Am I adequately covered?

[Wiley Coyote]

I purchased my first E-Bike yesterday, Aventon Level - 2. The LBS installed Tannus Armour, plus BR Cushcore in both tires, is that good enough for protection against flats or do I need to toss a can of Fix-A-Flat in my bag for just incase? I pick up the bike this upcoming Monday. The bike was assembled today, and fully charged but I was too busy, and will be with work for the next few days, I am stoked for Monday, that's for sure. Thanks for any replies.

 

[mrgold35]

I have a Himiway Cobra Pro with Tannus Armour in the 4.8" fat tires. I did put two 2 oz bottles of Stans tire sealant in each tire. I just purchased a Fanttik X8 Ace 150psi portable bike pump to adjust my tires for paved or single track riding. I also have a spare tube in my rack bag if I happen to get a flat that Tannus/Stans can't prevent.

I would keep your options open for tires, tubes, tubeless, sealant, and liners depending on the riding environment, handing dynamics you are looking for, and current and future skill levels.

 

[Slaphappygamer]

I regularly commute to work on my bike. It’s all paved streets, with potholes and those holes that they make for “testing” soil or whatever. They had a s*it crew fill them and they are just as bad as potholes. I try to miss all of them. I have had Tannis armor for about a year and almost 1500 miles. I haven’t had a flat. I feel confident that I won’t have a flat unless I hit a 2 inch screw. With your added cushcore, I would not use fixAflat. I’d say you are well protected, unless you find that 2 inch screw first.

For future reference, ask what size tube they installed. With the Tannis armor taking up some room in the tire, you should have a smaller tube installed as well.

 

[Wiley Coyote]

Thank you for your helpful advice, I did pick up a portable tire pump off Amazon that I will throw in my bike bag.

 

[m@Robertson]

Tannus is not exactly living up to its initial promise, now that we are a few years into its being on the market. Under constant air pressure it flattens out to eventually become very thin. Plus its not exactly nailproof in the best of times. With that said, its better than nothing and I use it myself to some extent.

I'm a little puzzled why the bike shop would use Cushcore. That is meant as a performance enhancement for hard core mtb wheels that are put thru hell on singletrack. And that are tubeless (!). It has a side benefit of helping to protect against snakebite punctures, but those really only happen on bikes using low tire pressures that are getting beaten to hell running a downhill race course kind of thing. Keep your tires filled and you'll never need to worry about snakebite punctures (thats where the tube gets pinched between the tire bead and the rim). It DOES help prevent flats but not on any kind of riding you'd expect to be doing on an Aventon L2.

Since a set of Cushcore inserts cost around $150 and is meant for tubeless tires, and A set of Tannus liners can be another hundred bucks, I can't help but think you got taken for a bit of a ride here.

For a 27.5" street bike, If you want to be aggressive about protection versus weight (which is where I am at) I'd approach this as follows:

1. Go Tannus. You already did that. As imperfect as it is, if it can be physically installed in a wheel its a worthwhile layer to add to the onion.
2. Get a thick inner tube. Use the same size inner tube as if Tannus was not there. I know what Tannus recommends, and @Slaphappygamer is echoing the manufacturer's recommendation... ignore what the manufacturer says and for good reason. First of all, Tannus will thin down over time (even the new formulation that is supposed to better resist thinning out) which will slowly turn a right-sized tube to undersized. Next, an inner tube that is oversized (!) is distended/stretched out less. That means it is stronger and more pop-resistant. Put a single puff of air into a balloon and then poke it with a pin. The rubber flexes and the pin doesn't penetrate. Now air the balloon up. Brush it with the pin and boom. Same deal with the larger inner tube. The only caveat is don't overdo it and be careful when mounting the tube. give it that first puff of air and that will prevent you from catching it between tire and rim during install. Look for the Schwalbe Air Plus tube which is sort of halfway to a thornproof thickness. Thorn-resistant tubes from say Sunlite are thicker but the quality is uneven and you may get a dog. Not going to happen with a Schwalbe. I would in fact go bigger than normal, this benefit is big enough to justify it. An Aventon L2 has 27.5x2.1 tires, so even with Tannus inside you should be able to fit this one or this one, depending on whether you need to go Presta or Schraeder valve (Aventon shows Schraeders in their pics).
3. Use a sealant. Flatout Sportsman formula is hands-down the best sealant and capable of sealing holes twice as large (or more) than Slime, Stans, Orange Seal or any other competitor. You can get Flatout on Amazon and even Home Depot stocks the ATV formula which will work just as well.

Here's a good side by side comparison of sealants that is pretty definitive. It also includes Tannus inserts

And I wrote this one myself.

