Bosch vs Brose (specialized) reliability?

B

bikeman242

Active Member
I know this is a broad question, but if one were to buy a new current year bike, is bosch or brose (specailized) considered to be a more reliable manufacturer in regards to durable, long lasting motors? I am worried about the brose breaking after out of specialized warranty, and then it being costly to service/get replacement parts vs. a bike with a bosch motor. I have read that specialized doesn't support the batteries on the bikes for a very long time. However, I greatly prefer ridng brose to bosch.
 
Timpo said:
Bosch and Brose are both multi billion $ corporation and I don't think you can go wrong with either of them?

Isn't it like comparing Toyota and Honda, BMW and Mercedes, Ferrari and Lamborghini, Ford and Chevy, Kawasaki and Yamaha, etc?
Click to expand...

All of the car comparisons you made I would say are comporable in terms of reputation for reliability, in my opinion.

Are you saying bosch and brose would be likewise comporable?
 
having owned mercedes, honda, toyota, yamaha, chevy and ford cars/trucks i can say there is definitely a difference in reliability of these different brands
so not sure what you meant by that

i was under the impression brose had lined out a lot of their problems, that was what one of the bike shops that carries specialized ebikes told me last summer...
bosch may be more reliable
but i would buy brose over bosch and take the chance, i really like the brose motors...


maybe ravi can chime in on how many brose problems they are having...
 
I have put 8500 miles on my Specialized Vado 5.0 in the last year. I've had to replace the Brose motor 3 times, all under warranty. You can read more of my experience here. The bike has worked 99% of the time I've owned it. It's the 1% that is frustrating, but worth remembering it's only 1%. My best advice is buying a bike from Bike Shop that has excellent service. I am fortunate to work near Cynergy, a flagship Specialized store.

When originally shopping for my bike I preferred the 'bike like' performance of the Brose motor and its quietness.

In general, I think the Ebike industry needs to start specifying/designing more durable components; I install a new cassette and chain every 6 weeks (1100 miles).

Thanks to Mako for locating a company that services Brose Motors. I hope these businesses proliferate and make it Stateside.
 
2wheels said:
I have put 8500 miles on my Specialized Vado 5.0 in the last year. I've had to replace the Brose motor 3 times, all under warranty. You can read more of my experience here. The bike has worked 99% of the time I've owned it. It's the 1% that is frustrating, but worth remembering it's only 1%. My best advice is buying a bike from Bike Shop that has excellent service. I am fortunate to work near Cynergy, a flagship Specialized store.

When originally shopping for my bike I preferred the 'bike like' performance of the Brose motor and its quietness.

In general, I think the Ebike industry needs to start specifying/designing more durable components; I install a new cassette and chain every 6 weeks (1100 miles).

Thanks to Mako for locating a company that services Brose Motors. I hope these businesses proliferate and make it Stateside.
Click to expand...
Brose motor on my Raleigh Redux iE also failed for the second time already... Could you provide more info about the company that services them?
 
We currently service/overhaul Brose, Bosch, Yamaha, Impulse and Panasonic motors, although some Brose repairs are currently limited, due to the way they are built. We have released a video of a Brose overhaul if your interested

As for reliability Bosch Vs Brose, they both have their issues (as do most pedelec motors) but with Bosch, most things are repairable. With Brose, many things are not! If there is any issue with the planetary gears or electric motor, it's game over. If the crankshaft needle roller rusts, it quickly takes out the bearing surface on the crankshaft, game over. Currently, if the crankshaft bearings fail, they are un-available, game over. (We are having these bearings manufactured soon) If the ICU fails, game over. If the belt tentioner snaps, game over. We can replace the plastic caged sprag bearings when they fail with steel ones, and if caught in time we can fit better sealing into the needle roller bearing too.

As for Bosch, there is not much that can't be replaced or repaired on the Bosch motors, and apart from bearing failure, they don't tend to break components, we even have a solution for circuit board failure in the wings so good news for longevity.

Don't get me wrong, the Brose motor is a good motor, as others have said, it's quiet, it delivers smooth power and has a large chain ring for ride-ability without assistance etc. But based on the above, I would let you make your own minds up.
 
