Front hub recommendation? I found this one.....

[sc00ter]

I found this "one and done" kit at Ebike Essentials. It's a:
Bafang
48volt
500Watt
14Ah Mini Shark battery
DPC-18 display
Left thumb throttle.
Cadence sensor.
For a bit under $1000 shipped.
Is there any other complete kits I should consider? This kit fits my 100mm fork spacing. On paper it's exactly what I'm looking for. If this was motor scooter stuff I'd know all about it, but I'm at a loss with ordering a ebike front wheel kit.

 

[harryS]

Broken down, the fwd kit with DPC-18 is $490, and the rest is battery.

Price seems a bit high to me, but I am comfortable buying stuff on aliexpress, not expecting any support/warranty and hoping it doesn't break. You can get a similar kit on amazon for $350 with little support/warranty, When you consider the unknowns about batteries. maybe you do want to buy it from a US seller.

I did watch the Essential Ebikes install video. They don't talk about any torque arms, nor do they use a torque wrench on the axle nuts. In my opinion, FWD bikes should use torque arms unless the fork is very stout. This bafang motor will allow a torque wrench to fit on both sides.

I believe I have the same motor on one of my bikes. It's a good motor. One last comment ... with the price of ebikes under $1000, many of them getting good reviews, is it worth a build?

 

[m@Robertson]

Yes that kit is a Bafang FMG020-500. FM = Front Motor and the 500 means its 500w. Tjhey also come in 250 and 350w windings. I use teh 500w versions and have two of them on two different cargo bikes. Its a good motor for sure but it is quite heavy. Standard Bafang reliability and you should open it up roughly every 3000 miles and re-grease it.

The base price of US$400 is pretty steep. A quick look on AliExpress showed the motors running for half that, and thats what I've paid for them. You are getting a built wheel, but that wheel is not particularly high in quality. Its a v-brake compatible rim which is not such a big deal, but it is extremely narrow, which you will find out when you get the thing. That limits your tire choices.

What @harryS is saying about torque arms is absolutely, positively a requirement. Even with a steel fork with steel dropouts.

I would never buy a kit because of the kaka wheels you get with them. But also I know what parts to use to make up a kit myself.

Here's how I would build up a G020 front wheel kit:

1. Bafang FMG020.500 motor
2. Alienation Blacksheep rim 27mm internal width, or a Stranger Crux XL rim (35mm inside width) or quasi-fat Weinmann DHL-65 rim
3. Sapim Strong spokes
4. Wheel built by your local bike shop. You'll want to ask around to find someone capable.
5. KT T12S controller. This is a 30a controller which is as strong as you can get for a 500w small-plug Bafang motor. Dial this controller down to slow-start but full amps via the C5 setting (set C5=0). Buy this from TopBikeKit on Ebay including the 1-4 cable wiring harness and 8PAS PAS sensor.
6. Grin Technologies v5 torque arms. Two of them. Or one v6 if you don't have fender eyelets on your dropouts.
7. KT LCD-4 display. Looks like a little EggRider v2.0 but is a backlit LCD so visible in all light or dark.
8. 300X type throttle via Amazon.

You aren't going to save any money thanks to the cost of the wheel build, but you'll wind up with a setup light years better and more reliable long term than any kit you can buy.

 

[PCeBiker]

,.. Standard Bafang reliability and you should open it up roughly every 3000 miles and re-grease it.

Can I ask about what grease to use and what the considerations are?

I've seen the really thin lithium grease being recommended, as well as corn head grease which is as thick as peanut butter.

I'm guessing that you want thicker grease for higher power motors, but the tradeoff is power loss/drag from the thick grease?
And thin grease doesn't have as much drag, but may not protect as well and can be displaced easier?

I don't want 60 Watts of drag from Thick/Viscous grease unless it's necessary.


My car had a 5-speed standard transmission that used 80 weight gear oil, but in the winter, I'd grind every gear for 15-20 minutes until the gearbox warmed up.
The syncromesh gears wouldn't spin in the cold thick oil, so I replaced the gear oil with sycromesh oil, which is as thin as water (but has friction additives to spin up the gears).
All my gear grinding stopped, but I guess that if I drove my car HARD, I would have wanted to use the thicker gear oil?

 

[indianajo]

Can I ask about what grease to use and what the considerations are?
I've seen the really thin lithium grease being recommended, as well as corn head grease which is as thick as peanut butter.

Geared hub motors sling the grease off the gears immediately, so it is a total non-event. Big haha.
The 6001 bearings are sealed, and last as long as the manufacturers intended. I've never worn out a hub motor bearing. 1 wore out one set of gears (4500 m, ebikeling) and one clutch wore out (3000 mi, Macmotor). One motor (bafang 350 w) was too small for my 320 lb gross load up 6% hills, and burnt the winding.
Note that people that climb mountains, that will climb slowly uphill for an hour or more, should not buy geared hub motors. They can overheat. My hills are short rollers, 33 m followed by a downhill the same grade. I ride ~75 such hills in a 30 miles commute weekly with 60 lb groceries on the uphill leg. I weigh 160 lb. and average 8-9 mph on my commute.
People that climb mountains should buy a mid-drive, a 40 or 46 tooth rear sprocket, and climb such mountains at 2 mph that is within the capability of such a package.

 

[PCeBiker]

Geared hub motors sling the grease off the gears immediately, so it is a total non-event. Big haha.

Hmmm,..
Well, I just thought greasing the gears occasionally was part of good maintenance.
I don't ride my ebike hard, there are no hills around me, and I've turned my controller down to 16 amps from 20, but I know that the gears themselves are greased at the factory.
They aren't dry running nylon gears.

