Juiced Bikes Quality Control Issues?

kev312 · May 31, 2018

I have an RCS on order which "should" get shipped next month. Reading rants from folks who've been waiting for months is one thing. What is really disheartening is hearing about folks who have received their bikes after waiting for months, only to have it break soon after. On top of that, receiving support seems to be hit or miss; some having to wait weeks before there is a resolution.

I started looking at several other brand forums on this site and under the sticky thread Known Issues & Problems with (brand) Products + Help, Solutions & Fixes, the numbers seem to tell a concerning story. JB has been around since 2009 so I feel like they should already be churning out high quality products at this point. I'm starting to re-think my options here, or perhaps I'm just over-reacting. Interested in hearing everyone's thoughts on this.

Known Issues & Problems with Juiced Bikes Products + Help, Solutions & Fixes

Juiced
23 pages
444 replies

Biktrix
0 pages
7 replies

Volt
4 pages
65 replies

Rad Power Bikes
5 pages
99 replies

Darrin NC · May 31, 2018

I'm in the same situation as you with an early April order on a XL CCS 19 ah battery. If it does have problems and I am not a very handy or bike experience person who am I going to fix this thing? I'm sure there are others like me out there. Seems like most people on the forum have much more experience and knowledge of these bikes.

Chris Hammond · May 31, 2018

The popularity of Juiced on this forum is relative to the number of owners, and those wanting to own.

I received my Cross Current S on May 9th. I have put 825 miles on it in the 3 weeks since. The only problem I have had was a failed tail light, Juiced responded to my ticket in less than 24 hours, and shipped a new one the same day. I honestly couldn't be much happier with my bike. I was frustrated while waiting on shipping like many others on this forum.
The bike is clearly very well built and rides very smooth. Everyone I have let ride it has loved it, and many have commented on how solid and smooth the bike is.
I can't speak to the quality of the other bike makers, but Juiced is making a quality product with many happy owners like myself.

Glenn-rod · May 31, 2018

All I can say is my RCS pulled a code 30 at 5 miles that I could not resolve by playing with connections. I pushed to ship the bike back due to transportation damage. Juiced offered me full refund or replacement. I wavered back & forth. So I took my husbands bike for a ride. I went with the replacement - that’s how good the bike is. The bike is sweet. Resolve these problems and you own a killer bike. I will say all the parts are plug and play so you can easily replace what is needed in the future. My husbands RCS has no problems so far. Yes Juiced has issues that need to be addressed. Luis works out of Brazil - Juiced is an international company. We need a U.S. contact who makes solutions happen quickly for new owners. Failure to do this is dragging their reputation down. Problems will arise with 1’st run products there is no reason Juiced can’t shine in resolving them quickly. Don’t let our frustration lead you to question your purchase. We love the bike when it’s working!

jazz · May 31, 2018

I doubt Juiced has sold any more bikes than RadPower and Rad has a solid reputation for great reliable products but even more, great customer service. Juiced bikes are more advanced and complex then Radpower bikes which is all more the reason why you have to put your ducks in a row. I don't understand why Juiced continues to push out new models and not resolve supply and customer issues with their current models.

I love that Tora pushes the envelope with new and exciting offerings but as Uncle Ben said "with great power comes great responsibility."

Bruce Arnold · May 31, 2018

The Biktrix forum has a total of 59 threads and 844 posts. VoltBike: 66 threads, 1,194 posts. By comparison, the Juiced forum has 265 threads and 5,673 posts. So proportionally it's not such a huge difference. Of course there are more posts in the "known issues" thread; there are way more posts altogether. The RadPower forum is is more closely equivalent, at 438 threads and 5,649 posts.
Many if not most of the known issues in the first 15-20 pages have been resolved. For instance: multiple posts about broken spokes prior to Nov. 2017. None since then. Issues that have been resolved have no current relevance, so subtract those from the total.
A small handful of people have posted about serious problems that have occurred since they got their bikes. An equally small number have posted about having no problems, or very minor problems. Thousands of bikes have been sold. None of the available data are sufficient for coming to any conclusions on that score. For all we know, 99% of all Juiced Bikes sold are seriously flawed, or completely flawless. The joy of some, or disappointment/anger of others, is no benchmark.
My stats professor would be so proud.
Henry Ford started building cars in 1899. The Model T ("I will build a car for the great multitude...It will be constructed of the best materials...after the simplest designs that modern engineering can devise. It will be so low in price that no man making a good salary will be unable to own one – and enjoy with his family the blessing of hours of pleasure in God's great open spaces.") was first built in 1908. Interesting correlation there. Maybe being in business for 9 years doesn't mean you should be churning out products to perfection. Maybe it's just a good start.