(e?)Bike Flat Prevention

As a daily rider for decades, I have some thoughts on this subject. Mostly along the lines of “no flats allowed, ever”.

talesontwowheels.com

I wrote that in 2020, so the newfangled unproven stuff I talk about like Flatout and Tannus have in the ensuing years proven themselves (more or less).

One thing I wouldn't do is a pump within its own internal batteries. I say this as a result of trying the technology, deciding it worked so well I committed to it, and then a few years later figuring out the batteries don't last over the long term. The last thing you need on the side of the road with a flat is a 3-year-old pump with li ion batteries that are no longer any good, even if you kept them up by recharging every couple of months. I have gone back to this kind of compressor which is effectively unkillable:

A Lightweight Electric Emergency Bike Pump

Got an ebike? Use the big battery you are already lugging around to power a small portable pump.

talesontwowheels.com

 

[sc00ter]

I've done the Tannus and Mr. Tuffy at the same time and STILL got a flat. Flats are like death and taxes, they can't be avoided. But doing extra steps (Tannus, Tuffys, Slime) will help. I carry one of those Slime Scab patch kits. You can fix a puncture without removing the wheel. Oh, and it's always the rear wheel that gets a flat!

 

[gromike]

One thing I wouldn't do is a pump within its own internal batteries. I say this as a result of trying the technology, deciding it worked so well I committed to it, and then a few years later figuring out the batteries don't last over the long term. The last thing you need on the side of the road with a flat is a 3-year-old pump with li ion batteries that are no longer any good, even if you kept them up by recharging every couple of months. I have gone back to this kind of compressor which is effectively unkillable.

As I read the above I thought what is wrong with a good old-fashioned frame mounted pump. Then I remembered I have an ebike .

 

[Mr. Coffee]

I'm just going to fly into the face of conventional wisdom transcribed here.

You are far more likely to get a flat the more miles you have on your tire or tubes. Aggressively replace your tires and you will, on the average, experience fewer flats. Tubes are cheap so replace them when you replace your tires.

One of the unmentioned downsides of Tannus Armor is when you do get a flat, it is going to be a much bigger project to repair -- especially in emergency conditions on a roadside at night in the rain. To a lesser extent tire inserts like Mr. Tuffy can also be a pain when you get an inevitable flat.

Invest in the best tires with the best flat protection you can find.

For me, the best compromise has been to run tubeless with very good tires that I replace about every fifteen hundred miles. In over four thousand miles of riding that has translated into one flat tire that was easily repaired by airing up the tire and riding onwards. I'd estimate that I'd need to use a tire plug every two or three years, and perhaps once every dozen years I might be totally screwed and have to use a tire boot and a tube to limp home. I do a lot of riding on pretty atrocious roads that eat up tires, so your mileage will vary.

If you are running with tubes, I'd recommend:

• Buying the best tires with the best flat protection you can find for your rim and wheel size. And expect to replace them pretty frequently.
• Buy good-quality tubes
• Put a sealant like Flatout in the tubes.
• In any event, replace the tires and tubes every year.
• Carry tools to fix a flat and air up a tire in an emergency.

Also: be obsessive about checking your tire pressure! I'd recommend checking your tire pressure before every ride and air 'em up if they aren't right,

 

[Mike TowpathTraveler]

Some great advice here, as usual. There are no set-in-stone answers to what you seek; just the solid, real-world experience by each and every one of us who have taken the time to post.

Myself, I can say I've pretty much done it all. Started with Mr Tuffy liners on my Haibike Full FatSix's 4.0 Jumbo Jims on 80mm rims. Got flats on that. I await for the day when Mr Tuffy or somebody does a woven stainless steel mesh and kevlar liner and I'll be the first in line to buy it.......

After the Mr Tuffy's, it was onto tubeless, using Orange Seal sub zero sealant and for any pesky road side punctures, the very nice and expensive DynaPlug Pill Kit along with extra plugs.....https://shop.dynaplug.com/products/dynaplug%C2%AE-pill I thought I was all good until one day road riding in Beverly, NJ and I ran over a piece of steel that tore a good sized hole in the tire. Only through a miracle and about 6 dynaplugs in that hole, did I make it the 12 more miles to homebase. After that, I went back to tubes......but with the added promise of security that Tannus Armour promised.

And a few months into riding, again on the shoulder of an asphalt road, I picked up a quarter inch thorn, that managed to puncture that Tannus Fat Liner, holing the tube in the process. Note to poster @ m@Robertson, one time I did try my standard fat bike tube in the Tannus, but there was no way it would fit on my 80mm rim. I suspect you are using a wider fat bike rim than my 80's?

