smorgasbord
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
This post is a long time coming. About 11 months ago, I purchased a Luna Apollo. A few months later, we purchased a second Apollo for my wife.
First, the good news: we love our bikes. We can ride anywhere: on-road, off-road, long trips, up steep hills, etc. The full-suspension works well, is more comfortable on road than a suspension seatpost. I was able to swap out some components to make them comfortable for us. Here's a photo of them mid-ride in world-renown Pebble Beach:
Now the bad news: My wife's Apollo was cheaper than mine to buy, but the components weren't nearly as nice. Heck, they even had to lock out the high gear at the factory because they couldn't get it to work! That meant a not-so-high gear (12 tooth), which may be OK for off-road, but not on-road. Buying upgrades, even after selling the take-offs ended up making the second bike more expensive than the first. But even after spending for upgrades, the price is still cheaper than anything else of equal quality and capability (eg, 1.1 kilowatt battery).
The first bike came with a SRAM GX drivetrain with 12-speed 10-50 rear cassette, Shimano dual-piston hydraulic brakes, a wonderful Wren inverted front fork, and nice Wren carbon stem and handlebars. The riding position with the stem and handlebars wasn't quite right for me, so I ended up with an SQLabs handlebar and a 45 degree stem. Easy swap. The bike came with a dropper post, but even at high it wasn't high enough for me, so I had to raise the dropper post base in the bike. Not the easiest thing given the cable, but I got it done. While the WTB seat was pretty decent, I ended up replacing it with a SQLabs seat.
It also came with 27.5 Boost wheels whose 26mm rims weren't really wide enough for the 3" wide tires the bike came with and which I wanted to run (those wheels are still for sale cheap if anyone wants a set of 27.5" wheels, tubeless ready). I found a set at closeout that had wider 35mm rims and was lighter to boot. Got a second set for my wife's bike. One issue was the rear wheel needed to support the SRAM XD driver, which supports the 10 tooth high gear.
I ended up buying an EggRider to replace the built-in Luna-branded Bafang display. It's pretty small, but I always mount my phone front and center (for navigation and trip data), so it's actually a cleaner setup for me, and the programmability for the Bafang Ultra is good to have. Check out the "Show Us Your Cockpit" thread for photos of what I've done there. Programming wise, the only changes I've made are to support 10 levels instead of the stock 5, and adjusted the max output at the lower levels to not be so high. I *want* the exercise.
Another issue was that being a carbon fiber full-suspension bike, there's no easy way to get a rear rack. I ended up with a Topeak QR Beam Rack MTX Bicycle Rack (A Type), which has a quick release clamp so I only use it when I need it. And since I had raised the dropper post, I'm able to clamp the rack onto the non-movable part of the post and I can still use the dropper! I don't put a lot of weight on the rear (mostly sandwiches and such). Here's a photo with the rear rack:
Getting the second Apollo was quite a let-down. The SRAM NX drivetrain isn't nearly as nice as the GX drivetrain, doesn't support the 10 tooth high gear and heck, didn't even support the 11 tooth high gear! The wheels had wider 30mm rims so they would have been OK for the 3" wide tires, but as we wanted the high 10-tooth gear we needed to change the rear wheel anyway to support the XD driver, so I swapped both to the same wheelset as on my bike. The brakes on the second Apollo were now SRAM Guides, which are nice, but since I had Shimano on my bike I wanted both bikes to support the same brake fluid and bleed procedure. Instead of the Wren inverted fork my wife's bike came with a Rockshox Debonair Yari 160mm fork. It also came with a slightly downgraded Rockshox rear shock. Ugh. It also came with a regular aluminum alloy stem and handlebar, which was fine since we replaced those anyway for comfort.
I bought an SRAM GX derailleur, 10-50 cassette, and some X01 chains (after reading that the X01 chains last the longest of any chain). The chain length I needed was a few links longer than the length SRAM supplies, so I've got two master links in place. Come to think of it, the original chain was exactly the 126 link length supplied by SRAM so maybe that's why Luna couldn't get all the gears to work. I sold the NX cassette and derailleur. I ended up buying quad-piston Shimano brakes for my wife and sold the SRAM Guides.
My wife needs a more upright posture than even I need. I used an adjustable stem to find out that we needed a 45 degree Charisma from ErgoTech and then got her a Jones handlebar. I don't have a good photo of her cockpit, but here's another photo of both bikes:
A side note. Eric at Luna is an interesting character, and from the comments in his videos I'm sure he wouldn't approve of our comfort handlebars and seats. I'll argue my age with Eric should that ever come up (my beautiful wife will always be young).
We did end up buying the handlebar bag that Jones sells that fit right in the space between the two bars. It was more expensive than the handlebar itself! But, it fits perfectly and my wife keeps her water bottle in it. That reminds me - there are no attachments for a water bottle cage - not even any space for one. I got a top tube bag to hold my water bottle.
Recently, I purchased the Topeak Tetrarack M1 Rack, which fits onto suspension forks. My wife's fork isn't inverted, so she gets it. Haven't fitted it yet.
