First time buyer but experienced biker

[Jörn]

Hi there, I'm from Sweden and is about to buy an electric bike. I have cycled a lot both road bike and mtb. I've just started a new job and have about 20 km to work, one way. I think most of the road gonna be asphalt. I can almost never sit on a bike and cruise. I always want to go fast. I think the bike gonna help me go faster when it's windy and help me up those hills and get me going fast after a stop. In Sweden electric bikes stops assist you after 25 km/h. I'm usually right above that and more in right conditions.

So in my nearest shop I have Haibike and E-motion to choose from. Just by the looks I like the E-motion better but with the engine in the back it will be trickier during wintertime in the snow I think. My wonderings are 29" vs 27,5" i'm used to 26" on my mtb. Mtb vs hybrid or hybrid racer. I'm leaning towards hybrid but maybe a mtb is better in the long term of comfort, you always get the extra push from the engine anyway.

Can you guys help me make a decision with your own thoughts about this.

 

[Admin]

Hi Jörn! Sounds like a fun commute, thanks for laying out all of the details. I personally love the feel of mountain bikes because the tires offer more cushion when riding over bumps and they usually have good suspension as well. While the hybrid and race bikes are more efficient for pedaling and coasting, when you have a motor it doesn't matter so much (just like you said )

Ultimately, between the E-motion and Haibike you will probably be happy with either but spend much less money with E-motion (at least that's how it is over in the US where I live). I love Haibike and they have some amazing systems with the Bosch Centerdrive but I like that E-motion has both pedal assist and throttle because sometimes I like both.

My opinion is that both motors will work fine in the snow, especially if you have good studded tires (like the mountain bike would). Both systems turn your rear wheel so it's not like one is going to spin and lose grip vs. the other. They will basically do the same thing but the Bosch will be better at climbing steep hills and balance the weight out more towards the middle. Frankly, I've never had a problem climbing either bike, if you are fit and like to pedal then I think you will be fine with either.

I'd pick the bike that feels right to you, looks cool and is priced within your budget. Both Haibike (Accell Group) and E-motion (Easy Motion) are great corporations with good support and quality products. I hope my opinion helps you out, if you have any other questions just let me know and I'll share more thoughts!

...and if I'm ever in Sweden I hope you take me for a ride, it looks beautiful there

 

[Chris Nolte]

Jörn - Your questions come up often in our shop. We often take mountain bikes and put street tires or hybrid tires on them so you get the benefits of the wider wheel and suspension while keeping with the lower rolling resistance as a road or hybrid bike. We found that there are less street tire options available for 650b's (27.5") wheels, one of the only ones are the Schwalbe Big Ben's 27.5x2", but there are many more options for 26" and 29". I just had a long conversation with the guys at Schwalbe yesterday about this. The big difference in the wheel size aside from the availability of the tires comes down to displacement of power, 26" has always been the standard and later 29" wheels became popular, taken from the road bikes and hybrid bikes already using the (better know as a 700c wheel). 29" wheels rolled over inconsistencies in the trail easier and became popular in the US, but many have started to see their limitations, namely lack of suspension travel possibilities without negatively affecting the geometry of the bike, issues with toe clearance and it becomes increasing more difficult to handle tighter turns and more technical courses. 29er's do still work quite well on the street though. 650b's essentially split the difference between the two wheel sizes and have been taking off wildly in the MTB scene. For really technical stuff, I still feel 26" is the way to go though as you can really maneuver the best; this is not as necessary on the road though.

Depending on your budget, either the Haibike or the Easy Motion will serve you well. The big difference I have found between the two bikes are in their refinement; the Bosch system is a bit more refined, in that the power turns on and off immediately as you pedal. This is accomplished by Bosch's advanced sensing technology, they take thousands of measurements per second measuring torque, cadence and speed to naturally match your pedaling style. In contrast Easy Motion uses a torque sensor, which offers an excellent feel matching your pedaling style, but can sometimes achieve unexpected results due to the lack of a cadence sensor; it's still an awesome bike and one of my most popular sellers and we're actually the top retailer in the US for Easy Motion, but I certainly enjoy the benefits of the Bosch system.

