GPS and its accuracy?

dodgeman

Well-Known Member
Region
USA
City
Macomb, Illinois
I see this discussed all the time. I’m a retired land surveyor and started using it in the early 1990’s. A couple of points.

Originally this was designed for the United States military. Of course smart people found other uses. Until the year 2000 there was something called Selective Availability (SA). This degraded the signal to an accuracy of 100 meters. In 2000 SA was turned off and the accuracy is now about 10 meters in open sky’s.

This 10 meter accuracy is for an uncorrected signal. Surveyors have generally always us a corrected signal through the use of a second unit set on a known point broadcasting a radio signal. This is now often available through a cell phone link so a second unit isn’t needed. Surveyors get an accuracy of around 1 cm.

There are also other corrections available, often called mapping grade. This gives an accuracy of about 1 meter and is typically what something like a Garmin will give you.

GPS needs open sky’s to perform its best. GPS signals are weak and are prone to bouncing around, called multi path. This degrades the accuracy. There has been very little improvement made to the GPS satellites themselves. The biggest improvements have been the receivers and the software.

There are now multiple constellations. Europe=Galileo, the Russians= Glonass, the Chinese=Bediou, Japanese=QZSS, USA= GPS. Depending on the equipment it might use some or all of these.

When I first started using GPS we had to use mission planning software to see when we could work. There weren’t always enough satellites available. Most of the systems the satellites are rising and setting over a period of hours. There might have been several hours there weren’t enough visible. It takes multiple satellites to get a position, 5 is the normal number needed. That is no longer a problem, there are often more than 20 visible.

The clocks are the weak point in the satellites. Most are up there still functioning except for the clocks. Time is a critical component of how it works.
 
@dodgeman, please tell me.

When I had a Wahoo Roam v1, it had a single GPS receiver. The accuracy was adequate, and the GPS fix was achieved almost immediately post the device start. Now, Wahoo Bolt or Roam v2 have a dual GPS receiver. It takes a lot of time to get the initial GPS fix! Any ideas why that happens?
 
I use a Garmin 60 XCS that I bought new in 2000?
It has been a very reliable and accurate GPS. I did find out, when using the external antenna the accuracy improved a lot, usually to within 3' or less, as compared to just the OEM antenna, when hunting in Oregon/Idaho tall timber forest's.
I have made antenna mounts to fit all the toys for the magnetic base, I do a lot of Geo caching, when out and about.
ymmv
 
@dodgeman, please tell me.

When I had a Wahoo Roam v1, it had a single GPS receiver. The accuracy was adequate, and the GPS fix was achieved almost immediately post the device start. Now, Wahoo Bolt or Roam v2 have a dual GPS receiver. It takes a lot of time to get the initial GPS fix! Any ideas why that happens?
I'm not aware of any consumer grade GPS receivers that will give you an accurate, immediate fix. The exception would be if the GPS was turned off and then back on again within a short period of time, and not moved significantly from the original position.

GPS receivers need to acquire signals from at least 3 satellites to fix a position. The more satellites, the better the position accuracy. Acquisition times vary depending on the clarity of the horizon. Clouds, rain, buildings, trees, mountains, all will increase the fix time. Most GPS units will remember the satellites last acquired when the unit was turned off. GPS satellites are not geostationary and their position changes with the earth's rotation. The GPS receiver must relocate them when turned on again. This is called a "cold boot". The longer the GPS as been turned off, the more the satellites position in the sky moves, and the longer it takes to acquire a new fix.

Some commercial or military grade receivers have better performance but are larger and far more expensive than consumer grade products.
 
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GPS satellites are not geostationary and their position changes with the earth's rotation.

This is one of those statements that is technically true but from a system standpoint is incorrect.

Classic GPS signals are most certainly not sent through satellites in geostationary orbits. However, WAAS signals are relayed as "GPS-like" signals through communications satellites in geostationary orbit.


