No power/current display after Ultra 620 Canbus-UART conversion
- Thread starter CCroft
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CCroft
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Sometimes life conspires to get in the way of riding, but I finally got out on the bike and good news...the power/current appears to be displaying normally. The readings seem higher than I expected, and jump around a fair amount compared to what I'm used to from the BBSHD (perhaps from the Ultra's torque sensor), but they are showing up--on the 500c display (haven't tried the Eggrider yet).
I hope that additional riding will change my views, but right now if I could switch out the Ultra motor on this bike for a BBSHD I'd do it without reservation. The noise difference is significant, even after heavily greasing my Ultra with Mobilith SHC100. And so far, I find the torque sensing less predictable than what I'm accustomed to with the crude "steps" of the BBSHD--combined with a little throttle. On the BBSHD it seems like I'm able to combine peddling/pedal assist with some light throttle to create very predictable power over my rough/uneven terrain. With this Ultra...there is no such combination...the throttle cuts out abruptly with any slight pedal movement tanking most forward momentum (not sure if this can be tweaked/changed in the settings). 'Hopefully a lot of this is lack of familiarity/needing to tweak some Ultra settings...
I hope that additional riding will change my views, but right now if I could switch out the Ultra motor on this bike for a BBSHD I'd do it without reservation. The noise difference is significant, even after heavily greasing my Ultra with Mobilith SHC100. And so far, I find the torque sensing less predictable than what I'm accustomed to with the crude "steps" of the BBSHD--combined with a little throttle. On the BBSHD it seems like I'm able to combine peddling/pedal assist with some light throttle to create very predictable power over my rough/uneven terrain. With this Ultra...there is no such combination...the throttle cuts out abruptly with any slight pedal movement tanking most forward momentum (not sure if this can be tweaked/changed in the settings). 'Hopefully a lot of this is lack of familiarity/needing to tweak some Ultra settings...
il Munduato
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Coming from a BBS02B there's definitely some differences and a bit of a learning curve. That said I much prefer the more natural feel of the Ultra.
Yes you should definitely review the settings. Who knows what's on there when sold as a replacement part.
What are your throttle settings as my throttle output is additive to pedaling PAS with no cut out and much more refined in doing so than the BBS ever was.
That, that said if your current readings aren't correct that could be an issue as the controller may be using the same information when implementing power.
Yes you should definitely review the settings. Who knows what's on there when sold as a replacement part.
What are your throttle settings as my throttle output is additive to pedaling PAS with no cut out and much more refined in doing so than the BBS ever was.
That, that said if your current readings aren't correct that could be an issue as the controller may be using the same information when implementing power.
CCroft
Member
So I adjusted the settings, and the throttle part of the equation has improved; in fact I need to cut back that throttle power now by ~ 1/3 I think to be where I want it.
I'm still--at least for now--not a fan of the torque sensing. How if at all can I adjust my settings to end up with more "BBSHD-like" performance (= deemphasizing/dampening the torque sensing so each PAS level is more static/BBSHD-like)?
Eggrider settings screenshots
I'm still--at least for now--not a fan of the torque sensing. How if at all can I adjust my settings to end up with more "BBSHD-like" performance (= deemphasizing/dampening the torque sensing so each PAS level is more static/BBSHD-like)?
Eggrider settings screenshots
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il Munduato
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- USA
I'd suggest to be patient and adjust how you approach the motors response because once understood and accounted for on your end with riding adjustments the refinement of the Ultra controller is something to be appreciated. Took me about 3 months to get there.
That said on the last page Speed Table if you raise your MinCur% it'll feel more aggressive but still be much more refined/manageable than a BBS
I also found lowering the mV values on the Torque table to be smoother and more responsive than just lowering the corresponding numbers on the Speed Table.
Try something like this....
I've used these but in the end tuned the MinCur% back down for a more efficient natural feel. I've had them as high as 40 without issue.