I would put the Easy Motion Cross and the Haibike Trekking at the top of your list and throw some studded tires on your bike in the winter time. Then it just boils down to fit, feel and budget.

Let me know if I can assist further and definitely update us with what you end up purchasing and how you get on with it. All the best!

 

[Admin]

Awesome post Chris, thanks for explaining the trade offs of 29ers more. You're right on with the responsiveness of Bosch drive vs. torque only in Easy Motion.

 

[Jörn]

Thanks for the replies. Very helpfull. I felt the difference between the two motors actually. The E-motion motor had a nice extra boost at start which was cool, you had a nice speed in no time. But the Bosh is maybe a better choice if you're mainly using it for commute and roads, I wonder if it could be annoying when the motor is not smooth enough when peddling on roads.
I will save about $150 in gas per month if a take the bike everyday instead of car. That's nice.

This is really hard. I feel like I want I cycle that don't exist . Putting other tires on could be a solution. I remember I put on slicks my 26" mtb and that was a positiv experience

Next up is trying the smaller 27,5" bike from Haibike.

 

[Brambor]

I know what you mean. I also have a preference for slicks

 

[Jörn]

Oh this one I must have
https://www.haibike.com/de/de
I wonder when we'll see a review of that one?

 

[Brambor]

Meow. Nice wheels

 

[Chris Nolte]

Oh this one I must have
https://www.haibike.com/de/de
I wonder when we'll see a review of that one?

We won't see this one stateside. The closest we'll see is the Trekking RX or the Superrace. Who know's what next year holds though.

 

[Admin]

They're all pretty nice... Interesting frame design they chose however, is it meant to be iconic or artistic? Instead of meeting the top tube with the seat stays they put them lower down to create that distinct angle (which seems like it would be weaker).



This design also makes it harder to stand over the bike if you have short legs... and subsequently rack yourself It does have a distinctly masculine, male sort of look to it. Any thoughts on why the frames are made like this Chris (or anyone here with bike structure knowledge)?

 

[Ravi Kempaiah]

They're all pretty nice... Interesting frame design they chose however,
View attachment 933

This design also makes it harder to stand over the bike if you have short legs... and subsequently rack yourself It does have a distinctly masculine, male sort of look to it. Any thoughts on why the frames are made like this Chris (or anyone here with bike structure knowledge)?

I would totally love a discussion about frames and design. Thanks court.

 

[Chris Nolte]

They're all pretty nice... Interesting frame design they chose however, is it meant to be iconic or artistic? Instead of meeting the top tube with the seat stays they put them lower down to create that distinct angle (which seems like it would be weaker).

View attachment 933

This design also makes it harder to stand over the bike if you have short legs... and subsequently rack yourself It does have a distinctly masculine, male sort of look to it. Any thoughts on why the frames are made like this Chris (or anyone here with bike structure knowledge)?

I'm pretty sure this design is mostly for looks. It does give a pretty nice area for the placement for the taillight. I haven't gotten any official word from anyone at Haibike, but based on my understanding of frame design and metallurgy I have a theory that this design could add to the comfort of the frame without loosing performance. It seems by placing the seat stays (the top part of the rear triangle) lower it will enable it to take advantage of the flex of the seat tube, offering a balance of performance and comfort. The flex is most likely minuscule, but it would help smooth out the road. This is one the same reasons why road bikes have really thin seat stays. This is just a theory, but it seems to make sense in my mind.

Regarding the stand over height issue, Haibike seems to have solved that by offering up to 5 different frame sizes, I'm hoping other ebike brands start following suit. I imagine they will as the market grows more over here.

Regardless of anything, I think it looks really cool

 

[Admin]

This is one the same reasons why road bikes have really thin seat stays.

