Thinking about ordering the Vado SL 5.0 EQ step-thru this season. I am debating about the purchase somewhat, as I tried the 4.0 non-EQ and wasn't overly impressed. That said, I was wondering if anyone has upgraded their stock wheels to Rivol or other carbon wheels. The weight savings isn't terribly great, according to Specialized, but I'm wondering if the ride quality would be substantially better when riding paved paths that are less than perfectly smooth due to gaps created by cold weather and subsequent thawing.
Has anyone put carbon rims on a Vado SL 5.0 EQ Step-Thru?
- Thread starter grnmtnbk
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Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
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- Europe
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- Mazovia, PL
Why expensive carbon wheels if there are other (and cheaper) means to improve the ride comfort? First of all, you mentioned the SL 5.0. That model comes with a carbon fibre fork and Future Shock 1.5 front suspension. I went another way by getting me Vado SL 4.0 EQ, then adding Redshift ShockStop system front and rear. You wouldn't believe how buttery my rides have become! (And before the modification the SL 4.0 was unpleasantly shaky).
(I mentioned the 4.0 EQ as that version gives you full freedom as to the selection of the suspension seat-post).
Vado SL 4.0 EQ with Redshift ShockStop stem and seat-post. I keep higher inflation pressure in the wheels for low rolling resistance as ShockStop filters the most of vibration out anyway.
Thank you your response. The question is not why. Rather, the question is whether anyone has done precisely what I asked. I am familiar with how the 5.0 is spec'd. I am also familiar with many aftermarket products that one might use on a Vado SL. But again, my question was specifically about carbon wheels and whether anyone has gone that route. Perhaps I should have prefaced my question more clearly. Thank you for your thoughts.
rochrunner
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- Rochester Hills MI
I also get annoyed in many forums when my question is answered with a question. That said, I don't have any experience to relate but will be following the responses here since I might also consider some aftermarket wheels, probably after my first year with the bike.
I remember enjoying spec'ing a full custom wheel build (choice of rims, hubs, spokes, lacing pattern, etc.) for a previous road bike of mine and how great they looked and performed. I'd possibly go that route again except that the SL is a bit non-standard in a couple of ways. For one thing, it uses what they call "Boost" hub sizing, 110mm wide on the front and 148mm on the rear. There are wheelsets and hubs for that, but the ones I've seen so far use a 15mm axle in front and 12mm in the rear, whereas the SL has 12mm front and rear. Also, a lot of those size wheels are more for MTBs and have wider rims for wider tires (the SL rims have 22mm internal width). Of course, one could always keep the OEM Specialized hubs and just have new (carbon?) rims laced to them.
Keep us posted on what you find.
Over50
Well-Known Member
I don't have the step through but I did put carbon rims on my 5.0 EQ. And I'd do it again. That, combined with all the other mods I made, have made it one awesome commuter bike.
Over50's Specialized Turbo Vado SL 5 EQ (& Como SL 5) Chronicles
My first non-Bosch e-bike. It hasn't gotten off to a great start. I don't have the bike yet (tomorrow - maybe) but my service experience with the LBS from date of order to now has been the worst I've ever had for any large purchase. I can't go into all of the details here because I want to keep...
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mschwett
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I believe any wheels which will fit a creo will fit the Vado SL, 12x110 up front and 12x148 in the back. there are a few out there ready to roll in wider rim sizes that would suit a Vado, like the Terra CLX Boost. no idea if the included driver will work with your rear cassette, but not a hard swap.
www.specialized.com
Light wheels and tires are one of the most noticeable upgrades you can make for a bike, but I haven’t personally ridden a Vado SL with carbon wheels.
Made for riders, by riders. | Specialized.com
From seasoned pros and weekend warriors, to kids and commuters—if you ride, we’re for you. We believe bikes have the power to change lives. This simple truth drives us to be—and do—better.
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Light wheels and tires are one of the most noticeable upgrades you can make for a bike, but I haven’t personally ridden a Vado SL with carbon wheels.
Deacon Blues
Well-Known Member
When you're riding an 18 pound carbon road bike a 1 pound wheel weight savings can actually be felt, especially on hills. On a 55 pound ebike......no so much.
Having said that, last year I bought and installed a set of carbon wheels on my Cannondale Topstone Neo Lefty 3, which weighs 39 pounds.
Was I able to notice the weight difference when riding? Nope.
Having said that, last year I bought and installed a set of carbon wheels on my Cannondale Topstone Neo Lefty 3, which weighs 39 pounds.
Was I able to notice the weight difference when riding? Nope.
mschwett
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- USA
no doubt. but this thread is not about a 55 pound ebike, it’s about a 33lb vado sl.
when i upgraded my creo to carbon wheels with lighter tubeless tires, it was extremely noticeable when riding with the assist off.