 

[kevinmccune]

I found this "one and done" kit at Ebike Essentials. It's a:
Bafang
48volt
500Watt
14Ah Mini Shark battery
DPC-18 display
Left thumb throttle.
Cadence sensor.
For a bit under $1000 shipped.
Is there any other complete kits I should consider? This kit fits my 100mm fork spacing. On paper it's exactly what I'm looking for. If this was motor scooter stuff I'd know all about it, but I'm at a loss with ordering a ebike front wheel kit.

thats plenty of power( a 36 volt kit would be plenty believe me) my favorites were the dd 500 watt 36 volt flavor,should hit 22 mph.set up like i suggested with a 20 amp brick battery,should come in under $600

 

[kevinmccune]

Yes that kit is a Bafang FMG020-500. FM = Front Motor and the 500 means its 500w. Tjhey also come in 250 and 350w windings. I use teh 500w versions and have two of them on two different cargo bikes. Its a good motor for sure but it is quite heavy. Standard Bafang reliability and you should open it up roughly every 3000 miles and re-grease it.

The base price of US$400 is pretty steep. A quick look on AliExpress showed the motors running for half that, and thats what I've paid for them. You are getting a built wheel, but that wheel is not particularly high in quality. Its a v-brake compatible rim which is not such a big deal, but it is extremely narrow, which you will find out when you get the thing. That limits your tire choices.

What @harryS is saying about torque arms is absolutely, positively a requirement. Even with a steel fork with steel dropouts.

I would never buy a kit because of the kaka wheels you get with them. But also I know what parts to use to make up a kit myself.

Here's how I would build up a G020 front wheel kit:

1. Bafang FMG020.500 motor
2. Alienation Blacksheep rim 27mm internal width, or a Stranger Crux XL rim (35mm inside width) or quasi-fat Weinmann DHL-65 rim
3. Sapim Strong spokes
4. Wheel built by your local bike shop. You'll want to ask around to find someone capable.
5. KT T12S controller. This is a 30a controller which is as strong as you can get for a 500w small-plug Bafang motor. Dial this controller down to slow-start but full amps via the C5 setting (set C5=0). Buy this from TopBikeKit on Ebay including the 1-4 cable wiring harness and 8PAS PAS sensor.
6. Grin Technologies v5 torque arms. Two of them. Or one v6 if you don't have fender eyelets on your dropouts.
7. KT LCD-4 display. Looks like a little EggRider v2.0 but is a backlit LCD so visible in all light or dark.
8. 300X type throttle via Amazon.

You aren't going to save any money thanks to the cost of the wheel build, but you'll wind up with a setup light years better and more reliable long term than any kit you can buy.

ditto on 2 and 6 the 19 mm wheels are sort of meh. have 40 nm bafang 36 volt take offs( with good rims i think) for 25$ kinda wish now i would have stocked up.

 

[kevinmccune]

Can I ask about what grease to use and what the considerations are?

I've seen the really thin lithium grease being recommended, as well as corn head grease which is as thick as peanut butter.

I'm guessing that you want thicker grease for higher power motors, but the tradeoff is power loss/drag from the thick grease?
And thin grease doesn't have as much drag, but may not protect as well and can be displaced easier?

I don't want 60 Watts of drag from Thick/Viscous grease unless it's necessary.


My car had a 5-speed standard transmission that used 80 weight gear oil, but in the winter, I'd grind every gear for 15-20 minutes until the gearbox warmed up.
The syncromesh gears wouldn't spin in the cold thick oil, so I replaced the gear oil with sycromesh oil, which is as thin as water (but has friction additives to spin up the gears).
All my gear grinding stopped, but I guess that if I drove my car HARD, I would have wanted to use the thicker gear oil?

on the last part you could have used atf in the tranny

 

[PCeBiker]

on the last part you could have used atf in the tranny

I actually did.

I used the syncromesh oil on my previous vehicle, but didn't want to spend the $20 a liter for 4 liters again, so I used ATF type F that was $6 a liter.

I had a 1983 GLC that recommended ATF type F for winter driving.
(The F is supposed to mean friction modified, and it keeps the syncromesh gears spinning.)

 

[indianajo]

gears themselves are greased at the factory.
They aren't dry running nylon gears.

Every time I have opened a geared hub, the gears are dry and the grease is slung off against the housing out of the way. I have the opportunity to look inside 2 geared hubs next week. The Mac12t clutch went to all neutrals 2 weeks ago, ~ 3000 miles. The replacement mxus I bought last summer to have in the garage in case of trouble made 6 miles Tuesday before the blue phase wire went open. Inside the Julet connector I determined today. I bought a Mac8t on ebay last fall to salvage the clutch for the 12t, but they changed the clutch between 2019 and 2022. 8t winding would be torqueless, I can't use it. Reason ebay vendor was dumping the 8t as is no returns, the threads on the axle were boogered. No problem, I had that corrected in an hour with a triangle file.

 

[electricnewbie]

bafang motors are pretty solid, i've heard good things about their reliability.

 

[indianajo]

Disassembled the MXUS motor today, at 6 miles there is still a tiny amount of grease touching the gears.
Cannot get any continuity yet between blue and yellow or blue and green. Green to yellow is okay. Inside the motor I cannot get any phase continuity to anything. Was sticking the meter probes up the tape bundles, there is no solder joint on PCB for phases like Mac had. Will try needles in the wire bundles for the DVM tomorrow, will be big rainstorm tonight.