NeilCruz · May 31, 2018

@kev312

I don't think counting pages for the Problem/solutions thread is an indicative way to measure how many problems a bike company has had.

There is a lot more than "problems" in the threads, there is a lot discussion, and lots of places where conversation goes off topic. And some of us, myself included then to post LONG posts (lol)

I did monitor some other forums to see how active and committed the community is. And the Juiced community seems to be very active.

As I said in another message .. this forum is like our own LBS - where together we will hopefully build a community of knowledge about the glitches, errors, and annoyances.

When I realized that I was going to purchase "Direct to Consumer" there were two factors beyond could I afford an ebike that could carry the load I wanted while travelling the distances I wanted.

(And this goes @Darrin NC as I too have little practical recent experience with biking or bike repair since I was a kid)

Could I find a LocalBikeShop (aka LBS) that would be willing to provide mechanical services (bleed/flush the hydraulic disc brake, perform full tuneup every X thousand miles, etc) at the same prices as if the bike wasn't electric

note:
Of the 4 LBS in a 3.5 mile walk of me, 1 wouldn't service bikes that they didn't sell, 1 charged +100% if you didn't buy from them.
The other two both said something similar to "We can 100% service the non e-bike specific parts and here are our published rates." … One place did add the caveat that they would always service customers who purchased from them 1st, so repairs might be slower.
Could I find an online resource either from official bike company resources or an online community that would have a good chance of helping me with the purely electronic aspect.

So I didn't look on the forums for "who doesn't have problems" -- because less than 10% of the people who don't have problems would even create accounts here. So what I looked for was UNANSWERED messages. Places were people who had issues posted and after 3-4 days they didn't get any feedback from anyone. That's what you should watch out for.

So if you are looking for a 100% sure thing, no problems for 2 years bike assurance, then.. well... just how much are you willing to pay.

But if you have a problem and post it here, right now this seems to be one of the best communities for getting help. There are people who have the bikes and post a lot. There are people who are in the industry who post a lot (Jazz for example)

To put it another way - I'm not expecting to get a perfect bike that will never have a problem. I am hoping that I'm buying from a company who will stand behind their products to the best of their ability. Based on how they handled major problems in the past (The spoke issue) and how they have handled recent RCS issues I still think Juiced is TRYING to do right by the customers. Maybe not as fast as we hope .. but so far when one of us calls out for help here on the forums they get more than "crickets"

With YouTube, local bike clinics, and this forum I hope to get many years out of my bike which arrives tomorrow. (80 days from order to arrived at the door).

Barry S · Jun 1, 2018

I appreciate the attempt to come up with some sort of analysis of reported issues by owners here in this forum, but this is a small group compared to all the units sold and some members have multiple bikes from different companies. I treat user reviews here like I would on any other product site: You've got those on one end of the spectrum that think their bike was created by the finger of God and couldn't be more perfect; the other end of the spectrum is occupied by the most disgruntled of buyers who couldn't be made happy if you gave them their money back and a better bike at no charge. While I enjoy reading all of the posts, I concentrate on what lies in-between because I see those as more balanced reviews.

@kev312, I am looking forward to reading your first impressions of your RCS when it arrives because I know you've been counting the days and frustrated as "all get out" as we say in the South (I miss NC). When I eventually click the SUBMIT button and place my order, I'm going to let everyone know about my ride. Hopefully, a single picture of my smile from ear to ear will be enough.

kev312 · Jun 1, 2018

Thank you everyone for sharing your thoughts & opinions

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NeilCruz · Jun 1, 2018

And yet @Rooster , you were part of the "fan base" until you discovered that Juiced wouldn't accommodate you with some electrical or motor upgrades. (Reading between the lines it seems like you wanted to add a front hub motor to your Ocean Current OR you wanted to stick the more powerful CCS motor into the rear and you were "promised" upgradability)

You went from recommending Juiced on Nov 9th 2017 where you said:

Other than the problems I have had with trying to upgrade I must say that I am quite happy with my ocean current.