That said on the last page Speed Table if you raise your MinCur% it'll feel more aggressive but still be much more refined/manageable than a BBS
I also found lowering the mV values on the Torque table to be smoother and more responsive than just lowering the corresponding numbers on the Speed Table.
Try something like this....
I've used these but in the end tuned the MinCur% back down for a more efficient natural feel. I've had them as high as 40 without issue.
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CCroft
Member
Thank you il Munduato! And I think you are right about taking some time to get accustomed to the Ultra controller.
I think the big question is whether I can live with the noise. After my ride yesterday, I'm not convinced that greasing the Ultra made much of a difference at all. At least as far as the noise I'm focused on--the higher-pitched "whine" (maybe from the alternating current running through the motor coils?). I probably would be much better off had I never ridden a quieter motor like the BBSHD
I think the big question is whether I can live with the noise. After my ride yesterday, I'm not convinced that greasing the Ultra made much of a difference at all. At least as far as the noise I'm focused on--the higher-pitched "whine" (maybe from the alternating current running through the motor coils?). I probably would be much better off had I never ridden a quieter motor like the BBSHD
il Munduato
Active Member
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- USA
I agree with you on the noise as I too was spoiled with the virtually silent BBS02B. My attempt to quiet the Ultra with Mobil SHC100 did help a little with a slightly more pleasing tone and lower overall noise level... but it's still not a BBS*
Many have had good results with John Deere Corn Head Grease and I ordered some but still haven't had a chance to try it for myself.
If you search around on here you'll find a few threads discussing it
Many have had good results with John Deere Corn Head Grease and I ordered some but still haven't had a chance to try it for myself.
If you search around on here you'll find a few threads discussing it
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CCroft
Member
I was debating using that JD Corn Head Grease, but recall reading some comments about it not being the best choice compared to SHC100. At this point I'm less concerned about it being the "best choice" so long as it helps with the noise. But I wonder how much of that noise is really due to the physical/"greasable" components compared to the high-pitched "whine" coming from the motor coils (?)...that really seems to be the difference compared to my BBSHD.
I believe the earlier Ultras had a nylon gear (like my BBSHD has). I don't believe these are available any longer, otherwise I might try one. I know plenty of folks have had issues with the nylon ones which is why they switched to the metal gears. I was tempted to switch my BBSHD's nylon gear out with a metal one when I first bought it, but that's going on 7+ years now and I've not had any issues. I put my bike in some high-torque situations (rider/gear weight + off-road inclines), but not high-speed or speed changes, so maybe that has helped avoid problems (?). In any case, at this point I'd sure try that nylon gear in the Ultra to see how much if at all it would reduce the noise.
Here's a crazy idea I caught myself mulling over: is it possible to install a BBSHD in a bike/frame designed for the M620 Ultra (obviously with some modifications and ending up with a not-so-integrated look)? I love everything about this current bike I've pieced together except that Ultra and its noise...it would be close to perfect with the BBSHD--for my needs/riding anyway.
I believe the earlier Ultras had a nylon gear (like my BBSHD has). I don't believe these are available any longer, otherwise I might try one. I know plenty of folks have had issues with the nylon ones which is why they switched to the metal gears. I was tempted to switch my BBSHD's nylon gear out with a metal one when I first bought it, but that's going on 7+ years now and I've not had any issues. I put my bike in some high-torque situations (rider/gear weight + off-road inclines), but not high-speed or speed changes, so maybe that has helped avoid problems (?). In any case, at this point I'd sure try that nylon gear in the Ultra to see how much if at all it would reduce the noise.
Here's a crazy idea I caught myself mulling over: is it possible to install a BBSHD in a bike/frame designed for the M620 Ultra (obviously with some modifications and ending up with a not-so-integrated look)? I love everything about this current bike I've pieced together except that Ultra and its noise...it would be close to perfect with the BBSHD--for my needs/riding anyway.
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