Indeed... Expert comment there Chris and I appreciate how you called out the wide range of sizes they offer. Feels like the next step in ebikes for sure. Anyway, your comment made me think of the Specialized Roubaix which has those Zertz in the seat stays (and very thin tubing surrounding them) to provide exactly the kind of flex you're talking about.

 

[James]

I love my Zertz

 

[Jörn]

Hi again.

I actually made one commute on my 26" mtb and I'm not in good shape I had a average speed of 17km/h =).
With a length 21km do guys think I will benefit in speed from a hybrid vs a 29" mtb? Even when my shape is better =)
If I is about to bike as often as I can maybe comfort is better if the speed benefit is not that gret in comparsion. I also going to attach bags to it because I need have the computer and other stuff with me every day.

 

[Chris Nolte]

Hi again.

I actually made one commute on my 26" mtb and I'm not in good shape I had a average speed of 17km/h =).
With a length 21km do guys think I will benefit in speed from a hybrid vs a 29" mtb? Even when my shape is better =)
If I is about to bike as often as I can maybe comfort is better if the speed benefit is not that gret in comparsion. I also going to attach bags to it because I need have the computer and other stuff with me every day.

Jörn, there are many factors that will impact the speed and efficiency between two bikes, if they had the same motor and battery the main factors would be gearing, riding position (affects performance and wind drag) and tires, as mountain bike tires can be very inefficient on the road. It's actually a common practice at our shop to swap the tires out on mountain bikes that will be used for commuting.

 

[Jörn]

Thanks Chris. In other bike forums almost every thread talking about cycle cross as the best option for commute. But in another thread I found there was this guy talking about that you need to go further distances to actually have difference in time. I'm leaning to a 29" mtb like the Haibike Xduro rx and switching tires on it. Its probably a more comfortable way to travel if I gonna do it often. Its gonna be huge difference to my none assisted 26" =)

edit: But I am of course aware of all things making bike riding smooth vs fast etc.
Just want some input to make choosing bike easier. Its irritating hard =)

 

[Chris Nolte]

Thanks Chris. In other bike forums almost every thread talking about cycle cross as the best option for commute. But in another thread I found there was this guy talking about that you need to go further distances to actually have difference in time. I'm leaning to a 29" mtb like the Haibike Xduro rx and switching tires on it. Its probably a more comfortable way to travel if I gonna do it often. Its gonna be huge difference to my none assisted 26" =)

edit: But I am of course aware of all things making bike riding smooth vs fast etc.
Just want some input to make choosing bike easier. Its irritating hard =)

I've been thinking of the same bike as an excellent option. I like the wider wheels. I'd set that up with some 2" wide Big Ben's or some Marathon Plus' and you'd be set. It will give you a lot of versatility and it will be aggressive but still comfortable.

 

[Jörn]

The Marathons tires looks great. Seems like long lasting tires. And also some nice bar ends so I can switch positions.
Thanks I'm maybe closer to make a decision =)
I think that I believe that I am gonna go so much faster with cyclecross or a hybrid. But at higher speeds the assist is not gonna work and at those speeds I'll need lots of training be able to maintain speed anyway. Better to go with comfort in the beginning and in a couple of years there will a lot more choose from and I'll have experience from my commutes.

 

[Chris Nolte]

The Marathons tires looks great. Seems like long lasting tires. And also some nice bar ends so I can switch positions.
Thanks I'm maybe closer to make a decision =)
I think that I believe that I am gonna go so much faster with cyclecross or a hybrid. But at higher speeds the assist is not gonna work and at those speeds I'll need lots of training be able to maintain speed anyway. Better to go with comfort in the beginning and in a couple of years there will a lot more choose from and I'll have experience from my commutes.

I also find I'm inclined to want to go faster the more aggressive my riding position, it gives you a different vibe. You could possibly get a speed Pedelec (45 kph) depending on the restrictions in your area. I kind of forgot where you are located, so there might be more bikes available there.