New BBS Middrive!

Adrian said:
The new Bafang "set";

(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
Click to expand...


So they are offering a package now, with the battery. I don't want to do an 'enquiry' but I'm not sure what the process would be for someone buying 1 unit. In other words, is this a retail store?

This would seem to put more pressure on kit vendors, who already lost an edge on the stuff for fat bikes.
 
weren't there supposed to be a few bikes from lectriccycles with this setup at interbike? did anyone get a chance to check it out?
 
did some video googling on lectriccycles interbike 2015 and saw the new motor in hand. nothing good, but a look see.

On a similar topic, what is 'e-rad' is it a brand? is it a technology? see it flying around a lot but my latest google on it just gets a bunch of sales ads.
 
flymeaway said:
I agree with him that 1000W is unnecessary. 750W is overkill for most conversions.

Court J.
Click to expand...

I totally agree with you (I'm running 500W nominal/750W peak and want for nothing more), but Justin from Grin Tech (creator of the Cycle Analyst and ebike motor expert) maintains that 1,200W is the magic number for ebike power. Perhaps he values higher speed up hills that 500W just can't provide.

The guys from Propella Bikes who are selling a 32lb, 250W single-speed ebike with a 6.8Ah bottle battery seem to think that using anything larger than 6.8Ah adds too much weight to a bike such that it's no longer really a bicycle, and ditto with motor power output in excess of 250W.

Seems like everyone has a different take on what the ideal motor power is.
 
I'd like to know the real world power people will run through the HD. What he was running looked like 1500 +, but he had no useable readouts. It will deliver speed on the flats. Tweak it and...?

I thought Turbo Bob summed up the quandary the ebike industry is in:

Editor note: Submitted by Turbo Bob

I wouldn’t be surprised to find America’s motto “More power” inscribed somewhere deep inside this new mid-drive. Folks have been overtaxing these drive conversions to the point of failure trying to get the power this new unit has to spare, now maybe they will be satisfied. With all new electronics, bigger cooling fins and some other advances, it looks like the tide has be turned for all who wish to power their bikes to those gnarly limits. Expect Eric to give you the inside dirt, I will give you the outside feel to the Bafang BBSHD.
 
Adrian said:
Na, I don't think so
Click to expand...

What's a really steep hill? I haven't found anything steep enough to defeat the 750W 48v BBS02. I suppose there are steep hills that would fit a 1000W motor well, but for the vast majority of commuters 1000W is overkill.

Court J.
 
George S. said:
I'd like to know the real world power people will run through the HD
Click to expand...

Speed on the flats isn't a problem for the 750W BBS02. I suppose if someone wants to ride at 35+ effortlessly you might want more then the 750, but at that point I'd suggest an electric motorcycle.

Court J.
 
750w bbs02 is plenty power for climbing steep hills 10 miles/hour, 28 miles + on flat ground using fat tire bike.
 
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flymeaway said:
What's a really steep hill? I haven't found anything steep enough to defeat the 750W 48v BBS02. I suppose there are steep hills that would fit a 1000W motor well, but for the vast majority of commuters 1000W is overkill.

Court J.
Click to expand...
Perhaps the vast majority, but when I'm on my way home, it really irks that I slow to 20kph on the long hill to my house. Sure, my 750w does it, but add a head wind and 10 cm of snow and it gets fairly warm by the time I arrive. I've already blown one controller, I'd prefer not to do that again.
 
sal said:
750w bbs02 is plenty power for climbing steep hills 10 miles/hour, 28 miles + on flat ground using fat tire bike.
Click to expand...

Yikes, that's slow. I use mine for transport and I want to spend as little time as possible getting from A to B so I can do my job or spend time with my family. 10mph may be fine for tootling around on a Sunday afternoon but not for transport.

As for the motorcycle comment; then I'd be restricted to roads and it would actually take longer on my commute due to traffic and the route I'd have to take.
 
Adrian said:
Perhaps the vast majority
Click to expand...