Today, I still run standard tubes with the TA's and have resigned myself to the facts of life that says no matter which way you go, fats are just part of the game we call ebiking. I do recommend carrying 2 tubes, a patch kit, a good air pump (I use a Lezyne MicroDrive XL https://ride.lezyne.com/products/1-mp-mfdr-xl-v104 And of course, a pannier to hold all this stuff!

Tannus Armour installation, 7/2020. That pink foam liner has to go into that Schwalbe Jumbo Jim 26x4.0. Tannus provides a smaller sized tube that goes into this liner. I tried fitting my 26x4.0-4.8 tube into the liner and tire, but it would not fit.

 

[Aushiker]

Invest in the best tires with the best flat protection you can find.

This has been my approach for a long time ... Schwalbe tyres (Mathons on my touring bike), and my forthcoming SuperCharger 2 has Jimmy Watts as its OEM tyres. Matched with Schwalbe tubes.

I'm not a fan of sealants or other forms of protection so do not bother with them.

For me, the best compromise has been to run tubeless with very good tires that I replace about every fifteen hundred miles.

My preference is also for tubeless, and I built my fat bike as tubeless but cannot justify the cost of switching over to tubeless-ready rims on either my touring bike or the Supercharger. I may yet do a 'conversion' of the existing rims on the SuperCharger 2.

 

[scottsdalecommuter]

Congrats on the new bike! That’s a great looking bike. With two different inserts you’ll be just fine. I’ve got two years and 2000 miles on tannus armour and no regrets. My last mountain bike, I swear I got 10 flats in a year. I got so good I could swap the tube in like 10 minutes or less. Enjoy the new bike!

 

[fooferdoggie]

yes the cost of tubeless if you dont have the rims is really high. our tandem has not had one flat all winter long and we usually have at least one even with marathon plus. I had to change from light weight slicks on my trek as the winter made the roads pretty hard on tires but even then I could make it home and add more fluid. once I got the valves to stay tight and replace leaky valves and top up the fluid if have trouble holding air its been pretty good. the tandem goes about a month between adding air and my trek 2 or three weeks. but the best part is the tires re much softer then with tubes or liners.

 

[Wiley Coyote]

I picked up a spare inner tube today at our LBS, a Specialized Air Lock (Schrader Valve) Inner Trbe for those just incase moments, from what I read, they get descent reviews. They supposedly have sealant already inside the tube.

 

[Slaphappygamer]

My armor got pierced!

The straight part, along the lighter, went right into my tire. I heard it immediately. I was about a half mile from home, so I walked back and drove to work. The time it took me to walk back would be the same amount of time it takes me to change the tube. This is why I don’t carry any other flat protection. The walk back was nice. My buddy stopped to offer a hand. He was on his road bike. Had a good chat, then we parted ways. I think, on the walk back home, the stabby clip pierced my tube a couple of more times. When I got the tube out later that night, there were 3 holes in that area. I checked the armor and tire for other stabby objects. All clear. I bought a replacement tube and am back on the road.

This is the song that was playing while the event took place.

 

[Wiley Coyote]

My armor got pierced!

View attachment 172445

The straight part, along the lighter, went right into my tire. I heard it immediately. I was about a half mile from home, so I walked back and drove to work. The time it took me to walk back would be the same amount of time it takes me to change the tube. This is why I don’t carry any other flat protection. The walk back was nice. My buddy stopped to offer a hand. He was on his road bike. Had a good chat, then we parted ways. I think, on the walk back home, the stabby clip pierced my tube a couple of more times. When I got the tube out later that night, there were 3 holes in that area. I checked the armor and tire for other stabby objects. All clear. I bought a replacement tube and am back on the road.

This is the song that was playing while the event took place.

Yea, from what I had been reading the Tannus Armour Insert isn't an answer to an age old question of flat prevention, even on cars with steel belted radials are prone to puntures. But, having the Inserts gives me a bit of insurance, peace of mind, so to speak oppose to if I didn't have them, if that makes sense? I do believe that they do help under certain conditions, but as you clearly pointed out, they do have their limits. I like the song...

 

[Wiley Coyote]

In the 1960s, butyl tubes were subject to blowouts. Now there seems to be latex rubber in butyl tubes. It seems these tubes provide some protection against blowouts. I have a rechargeable pump that would fit in a coat pocket, is faster than even a full-sized floor pump, and has the capacity to inflate a bicycle tire too many times to count. If a leak were slow enough that inflation would let you ride 5 minutes, this pump could get you a long way, stopping every five minutes. I just don't know how common old-fashioned blowouts are these days.

I have a similiar rechargeable pump as you described, I bought off of Amazon. You could easily fit in your coat pocket, it works wonders. It will pump up a tire in about a minute.