On Nov 11th 2017 you are still working on your "build"

Then suddenly with no other posts on Nov 13th you start talking about some long standing problem you have had with Juiced.

I can't find a post from you actually having a problem with the Ocean Current (as sold) until Nov 13th when you suddenly reference your long standing problem.

You later, while still being unclear about the problem, say that

I really don't care wether they send me a frame or not, hell,what good is the frame gonna do me if I can't get the upgrade to go with it.

Well I am sorry that you interpreted "Upgradability" to mean that Juiced committed to future proof your bike, letting you swap in components from newer models into older model bikes, or support you in adding 2nd motors or replacing the existing motor.

That the ECU on the Ocean current that you purchased could not drive 2 motors, or for that mater is calibrated just for the motor that came with the Ocean current and can't be upgraded to the 750W motor from the RCS is EXPECTED.

Per your own words, Juiced offered to send a you a full extra frame to experiment with, and yet you still felt snubbed.

So now you spend your time doing DIY projects and bashing Juiced. And you call us "fan club" or in other ways try to reduce the value of anyone who thinks Juiced is trying to do a good job. Every time one of us "fan club" members tries to get details from you about what your problem was you respond as if the question wasn't asked. You just say your "long standing problem" or other vague references.

Chris has 825 miles on it. Who cares if that's 3 weeks or 3 months. He at least is honest and upfront about where his perspective is coming from both positive and negative.

///
And now I find myself wondering why I just wasted 2 hours researching and writing this.

KAM1952 · Jun 1, 2018

NeilCruz said:
And yet @Rooster , you were part of the "fan base" until you discovered that Juiced wouldn't accommodate you with some electrical or motor upgrades. (Reading between the lines it seems like you wanted to add a front hub motor to your Ocean Current OR you wanted to stick the more powerful CCS motor into the rear and you were "promised" upgradability)

You went from recommending Juiced on Nov 9th 2017 where you said:

On Nov 11th 2017 you are still working on your "build"

Then suddenly with no other posts on Nov 13th you start talking about some long standing problem you have had with Juiced.

I can't find a post from you actually having a problem with the Ocean Current (as sold) until Nov 13th when you suddenly reference your long standing problem.

You later, while still being unclear about the problem, say that

Well I am sorry that you interpreted "Upgradability" to mean that Juiced committed to future proof your bike, letting you swap in components from newer models into older model bikes, or support you in adding 2nd motors or replacing the existing motor.

That the ECU on the Ocean current that you purchased could not drive 2 motors, or for that mater is calibrated just for the motor that came with the Ocean current and can't be upgraded to the 750W motor from the RCS is EXPECTED.

Per your own words, Juiced offered to send a you a full extra frame to experiment with, and yet you still felt snubbed.

So now you spend your time doing DIY projects and bashing Juiced. And you call us "fan club" or in other ways try to reduce the value of anyone who thinks Juiced is trying to do a good job. Every time one of us "fan club" members tries to get details from you about what your problem was you respond as if the question wasn't asked. You just say your "long standing problem" or other vague references.

Chris has 825 miles on it. Who cares if that's 3 weeks or 3 months. He at least is honest and upfront about where his perspective is coming from both positive and negative.

///
And now I find myself wondering why I just wasted 2 hours researching and writing this.

Thanks for yor research Neil......I could never find Roosters problem on the forum.....now I know why.....he never had a problem.

Guitartec · Jun 2, 2018

jazz said:
I doubt Juiced has sold any more bikes than RadPower and Rad has a solid reputation for great reliable products but even more, great customer service. Juiced bikes are more advanced and complex then Radpower bikes which is all more the reason why you have to put your ducks in a row. I don't understand why Juiced continues to push out new models and not resolve supply and customer issues with their current models.

I love that Tora pushes the envelope with new and exciting offerings but as Uncle Ben said "with great power comes great responsibility."

Service and supply issues are not resolved at JB because an engineer is running the company. Tora is amazing at concepts and engineering, but I've seen this Engineer /CEO scenario before. It usually does not work out well... He'll design incredible products you either can't get or you can't get serviced. Things will no doubt get better as time marches on, but unless he has the foresight to hire someone to run the company (who won't steal it from him) he's just too busy to fix things he doesn't really care about. He wants to engineer stuff. JMHO

Bruce Arnold · Jun 2, 2018

Guitartec said:
Service and supply issues are not resolved at JB because an engineer is running the company. Tora is amazing at concepts and engineering, but I've seen this Engineer /CEO scenario before. It usually does not work out well... He'll design incredible products you either can't get or you can't get serviced. Things will no doubt get better as time marches on, but unless he has the foresight to hire someone to run the company (who won't steal it from him) he's just too busy to fix things he doesn't really care about. He wants to engineer stuff. JMHO

Not the first time this has been said. Probably won't be the last either! I'm totally okay with having a brilliant engineer at the head of the company so long as he puts real resources and authority into the hands of someone who can run the service end for him.

