Changing either the Front or Rear gears to ease grades or alternatively to provide faster speeds.

[kahn]

I've seen this topic come up in various threads where folks have changed out the front ring or the rear cluster (or parts) to gain a bit more ease climbing hills or in the alternative, gaining more speeds on the flats by providing higher gearing.

I've an Aluminum Creo and I guess I would not mind easing some hill climbs here in the Seattle area. Either by reducing the size of the front ring or changing the rear cluster to accommodate a lower gear.

But I really don't know much about how flexible the chain/derailleur situation is and whether such changes are easy or more complicated.

Thoughts?

 

[Art Deco]

A resource from the recent gearing thread for the emtb crowd.

How to find the perfect gear ratios for your MTB drivetrain

For many riders, working out gear ratios seems like a Gordian knot; there continues to be a fear of not having enough gear range when switching over to a 1x drivetrain. With a little mental arithmetic, however, you’ll quickly be able to bring light into the dark. We’ll show you, step by step...

enduro-mtb.com

 

[RunForTheHills]

If you change out the front ring, you will sacrifice top speed for easier hill climbing. It will make all of your gears lower. If you install a wider range cassette in the back your shifting won't be as seamless as you will have larger steps between gears and may not be able to find the perfect gear for your speed. Also, most road derailleurs don't support very large cogs in the back and can't wrap enough chain for a very wide range of gears. You may need to switch to a long cage mountain derailleur depending on how large a gear you put in the back.

 

[mjeds]

So my bike came with a 42T Chainring and a 7 speed cassette. it was great on inclines, but most of my commute is flat, and it sucked for top end.
upgraded it to a 53T chainring and gained a much better top end. in PAS 5 I went from a 22mph average to a 27mph average.

however now it sucked on the 9% grade I have on the commute which is just over 2 miles long, with 42T I was able to manage it a 18-19mph with 53T I struggle to maintain 15mph.

A rider I met along the way in the past few months suggested I try a oval chainring, best of both worlds more or less.

I put it on 2 weeks ago, 48T, I can easily maintain 25mph on the flats and 18mph on the incline. and for the first time in months my legs (quads) have been sore from the ride, so it appears I am getting a better workout from it. Some say that it can cause knee issues in the long run, I have good knees so not concerned about it at the moment, but if I experience knee issues I will report back.

I will say it is not for everyone, takes some getting used to, but I like it.


here is some info on oval gearing.

Oval Chainring Ultimate Guide - Pros, Cons, Installation, Science

Thinking of using an oval chainring? Everything you need to know to make a decision is here including how to install, remove, and fine tune.

www.firstcomponents.com

 

[Rás Cnoic]

I've seen this topic come up in various threads where folks have changed out the front ring or the rear cluster (or parts) to gain a bit more ease climbing hills or in the alternative, gaining more speeds on the flats by providing higher gearing.

I've an Aluminum Creo and I guess I would not mind easing some hill climbs here in the Seattle area. Either by reducing the size of the front ring or changing the rear cluster to accommodate a lower gear.

But I really don't know much about how flexible the chain/derailleur situation is and whether such changes are easy or more complicated.

Thoughts?

On my Vado SL I replaced the front chainring with a smaller one. Going from 44T down to 38T. It took my LBS five mins with no other changes needed. Remarkable difference on hills. However I live in a very hilly area with few flat roads so have not missed any top speed from the lack of a bigger front chainring. Come to think of it I rarely spin out so it’s been a great tweak to the bike.

 

[Steve Brown]