Thank you all for your input. After receiving your thoughts, I reached out to Specialized. My contacts confirmed the following regarding the 2022 Vado SL 5.0 EQ:
1) because of its lightweight, it does not require a "boost" sized hub as MTBs do;
2) while the weight savings isn't terribly great (see my original post), suppleness and rotational weight will likely improve;
3) the Rapide C38 by Roval is the recommended carbon wheel set, if an upgrade is made. The set presently retails at $1,100. This is a 21mm (width) x 38mm (depth) rim, tubeless ready rim, with DT Swiss Competition Race spokes, and DT Swiss 370 Classic, Centerlock hubs. (See https://www.specialized.com/us/en/rapide-c-38/p/205534?color=330189-205534&searchText=30021-4500). These measurements closely align but do not match the Vado SL 5.0's stock wheels of 22mm (width) x 23mm (depth). (See https://www.specialized.com/us/en/turbo-vado-sl-5-0-step-through-eq/p/188204?color=335520-188204). When I asked Specialized about these small differences, my contact responded that the C38 will be compatible with the original Nimbus II Sport tires (although they aren't tubeless ready), and the C38's higher depth will aid in efficiency.
1) because of its lightweight, it does not require a "boost" sized hub as MTBs do;
2) while the weight savings isn't terribly great (see my original post), suppleness and rotational weight will likely improve;
3) the Rapide C38 by Roval is the recommended carbon wheel set, if an upgrade is made. The set presently retails at $1,100. This is a 21mm (width) x 38mm (depth) rim, tubeless ready rim, with DT Swiss Competition Race spokes, and DT Swiss 370 Classic, Centerlock hubs. (See https://www.specialized.com/us/en/rapide-c-38/p/205534?color=330189-205534&searchText=30021-4500). These measurements closely align but do not match the Vado SL 5.0's stock wheels of 22mm (width) x 23mm (depth). (See https://www.specialized.com/us/en/turbo-vado-sl-5-0-step-through-eq/p/188204?color=335520-188204). When I asked Specialized about these small differences, my contact responded that the C38 will be compatible with the original Nimbus II Sport tires (although they aren't tubeless ready), and the C38's higher depth will aid in efficiency.
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Stefan Mikes
Gravel e-biker
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, PL
If you are going with the carbon wheels, I can only recommend Specialized Pathfinder Pro 2Bliss 38-622 tyres in tubeless setup. Using inferior Nimbus tyres would be a grave mistake here compared to the quality of the wheels.
rochrunner
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- Rochester Hills MI
Are you sure about #1? According to the Specialized web site, the Vado SL 5.0 has front and rear hub widths of 110mm and 148mm, which is what "Boost" sizing is (at least according to my understanding). Non-boost hubs would be 100mm and 142mm.
mschwett
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- USA
1mm of width won’t make any difference in the rim width; the depth of the rim is entirely preference - deeper means faster once rolling (more aerodynamic) but generally slightly heavier and more susceptible to the effects of strong crosswinds. 38mm is a nice depth.
the vado SL and creo SL absolutely have road boost hubs; there is a version of the C38 with boost hubs (the version that comes on an expert creo), or one could use an adapter on the standard version.
kahn
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- northWET washington
I THINK you are right. I've got the Aluminum Creo which is an SL bike and these are its specs:
WHEELS
Front WheelDT R470 Boost, 12x110mm
Rear Wheel
DT R470 Boost, 12x148mm
Rider51
Member
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- USA
I might be missing something here, but what are you trying to accomplish by upgrading to carbon wheels? Speed? Distance? More comfortable ride? You said you weren't overly impressed by the 4.0, but didn't say exactly why. Harsher ride? Not quite as much power or speed as you were hoping for?
You would need a spacer to fit the non-boost wheels on your bike. It can be done. It's better though to buy the actual boost wheelset they recommend, you'll get a tiny bit better performance.
Nearly all carbon wheels are also more aerodynamic than alloy. This matters most at speed. I don't know how fast you are, but most people can probably get a Vado SL up to the 15+ mph where you'll see these benefits in Sport, or certainly Turbo modes (on flats or rollers).
Tires indeed are going to make a difference. The stock Nimbus tires are more on the comfortable/safety side of things, with good flat protection. Agree the Pathfinder Pro is a far superior tire. Though it lacks the nifty reflective sidewall if you're riding at night in a city. You could fit I believe down to a 28mm tire on those carbon wheels, maybe a 25. That could be a pretty rough ride, but the performance you'd get from something like the Continental GP5000 TL is approaching Creo territory. Cruising along in the 20-25mph speed range on such a bike would be within reach for most fit riders. That's plenty fast for a bicycle.
