I have "mountainized" my Vado 5.0/6.0: Practical conclusions

Stefan Mikes

Well-Known Member
Region
Europe
City
Mazovia, Poland
As a person living in a flatland (with occasional rolling hills), I was quite happy with the 2020 setup of my Vado 5.0/6.0, which was a 48T chainring and 11-42T cassette. On a rare road mountain trip, I was met with a difficulty: I could hardly climb a 14% grade incline, which was relatively short. Now, confronted with numerous mountain road trips (and sometimes off-road ones), I had to rethink the gearing (and other aspects) of my full power e-bike.

The major change I made to my Vado was to replace the existing chainring with Shimano STEPS SM-CRE80/SM-CRE80-B one, a 38T chainring. I used steel MTB chainring bolts because I was afraid aluminium bolts could be too delicate. By that occasion, I learned you never use a torque wrench to tighten the chainring bolts: you do this by feeling, tightening the screws for several times until they got properly seated. Additionally, I used a Loctite Blue equivalent threadlocker.

Before the chainring replacement, I swapped the 11-42T cassette for the 11-46T 11-speed one (which was the original specification of my Vado). Effectively, the 38-46T granny gear produced the gearing of approximately 23 gear-inches, which was close to the proper MTB gearing. The gearing change also meant dropping many links in the existing (new) chain.

To ensure good traction, I reduced tyre pressure to 3 bar (44 psi), which was the rated minimum inflation for the Smart Sam 47-622 tyres.

The thing I overlooked (and it could cost me dear life) was tightening the stem bolts. Good I noticed handlebars having had turned slightly on a fast downhill ride, and I could fix it before any disaster happened.

I had also thoroughly inspected the TRP Zurich 4-piston hydraulic brakes prior to the trip. The total thickness of the front brake pad (metal and the pad itself) was 3.5 mm (Tektro says you should replace the pads at 2.5 mm). The brakes were totally quiet on steep descents and the braking was excellent.

Conclusions:
  • The e-bike has got enormous acceleration capability. Start in the middle gears, and my Vado can accelerate as a rocket;
  • The practical cruising speed on the flat dropped to some 32 km/h at cadence of 80 rpm;
  • There was no incline the e-bike could not handle: was it a 19.5% road climb or 17% off-road ascent; and I could still breathe and speak;
  • On downhill rides, I could pedal up to 38 km/h at cadence of 80-85; above that speed, pedalling was not necessary.
This graphics could be interesting. The longest and most difficult ride so far, and the first 604 Wh battery (nominal) was used until the charge dropped to 5%:

1629174685997.png

It is interesting too see the motor was not working at all during approximately 10-km-long steep descent.

The steepest ascent calculated on the route was 19.5% (not 18.9) but that was very short. While the total climb there was 8 km, with average grade of 5%.

I'm so happy with the mod I made to my Vado that I might want to keep that setup for the future. Anyway, I'm not going back to the 48T ring. A 42T or 44T would do.
 
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Wow Stefan, those are some great modifications.
I so very much want to change the gearing on my Trek class one. It’s too low for my type of riding and I can’t seem to find a comfortable cadence. The front chainring is only 38 teeth. Wanted to bump it up to 42, maybe 44. However I’m hearing that those changes might trigger a shutdown in the Bosch motor because it thinks it’s being over ridden. Darn Bosch motor. Probably going to sell this bike.
So now I’m very much appreciating my Vado and the Brose motor.
 
@VoltMan99, please don't go bananas and be reasonable.
I bought a steel chainring because I could get it in 24 hours (it was simply available at the moment). I actually didn't need a steel ring.

It was different with the bolts. It is fairly easy to pull the aluminium bolt/nut (it happened to me once) so I took the safe approach and bought several sets of steel bolts for my stock many months ago.

It is interesting you need to remove the motor cover of the "big" Vado if you want to use standard MTB chainring bolts with nuts. Chainring nut wrench is necessary, too. Praxis chainrings have their holes threaded so they neither require the nut nor wrench, and the operation can be done without removing the motor cover.
 
Wow Stefan, those are some great modifications.
I so very much want to change the gearing on my Trek class one. It’s too low for my type of riding and I can’t seem to find a comfortable cadence. The front chainring is only 38 teeth. Wanted to bump it up to 42, maybe 44. However I’m hearing that those changes might trigger a shutdown in the Bosch motor because it thinks it’s being over ridden. Darn Bosch motor. Probably going to sell this bike.
So now I’m very much appreciating my Vado and the Brose motor.
You don't live in a very hilly area, do you, Marci Jo?

What generation is your Bosch motor? Judging by the chainring size that's Gen 4?
 
You don't live in a very hilly area, do you, Marci Jo?

What generation is your Bosch motor? Judging by the chainring size that's Gen 4?

Correct. Here in the upper Midwest of U.S. it’s fairly flat overall. Farm county. Bigger hills are along river banks and big Lake Superior. So although there are some fun hills around my area, I certainly would not consider them significant. Consequently the Vado flies over them!