Great info

Curious about the cost of swapping out the entire brose motor?
And the same for the Bosch
 
After the fourth brose motor failure of my 2018 Vado, Cynergy / Specialized offered me a bike swap for a 2020 Vado 5.0 and sent me this clip of text:

" - last motor we replaced was from order# XXXXXX in Dec./Jan. I did open a Quality investigation (QPR) about the belt issues and there was apparently an issue with some of the belts that Brose was using. They have fixed this issue. However, we have likely seen this issue again with this customer because we only ever got one initial shipment of the correct replacement motor (the 1.2S motor / S176800005) for this customer from Brose and that was a pretty early on shipment from quite a while ago.

As for the warranty, any replacement part, example being the motor sent out in Dec./Jan., comes with a new warranty. So, the last replacement warranty ships out with a new 2-year warranty on the motor. "

This was helpful information. It was also nice to hear that the replacement motors would have a rolling warranty of 2 years. I'm not certain if this 2 year warranty is a Brose or Specialized warranty.

I'm now 3100 miles into my 2020 Vado 5.0 and I have had no motor problems. I've replaced the chain every 1100 miles and the cassette every 3100 miles.
 
2wheels said:
I have put 8500 miles on my Specialized Vado 5.0 in the last year. I've had to replace the Brose motor 3 times, all under warranty. You can read more of my experience here. The bike has worked 99% of the time I've owned it. It's the 1% that is frustrating, but worth remembering it's only 1%. My best advice is buying a bike from Bike Shop that has excellent service. I am fortunate to work near Cynergy, a flagship Specialized store.

When originally shopping for my bike I preferred the 'bike like' performance of the Brose motor and its quietness.

In general, I think the Ebike industry needs to start specifying/designing more durable components; I install a new cassette and chain every 6 weeks (1100 miles).

Thanks to Mako for locating a company that services Brose Motors. I hope these businesses proliferate and make it Stateside.
Click to expand...
WTF!!!???? NOOOOOO! I just bought a Vado 4.0 2022, and it dies after 2 weeks!!! Wtf have I gotten myself into! Have I been scammed?
 
jigglyjamster said:
WTF!!!???? NOOOOOO! I just bought a Vado 4.0 2022, and it dies after 2 weeks!!! Wtf have I gotten myself into! Have I been scammed?
Click to expand...
Jamster: There is a large community of Specialized users in these Forums who are trying to share their experiences with you. There is no perfect e-bike. Some fail soon, and it is the matter of the warranty. Your warranty is one of the best in the market.

When I came to these Forums, I was more or less in your position. I've just bought a very expensive (as for me) Vado 5.0 that came with an obsolete display, making me very frustrated. I found other Specialized e-bike users in these Forums, their support, advice, consolation. What they told me was I wouldn't be left alone by Specialized.

They were right. My issues were solved, even if it took couple of months. Now, I ride as many as two Specialized e-bikes, and cannot see another brand from which I would like to buy yet another ebike. I can say: "They were right, and I was wrong". I hope you will be able -- in the course of time -- to say the same.

If you want to go with Bosch, good luck (you have been warned) :D
 
Stefan Mikes said:
Jamster: There is a large community of Specialized users in these Forums who are trying to share their experiences with you. There is no perfect e-bike. Some fail soon, and it is the matter of the warranty. Your warranty is one of the best in the market.

When I came to these Forums, I was more or less in your position. I've just bought a very expensive (as for me) Vado 5.0 that came with an obsolete display, making me very frustrated. I found other Specialized e-bike users in these Forums, their support, advice, consolation. What they told me was I wouldn't be left alone by Specialized.

They were right. My issues were solved, even if it took couple of months. Now, I ride as many as two Specialized e-bikes, and cannot see another brand from which I would like to buy yet another ebike. I can say: "They were right, and I was wrong". I hope you will be able -- in the course of time -- to say the same.

If you want to go with Bosch, good luck (you have been warned) :D
Click to expand...
Why the Bosch hate?
 
I just said to Jamster "good luck with Bosch e-bikes". After I read Bosch subforums here, I would never have bought Bosch e-bike, and I was very close to Cannondale Topstone Neo Lefty. Until I learned:
  • I would not get the Smart System
  • I would get a display with no ANT+ connectivity
  • I would have waited for a year for a spare battery
  • And I would need to ask both Bosch and Cannondale whether I could swap the chainring for another size
  • 2 A charger, Purion display and noisy motor as bonuses.
 