I fully agree with Stefan on RedShift, certainly the stem. If you are looking to eliminate the harshness on your ride, this device will help a great deal. I was a skeptic of these things, thinking they were a gimmick (many similar in the past were), but this device, especially on an e-bike like the Vado SL 4.0 is incredible. Very impressive piece of engineering. Have not tried the saddle (still skeptical maybe!).
I guess this goes back to my original question. Are you looking for better performance? Comfort?
You would need a spacer to fit the non-boost wheels on your bike. It can be done. It's better though to buy the actual boost wheelset they recommend, you'll get a tiny bit better performance.
Nearly all carbon wheels are also more aerodynamic than alloy. This matters most at speed. I don't know how fast you are, but most people can probably get a Vado SL up to the 15+ mph where you'll see these benefits in Sport, or certainly Turbo modes (on flats or rollers).
Tires indeed are going to make a difference. The stock Nimbus tires are more on the comfortable/safety side of things, with good flat protection. Agree the Pathfinder Pro is a far superior tire. Though it lacks the nifty reflective sidewall if you're riding at night in a city. You could fit I believe down to a 28mm tire on those carbon wheels, maybe a 25. That could be a pretty rough ride, but the performance you'd get from something like the Continental GP5000 TL is approaching Creo territory. Cruising along in the 20-25mph speed range on such a bike would be within reach for most fit riders. That's plenty fast for a bicycle.
I fully agree with Stefan on RedShift, certainly the stem. If you are looking to eliminate the harshness on your ride, this device will help a great deal. I was a skeptic of these things, thinking they were a gimmick (many similar in the past were), but this device, especially on an e-bike like the Vado SL 4.0 is incredible. Very impressive piece of engineering. Have not tried the saddle (still skeptical maybe!).
I guess this goes back to my original question. Are you looking for better performance? Comfort?
Over50
Well-Known Member
Here's what I went with:
Rims: WTB CZR i23 28 hole, WTB CZR i23 24-hole (total cost about $1150)
Rear Hub: Onyx Vesper MTB Boost CL MS 148/12 Thru-bolt rear hub (#102702), Vesper hub shell (#102702-099848-S-28-ano-bkm-101799), spoke count 28 black matte, hub widgets anodized blue (blue/black hub matched bike paint scheme) - total cost about $500
Tires: Schwalbe Marathon E-Plus; these are great on gravel and mixed surface; heavier than stock Specialized tires weight partially offset with lighter tubes
Tubes: Schwalbe Aerothan
Note: Onyx does not advertise the Vesper as e-bike rated but given the light-assist and low-torque nature of the Vado SL, we thought it a good choice. Been wonderful so far.
Front hub we re-used the stock hub
Also swapped out drivetrain to SRAM AXS.
Also added Salsa Rustler handlebar, Ergon grips/saddle, Redshift seatpost.
My bike shop mechanic is a bike-genius. He did a great job of building the wheelset.
My goals with all upgrades were 1) ride quality/comfort, 2) performance, 3) reliability (ie quality components such as flatless Schwalbe tires, Onyx hub ...)
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Have you removed the dork disc yet?
rochrunner
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- Rochester Hills MI
I'm also considering the Vesper hub. Using a sprag clutch instead of pawls or ratchets makes it totally silent. I'm not sure why I'm so focused on a silent freewheel, but there it is. Of course, they don't come cheap and I'll probably go with a different front hub. Compared to the rear, it seems like these are almost a commodity component unless you're a real weight weenie (and a weight weenie would not be on an e-bike in the first place).
As for @mfgrep ' post above, I had an experienced rider berate me the other day for taking mine off, telling me stories about disastrous chain jams, etc. Considering that I'm now 76 and have never dropped a chain off the inside of a cassette, I'm not going to put it back on, but did think about it for a while.
I'm now over 1000 miles on the stock Vado SL and I still cannot get accustomed to the sound of my rear hub while freewheeling. Of course there are the pluses.....people can hear me coming....and I cannot hear my brake rotors rubbing over the clicking lol. It reminds me of catching the 'big one' when the fish strength exceeds the drag setting on my deep sea fishing reel.
I'm so confused as to what I would purchase, lubricate, or change to quiet the hub. For now I wait patiently for someone to post an in depth tutorial lol.
rochrunner
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- Rochester Hills MI
I've had very good luck just pulling off the freewheel/cassette assembly (no tools required) and lubing it with a proper freewheel grease. So far it's lasted a few hundred miles with no further attention required.
I'm not sure that I wish to do this every 3 weeks. A more permanent solution is preferred.
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