Guitartec · Jun 2, 2018

Bruce Arnold said:
Not the first time this has been said. Probably won't be the last either! I'm totally okay with having a brilliant engineer at the head of the company so long as he puts real resources and authority into the hands of someone who can run the service end for him.

I'm totally okay with it too. Thank you Tora!

JeffMD · Jun 3, 2018

kev312 said:
I started looking at several other brand forums on this site and under the sticky thread Known Issues & Problems with (brand) Products + Help, Solutions & Fixes, the numbers seem to tell a concerning story. JB has been around since 2009 so I feel like they should already be churning out high quality products at this point. I'm starting to re-think my options here, or perhaps I'm just over-reacting. Interested in hearing everyone's thoughts on this.

Known Issues & Problems with Juiced Bikes Products + Help, Solutions & Fixes

Juiced
23 pages
444 replies

Well there's your problem. You've never been in that thread have you? Threads like these are filled with not only problems that pop up, but users posting their answers, updates on if issues have been resolved, as well as suggesting alternatives. It is essentially the "general" thread of the forum. Its a thread whos popularity is exponentially impacted by the number of owners.

kev312 · Jun 3, 2018

JeffMD said:
Well there's your problem. You've never been in that thread have you? Threads like these are filled with not only problems that pop up, but users posting their answers, updates on if issues have been resolved, as well as suggesting alternatives. It is essentially the "general" thread of the forum. Its a thread whos popularity is exponentially impacted by the number of owners.

Yes I have, have you? It's not a "general" thread, it's a thread that focuses on problems and issues. Popularity can influence the number of overall posts in each respective brand's forum. If you are saying that the majority of members who visit EBR's forums are primarily Juiced owners, then perhaps your statement is true. But I highly doubt that, as there are many other brands out there that are just as popular, if not more.

JeffMD · Jun 3, 2018

kev312 said:
Yes I have, have you? It's not a "general" thread, it's a thread that focuses on problems and issues. Popularity can influence the number of overall posts in each respective brand's forum. If you are saying that the majority of members who visit EBR's forums are primarily Juiced owners, then perhaps your statement is true. But I highly doubt that, as there are many other brands out there that are just as popular, if not more.

You can count the number of my post in it. ^^

And no, I just consider that a lot of juiced owners have made the juiced ebr forum their main forum.

The issue is you are taking to issue that a thread that has so many different replies is mostly negative responses when they are not, especially of the last 6 months.

kev312 · Jun 3, 2018

JeffMD said:
You can count the number of my post in it. ^^

And no, I just consider that a lot of juiced owners have made the juiced ebr forum their main forum.

The issue is you are taking to issue that a thread that has so many different replies is mostly negative responses when they are not, especially of the last 6 months.

I think a lot of owners of different brands have made EBR's forum their main forum.

I posted out of concern to see if there was any correlation to the number of posts and actual issues as compared to some of the other brands out there. So if it's a thread that is exponentially impacted by the number of owners like you say, then in my mind other equally popular brands should in theory have a similar amount of posting activity, unless there aren't very many issues to discuss or report on.

Lately, I've been reading posts from folks who have been getting great support and speedy resolution; this has definitely built up my confidence in the brand. Also its refreshing to see that Tora frequents this forum and is acting on the feedback and concerns he's seen, which is awesome.

Glenn-rod · Jun 9, 2018

Update - I got my replacement RCS Friday. Today I assembled it and took it on a 10 mile run. It runs great!! Juiced has been addressing our concerns. The replacement came by UPS. The box had 2 poly straps it at each end. Fragile labels were applied on all sides. Improvements were made to the inside packaging as well. I sent pictures to Juiced so they can see how the revised packaging held up on its cross country trip. Very happy I had them replace my bike rather than take a refund. The RCS is so much fun to ride on grass, gravel roads and pavement. Here's pictures of our bikes.