason you do? Go for it! -Al