I understand your point, and you have a specific need that you want met. No doubt the larger capacity motor would help meet your need. I have a fairly substantial commute of 14 miles (28 round trip). I have 3 fairly significant grades to climb that are about 1.5 miles in total. I'm 60 years old and I would classify myself as an atypical commuter because of distance and age. I would assume that the typical commuter is more likely urban/suburban (mine is rural) with a round trip commute of no more then 20 miles. I'd also assume that many commuters are more then likely to be less then 50 years old. So when I say the 750W system is more then adequate, I am looking at this cohort.

I think the argument can always be made that a more powerful motor is a necessity for certain conditions. But I also think that the population that needs ever increasing power limits is a small percentage.

Court J.
 
Adrian said:
Perhaps the vast majority, but when I'm on my way home, it really irks that I slow to 20kph on the long hill to my house. Sure, my 750w does it, but add a head wind and 10 cm of snow and it gets fairly warm by the time I arrive. I've already blown one controller, I'd prefer not to do that again.
Click to expand...
What's interesting, to me, is that I don't know where we will really end up with the HD. Right now EM3ev is selling the 750w BBS02 with a 25A controller. So, in a 50 volt system, it's around 1250 watts. From what everyone says, that's trouble for the BBS02. Now they will have a more robust (HD) controller, and who knows where the rating will be. It might be 35A? But either way, the HD should be able to do what the 25A versions of the BBS02 were stretching to do.

I just think it probably is better engineered for anyone who is pushing above 600 watts, using a throttle, or not paying attention to gearing, etc.

Karl always explains the shortcomings of the BBS02 in minute detail, and he continues to use them. Lots of them.

http://electric-fatbike.com/2015/10/02/troubleshooting-problems-on-your-bbs02-unit/

Edit: Apparently the HD will have a 30 amp controller, which is still 1500 watts with 50v system. Karl suggests it is designed to run at 1500 watts.

http://electric-fatbike.com/2015/10/06/to-bbshd-or-not-to-bbshd-that-is-the-question/
 
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flymeaway said:
I understand your point, and you have a specific need that you want met. No doubt the larger capacity motor would help meet your need. I have a fairly substantial commute of 14 miles (28 round trip). I have 3 fairly significant grades to climb that are about 1.5 miles in total. I'm 60 years old and I would classify myself as an atypical commuter because of distance and age. I would assume that the typical commuter is more likely urban/suburban (mine is rural) with a round trip commute of no more then 20 miles. I'd also assume that many commuters are more then likely to be less then 50 years old. So when I say the 750W system is more then adequate, I am looking at this cohort.

I think the argument can always be made that a more powerful motor is a necessity for certain conditions. But I also think that the population that needs ever increasing power limits is a small percentage.

Court J.
Click to expand...
Court J,
Well thought out and intelligent reply. Agree, there will always be an argument for more power. There is also the premise that just because it is there, you don't have to use it, like a car that can go 120mph.

From what I have ready about the bbs02, it seems to have issues if pushed too hard. A commuter can get real comfortable at 750W and cruising 25mph. Add hills and maybe a 1000W motor will hold up more reliably (designed for more power) and will perform better in tight spots.
 
Cameron Newland said:
I totally agree with you (I'm running 500W nominal/750W peak and want for nothing more), but Justin from Grin Tech (creator of the Cycle Analyst and ebike motor expert) maintains that 1,200W is the magic number for ebike power. Perhaps he values higher speed up hills that 500W just can't provide.

The guys from Propella Bikes who are selling a 32lb, 250W single-speed ebike with a 6.8Ah bottle battery seem to think that using anything larger than 6.8Ah adds too much weight to a bike such that it's no longer really a bicycle, and ditto with motor power output in excess of 250W.

Seems like everyone has a different take on what the ideal motor power is.
Click to expand...
CN,

Justin is a hub motor guy (Currently), and they tend to need a bit higher output spec due to inefficiency on hills. Kind of like the claim a 350W MD will perform like a 500W hub, so maybe the 1200W hub would match the 1000W MD? On the flats however, the extra power pulls ahead.
 
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