My wife and I both used to row competitively in our university days and throughout our 20s and 30s, at least when family duties permitted. The unforgivable crime in setting up a boat was always over-gearing; either the thole pin too close to the centre line of the boat, or the button on the blade/oar too near the “handle” end. A perfect example of Archimede’s lever (the pivot point is the outer end of the oar/blade).
Ever since I’ve been neurotic/paranoid in any similar situation, and cycling is the perfect example. Get it right, and you have a happy cyclist/rower (I’m ignoring the competitive types, as I’m no longer one of them). BUT, there are always compromises involved, as in everything.
I like to cycle as if I were walking through the countryside, but a bit faster, so I can get to cafes, bars etc., for lunches and “light refreshments”. That means I happily sacrifice outright speed, especially if the resulting mix of gears lets me grind (definitely not spin) up a long and steep gradient without my heart springing out between my ribs.
This “compromise problem” actually gets more difficult with a bike like the Turbo Vado SL, because it’s insanely easy to ride as a normal push-bike. We ride for miles over hilly country without ever feeling the need for power, but when you want it, it’s there. So you don’t have a gearing problem, and, actually, it’s quite addictive and rather nice! The TV already has a really wide gear range built in, but, yes, I could go for a 38 tooth chain ring, and happily sacrifice a lump of top speed, gaining even more “easy climbing” points as I go.
I’m rambling, but I guess it’s horses for courses. Stefan clearly rides with lots of different riders of varying abilities. I only ride with my wife, and after over 45 years together, we’ve rubbed off most of the rough edges and mostly want the same thing out of a bike ride. I have to say the TV SL gives you that without needing any modifications!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I'm lucky as my larger neighbourhood is rather flat, and there are no inclines I couldn't climb on the SL in the Turbo mode with current gearing. I think engineers in companies such as Specialized know their trade, and their designs are really well thought. (The vice of Ye Ole Goode Specialized is using non-standard bike parts though). If I lived if a hilly area, I would replace the chainring with 38T though.

The beauty of owning several different e-bikes is you can choose a proper one for given purpose. This is far harder if your spouse rides together with you, as the cost and space required become unbearable for N+1. Having said that I need to add my Speed full power Vado could be my single all-rounder e-bike... Even if the lowest gearing is 48:46 there, I was riding mountain paved roads with my Vado, albeit in the granny gear and 100% Turbo. If I, however, tried riding off-road up the Great Owl Mt in Polish Owl Mts, my Vado couldn't do it (so I chose my Giant Trance E+ Pro for that ride 38:51 gearing).

 

[Rincon]

Changing the chainring is a snap. I’ve done it myself a few times. Changing the cassette can get complicated. I’ve always had the shop do it.

If your Creo is the same as mine, it came with a 46t chainring. My Salsa Warroad came with a 42t chainring, which I swapped for a 38t. That required me to remove a chain link or two. Made a big difference. I’m very happy with that now. You could go from the 46t to a 42t chainring. I don’t think a 44t would make much difference. Very easy swap. Watch a Park Tool video.

Check out Bike Calc to see the gear inches you’re running and the gear inches you could be running. The closer to the low 20s, the easier it will be to climb. To give you a frame of reference, fully loaded bike packers like to be at 20 or below for hill climbing.

 

[m@Robertson]

I put it on 2 weeks ago, 48T, I can easily maintain 25mph on the flats and 18mph on the incline. and for the first time in months my legs (quads) have been sore from the ride, so it appears I am getting a better workout from it. Some say that it can cause knee issues in the long run, I have good knees so not concerned about it at the moment, but if I experience knee issues I will report back.

Are you sure the benefit of the 48T oval ring is the oval? How much of the benefit you experience is the fact its 48T and not that bigger jump up to 53T?

That article is certainly interesting, as it covers Shimano Biopace and I jumped on that bandwagon early, myself back in the 1980's. Initially I thought it was wonderful, but as time went on and switched between bikes, I wasn't so sure and it fell by the wayside.

 

[tomjasz]

FWIW some mid-drives will be overtaxed with 52T chainrings. BBS01 and BBS02 motors get really stressed. I can't speak to other mid-drive brands.

 

[Rás Cnoic]

Are you sure the benefit of the 48T oval ring is the oval? How much of the benefit you experience is the fact its 48T and not that bigger jump up to 53T?

That article is certainly interesting, as it covers Shimano Biopace and I jumped on that bandwagon early, myself back in the 1980's. Initially I thought it was wonderful, but as time went on and switched between bikes, I wasn't so sure and it fell by the wayside.

Snap. I can remember biopace being a massive deal, like the second coming, for a year or two, then interest seemed to die off. Was a point when all the new MTBs seemed to be equipped with oval chainrings with little yellow biopace stickers. Happy days.