The Trek class one is a 2019 Dual Sport Plus with gen 3 motor. I got it for a fabulous price, since it was being replaced by the Allant 7. And I certainly can’t complain about it’s weight. Fresh from the factory, in its “birthday suit” it weighs 45 lbs, and that’s with the 500 wh battery. Makes it easier to haul. And riding without power feels like a regular hybrid bike.

I can certainly understand why you went with some mountain gears for your really hilly area. Considering the torque of 90 nm I’m sure it feels like a rocket 🚴🏾‍♂️ 🚀.
 
I can certainly understand why you went with some mountain gears for your really hilly area. Considering the torque of 90 nm I’m sure it feels like a rocket 🚴🏾‍♂️ 🚀.
We have the same motors in our Vados, Marci. While Vado 6.0 seems to be super strong on the flat, it is not so on significant ascents, especially when the rider has bad legs.

The mountains I was riding in are certainly not the biggest in the world but they certainly deserve respect. Fancy yourself riding for several kilometres (well, miles) uphill. You're in Turbo and in low gear. Vado won't let you down but it is not as easy as one might think. You need to steadily pedal at quite high cadence, and you must not stop pedalling! After some time, you can feel your backside hurts but apart from a slight change of the seated position you cannot do anything else. Your mouth becomes dry (that's why some people are riding with a camelback), your hands get numb; but you must not stop pedalling :) You can see how slowly you climb despite of vigorous pedalling, and say, you need to continue the climb for 30 minutes...

Even if I had good legs, I could not climb on a traditional bike. The powerful Vado motor combined with proper gearing makes such rides feasible. And I am so happy about it!

P.S. Czech people told me they fully accepted the 25 km/h Euro e-bikes. The reason being, you cannot climb fast anyway; and you don't need any motor to descend :)
 
We have the same motors in our Vados, Marci. While Vado 6.0 seems to be super strong on the flat, it is not so on significant ascents, especially when the rider has bad legs.

The mountains I was riding in are certainly not the biggest in the world but they certainly deserve respect. Fancy yourself riding for several kilometres (well, miles) uphill. You're in Turbo and in low gear. Vado won't let you down but it is not as easy as one might think. You need to steadily pedal at quite high cadence, and you must not stop pedalling! After some time, you can feel your backside hurts but apart from a slight change of the seated position you cannot do anything else. Your mouth becomes dry (that's why some people are riding with a camelback), your hands get numb; but you must not stop pedalling :) You can see how slowly you climb despite of vigorous pedalling, and say, you need to continue the climb for 30 minutes...

Even if I had good legs, I could not climb on a traditional bike. The powerful Vado motor combined with proper gearing makes such rides feasible. And I am so happy about it!

P.S. Czech people told me they fully accepted the 25 km/h Euro e-bikes. The reason being, you cannot climb fast anyway; and you don't need any motor to descend :)
@Stefan Mikes did you take the fenders out. Will they interfere with some of the off road tracks (specially if mud exists).
could you send some pics.
 
@Stefan Mikes did you take the fenders out. Will they interfere with some of the off road tracks (specially if mud exists).
could you send some pics.
I didn't. Instead, I use 1.75" tyres instead of the 2.0" specified for my Vado. Best pictures:

1629229015883.png

A fast descent. That was the moment I discovered the handlebars turned a little...

1629229095629.png

A 17% grade max, ascent on pebbles. That was a hard one.

1629229175082.png

Never, I said "never" try riding on rocks like those. Unless that is an MTB, frames tend to snap there. @Dallant: That was above my pay grade... :D


Having said the above, my "mountainized" Vado turned out to be perfect for mountain road rides, including some gravel roads or fire-roads.

1629229553754.png

Celebrating a 19.5% max climb. My brother always locks his full suspension out while on road. (I'm wearing a HR monitor on my forearm; my heart rate never went above 126 on that ride).
 
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Marci Jo and Dallant don't have to fight a lot of hills, IIRC. Headwinds are a very different story.
How did I get involved in this?!
My normal workout ride of 27 miles includes an elevation gain of 1,205 feet. Certainly no mountains but quite a number of hills AND headwinds. I’ve never felt the need to mess with the Allant+7 gearing but then leg power has never been an issue for me and I often ride up the outward bound hills in EMTB mode and do use Turbo on the last two or three hills heading back home. I never pedal going downhill and often hit 35+mph. My HR rarely gets over 115 mostly due to meds.
 
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Never, I said "never" try riding on rocks like those. Unless that is an MTB, frames tend to snap there. @Dallant: That was above my pay grade... :D
Smart decision…it may be MORE mountainized, but not FULLY mountainized!😉
I still can’t believe my Rail 5 didn’t suffer a brake problem when this big stick got lodged between my front brake rotor and spokes! I got it out and there was no problem!
FD78E6A5-2329-4B45-8FC2-4D1BA357F9F8.jpeg
 
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