Stefan Mikes said:
I just said to Jamster "good luck with Bosch e-bikes". After I read Bosch subforums here, I would never have bought Bosch e-bike, and I was very close to Cannondale Topstone Neo Lefty. Until I learned:
  • I would not get the Smart System
  • I would get a display with no ANT+ connectivity
  • I would have waited for a year for a spare battery
  • And I would need to ask both Bosch and Cannondale whether I could swap the chainring for another size
  • 2 A charger, Purion display and noisy motor as bonuses.
Click to expand...
only the ANT+ is a thing. I never had to wait for a battery but covid happened that hurt supply chains. sorry but my bike and most I know come with 4 amp chargers and who cares over the little bit of motor noise. sounds liek barking up a tree with no squirrel. bosch has 4 displays its up to the manufacture what you get. I have taken my bike into several regular shops and they all knew how to deal with bosch as it is so standard.
 
Well, I only need to wait for two weeks to get:
  • The Specialized Vado/Como 604 Wh battery, and, at the same time
  • The Specialized SL Range Extender battery
Ask Dallant how long he waited to get his spare Bosch battery.

Display? Specialized TCD-w (present on current Vados and Comos) has been excellent, with its five configurable display pages, presenting very detailed ride information. For some Specialized e-bikes (e-MTB and road/gravel e-bikes), identical but wireless display has been available as an option (for US$100). Optional, as you didn't need to buy it at all, and connect a smartphone or a bike GPS computer instead. And I don't need to carry a tablet (Nyon) on my handlebars. (Purion? A Chinese display on my US$1,800 hub-drive e-bike has the same capabilities).

Specialized e-bikes use only a single app: Mission Control, which is good for all Spesh e-bikes.

Bosch "Smart System"? I need to see any new e-bike equipped with it, as I don't think Trek or Cannondale are ready for it, and it looks the Bosch Smart System is not ready to serve all e-bike types, especially e-MTB and road/gravel e-bikes. Meanwhile, Specialized have already released new lines of e-bikes based on their new Mastermind TCU/TCD. You can order these bikes now to get them soon, even under the pandemics.

By bad luck, buy a Euro speed limited e-bike in the U.S. or Canada. The bike will stay limited to 25 km/h (15.5 mph) and even Bosch cannot change it. It is because any batch of Bosch e-bike motors made for specific region has the speed limit hard coded in the motor. Specialized? The same Vado can be 25 km/h in Europe, 32 km/h in Canada, or 28 mph in the United States, and any Spec dealer has the right to adjust the speed limit to the local law (Spec e-bikes are international, and only configured in the given region, not at the factory).

Change chainring size on your Bosch e-bike: you will probably get an error, as Bosch thinks you are tampering with the motor. To replace a chainring with a new size, you need to ask both the OEM (such as Trek) and Bosch E-Bikes for authorization. Never happens to a Specialized e-bike.

Bosch think they can pack anything into their Nyon but they will never be Garmin or Wahoo. Specialized are aware of their limitations and don't put GPS navigation in their displays.

The biggest issue with Bosch e-bikes is that Bosch made all their OEMs their hostages while Specialized own their systems. When a warranty is to be handled, who handles the warranty and repairs? The OEM or Bosch E-Bike rep?
 
I was posting recently on reddit about my life with ebikes, specifically the Vado brose motor. Someone responded with this video:
I had contacted performance line bearing years ago, there response at the time was they were looking for USA partners. Fast forward to last year and they now have partners in the USA and elsewhere.
The cost of the upgrade appears to be $260.
Has anyone done this upgrade?
I have another 15 months warranty on my current motor turbo 1.3 - brose S motor.
 
2wheels said:
I was posting recently on reddit about my life with ebikes, specifically the Vado brose motor. Someone responded with this video:
I had contacted performance line bearing years ago, there response at the time was they were looking for USA partners. Fast forward to last year and they now have partners in the USA and elsewhere.
The cost of the upgrade appears to be $260.
Has anyone done this upgrade?
I have another 15 months warranty on my current motor turbo 1.3 - brose S motor.
Click to expand...
I’ve had the crankshaft bearings, sprag bearings, and Belt replacement at 8500 miles by ebikemotorrepair.com
I now have 3800 miles on this rebuilt motor and it performs better now, than when it was new.
 
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