 

[mjeds]

Are you sure the benefit of the 48T oval ring is the oval? How much of the benefit you experience is the fact its 48T and not that bigger jump up to 53T?

That article is certainly interesting, as it covers Shimano Biopace and I jumped on that bandwagon early, myself back in the 1980's. Initially I thought it was wonderful, but as time went on and switched between bikes, I wasn't so sure and it fell by the wayside.

at the widest point of the 48T oval it is the same size as the as the 53T, even using my 53T chain guard to cover it as no one makes an oval guard.

I start with the OEM 42T tried 48T, 50T, and settled on 53T. I can say that the oval 48T gives me more power for hills than a round 48T did, and a lot more top end.

 

[kahn]

On my Vado SL I replaced the front chainring with a smaller one. Going from 44T down to 38T. It took my LBS five mins with no other changes needed. Remarkable difference on hills. However I live in a very hilly area with few flat roads so have not missed any top speed from the lack of a bigger front chainring. Come to think of it I rarely spin out so it’s been a great tweak to the bike.

I like that answer

 

[kahn]

Changing the chainring is a snap. I’ve done it myself a few times. Changing the cassette can get complicated. I’ve always had the shop do it.

If your Creo is the same as mine, it came with a 46t chainring. My Salsa Warroad came with a 42t chainring, which I swapped for a 38t. That required me to remove a chain link or two. Made a big difference. I’m very happy with that now. You could go from the 46t to a 42t chainring. I don’t think a 44t would make much difference. Very easy swap. Watch a Park Tool video.

Check out Bike Calc to see the gear inches you’re running and the gear inches you could be running. The closer to the low 20s, the easier it will be to climb. To give you a frame of reference, fully loaded bike packers like to be at 20 or below for hill climbing.

The days of fully, partially or simple bike packing are probably behind me as is almost 3/4 of a Century - years not miles (g)

While I don't mind speed on the flats and downhills, prefer, well, my knee and twice replaced hip prefer a bit more ease. They (hip and knee) and it Creo) did a 53 mile ride about two weeks ago with some stiff hills going easier might be nice.

The 53 miles were pedaling and did not include the approximately 20 miles of ferry rides.

 

[Saratoga Dave]

My gravel ebike had an 11 speed 11-42 cassette and a 48 tooth chainring. It’s a Class 1 limited to 20 mph assist, and between that and the way I ride anyway, I had plenty of top end speed but wished for better climbing ability. I replaced the chainring with a 42 tooth and the result has been just what I was looking for. I’m almost never in the 11 tooth cog or the one next to it, for that matter, but on 12% or higher grades the bike is a lot happier and so am i with that lower ratio. Don’t use the lowest gear a lot either, but it’s certainly nice to know it’s there.

 

[kahn]

My gravel ebike had an 11 speed 11-42 cassette and a 48 tooth chainring. It’s a Class 1 limited to 20 mph assist, and between that and the way I ride anyway, I had plenty of top end speed but wished for better climbing ability. I replaced the chainring with a 42 tooth and the result has been just what I was looking for. I’m almost never in the 11 tooth cog or the one next to it, for that matter, but on 12% or higher grades the bike is a lot happier and so am i with that lower ratio. Don’t use the lowest gear a lot either, but it’s certainly nice to know it’s there.

I've also got the 11-42 but apparently a Praxis 46T Chainring. I guess I will be contacting my bike shop.

 

[mschwett]

on my Creo, i have both problems. i spin out all the time - i like to ride fast downhill - and i wish i didn't have to use so much assist going up hills.

since making it a 2x drivetrain isn't reasonable, i'd really like something like a 10-48. i could live with the larger gaps, when i need a granny gear i need a granny gear, and when i'm going 35-45, it could certainly be geared much, much higher. it's almost like what i want is 9 closely spaced gears and an underdrive and overdrive gear!

there does seem to be a few x11 cassettes which have both a 10 and a > 42, but i wonder if the shimano shifter components on my creo comp carbon would be able to handle the more exotic ones. the hive 9-46 and garbaruk 10-48 seem most interesting.