Yes, WAAS was largely designed for aviation use but nearly all GPS chipsets manufactured by anyone in the last dozen or so years will process WAAS information if they can receive it.
 
And you still cant get a lock in Venice back streets.
This should be the utmost priority fix or Im never going back there again.
I carried a small zipper pull compass touring the narrow streets of Rome. Always works and it never needs batteries. It's part of my standard travel kit. In a few more years, using a map and compass will be a completely forgotten art.
 
This is one of those statements that is technically true but from a system standpoint is incorrect.

Classic GPS signals are most certainly not sent through satellites in geostationary orbits. However, WAAS signals are relayed as "GPS-like" signals through communications satellites in geostationary orbit.


Yes, WAAS was largely designed for aviation use but nearly all GPS chipsets manufactured by anyone in the last dozen or so years will process WAAS information if they can receive it.
The satellites have to be boosted constantly as they are drawn towards the Himalayas every pass.
The technology to provide reliable reception from tiny aerials is incredible.
I think they use some phase interference tech, my cheap phone easily gets a lock indoors, its mind
blowing, the signal is microscopic.
 
@dodgeman, please tell me.

When I had a Wahoo Roam v1, it had a single GPS receiver. The accuracy was adequate, and the GPS fix was achieved almost immediately post the device start. Now, Wahoo Bolt or Roam v2 have a dual GPS receiver. It takes a lot of time to get the initial GPS fix! Any ideas why that happens?
Stefan I’d say Jim1348 answers is correct. I’d say when you say dual GPS receiver you most likely are talking dual frequency, which as I recall is L1 and L2. I think one improvement they made is added a third frequency to the newer satellites. Why it takes longer I’m not sure but it might be a lot more accurate.

The survey grade equipment we used stored the GPS satellites locations in its memory. This is called an ephemeris. When you turn it on it knows where the satellites should be. This holds true if you stay in the same general area. For example I live in Illinois and if I drove to Montana and turned the equipment on it’s lost. It starts tracking satellites and downloads a new ephemeris and figures out where it is. Stefan if you travel and then turn around it takes a little while to do this.

The cost of the surveying equipment can get expensive. You can probably buy a simple system for around $10,000. The system we bought before I retired was $60,000.
 
This is one of those statements that is technically true but from a system standpoint is incorrect.

Classic GPS signals are most certainly not sent through satellites in geostationary orbits. However, WAAS signals are relayed as "GPS-like" signals through communications satellites in geostationary orbit.


Yes, WAAS was largely designed for aviation use but nearly all GPS chipsets manufactured by anyone in the last dozen or so years will process WAAS information if they can receive it.
All this is true but keep in mind, not all the satellites your terrestrial GPS sees are WAAS enabled. Airplanes have a much clearer horizon, or view of the sky, so fewer WAAS satellites are required for position augmentation. Also, WAAS is only available in North America. Those in other regions need to rely on similar systems, like EGNOS in Europe, GAGAN in India, MSAS in Japan, etc. These systems may or may not offer better augmentation for terrestrial GPS receivers, if they are so equipped.

Many consumer grade GPS units have a screen which lets you see the satellites it has acquired. Some also indicate which are WAAS enabled. In my travels, I often find I have no WAAS satellites in view. It all depends on your location and the clarity of your horizon.

Here in North America, WAAS certainly aids with position accuracy, but time and distance traveled between GPS receiver boots still determines acquisition time.
 
My understanding is WASS is an independent of the GPS satellites. There are 3 of them. The issue is what your receiver is setup for, it has to be WAAS enabled. WAAS basically takes the accuracy from 10 meters to 1 meter. Years ago not everything had WAAS but now even iPhones have it. WAAS stands for Wide Area Augmentation System.

Elevations are always the weak point of GPS. From an engineering point of view an accuracy of 1 meter is useless if you think about draining water. That‘s why the survey grade equipment costs so much more.
 
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