One ironic thing is that the second Apollo came with better tires: Maxxis Minons instead of Chronicles. However, those are for off-road only so I ended up selling the Minions and buying another set of Chronicles, which run smoother on pavement. I just can't win.
Some other details: The bikes come with shift sensors that temporarily halt motor output while shifting. Took a bit to get used to it, but it's good to have. The brakes do not have motor inhibitors, which is just fine.
Anyway, at the end of the day after the swaps (which, btw, I never asked nor expected Luna to perform for me
) we now have two very capable and comfortable for us e-bikes with a 500% gear ratio, 1100 watt-hour batteries, and strong Bafang Ultra motors. We're quite happy, although in the back of my mind I'm still considering saving up for a Watt Wagon Archon controller Bafang Ultra motor upgrade. Downside there is I don't think I could continue to use the EggRider.
We do get a bit of attention from other riders, people in cars, and even pedestrians at stop lights. The combination of a full-suspension carbon-fiber frame with a big carbon fiber cased battery filling up just about the whole triangle is pretty unique.
Do I recommend the Apollo? I would recommend the bike if it came like our first one. The second one reduces utility far more than any money saved. If anyone in the Silicon Valley area has a Watt Wagon Travalanche, it'd be fun to get not-so-close together to compare/contrast. I can say that after the modifications, we're really happy with out setups and we ride as often as we can.
Finally, I still have some components for sale:
2 sets of 27.5" Boost wheels - Luna Apollo pulls
Luna alloy Handlebars for Sale
Ritchey carbon seatpost, Ritchey "clipless" pedals
A Smorgasbord of Stems! (Risers Sold)
Kriket Gauge for Gates Belt tensioning, $12 plus shipping
First, the good news: we love our bikes. We can ride anywhere: on-road, off-road, long trips, up steep hills, etc. The full-suspension works well, is more comfortable on road than a suspension seatpost. I was able to swap out some components to make them comfortable for us. Here's a photo of them mid-ride in world-renown Pebble Beach:
Now the bad news: My wife's Apollo was cheaper than mine to buy, but the components weren't nearly as nice. Heck, they even had to lock out the high gear at the factory because they couldn't get it to work! That meant a not-so-high gear (12 tooth), which may be OK for off-road, but not on-road. Buying upgrades, even after selling the take-offs ended up making the second bike more expensive than the first. But even after spending for upgrades, the price is still cheaper than anything else of equal quality and capability (eg, 1.1 kilowatt battery).
The first bike came with a SRAM GX drivetrain with 12-speed 10-50 rear cassette, Shimano dual-piston hydraulic brakes, a wonderful Wren inverted front fork, and nice Wren carbon stem and handlebars. The riding position with the stem and handlebars wasn't quite right for me, so I ended up with an SQLabs handlebar and a 45 degree stem. Easy swap. The bike came with a dropper post, but even at high it wasn't high enough for me, so I had to raise the dropper post base in the bike. Not the easiest thing given the cable, but I got it done. While the WTB seat was pretty decent, I ended up replacing it with a SQLabs seat.
It also came with 27.5 Boost wheels whose 26mm rims weren't really wide enough for the 3" wide tires the bike came with and which I wanted to run (those wheels are still for sale cheap if anyone wants a set of 27.5" wheels, tubeless ready). I found a set at closeout that had wider 35mm rims and was lighter to boot. Got a second set for my wife's bike. One issue was the rear wheel needed to support the SRAM XD driver, which supports the 10 tooth high gear.
I ended up buying an EggRider to replace the built-in Luna-branded Bafang display. It's pretty small, but I always mount my phone front and center (for navigation and trip data), so it's actually a cleaner setup for me, and the programmability for the Bafang Ultra is good to have. Check out the "Show Us Your Cockpit" thread for photos of what I've done there. Programming wise, the only changes I've made are to support 10 levels instead of the stock 5, and adjusted the max output at the lower levels to not be so high. I *want* the exercise.
Another issue was that being a carbon fiber full-suspension bike, there's no easy way to get a rear rack. I ended up with a Topeak QR Beam Rack MTX Bicycle Rack (A Type), which has a quick release clamp so I only use it when I need it. And since I had raised the dropper post, I'm able to clamp the rack onto the non-movable part of the post and I can still use the dropper! I don't put a lot of weight on the rear (mostly sandwiches and such). Here's a photo with the rear rack:
Getting the second Apollo was quite a let-down. The SRAM NX drivetrain isn't nearly as nice as the GX drivetrain, doesn't support the 10 tooth high gear and heck, didn't even support the 11 tooth high gear! The wheels had wider 30mm rims so they would have been OK for the 3" wide tires, but as we wanted the high 10-tooth gear we needed to change the rear wheel anyway to support the XD driver, so I swapped both to the same wheelset as on my bike. The brakes on the second Apollo were now SRAM Guides, which are nice, but since I had Shimano on my bike I wanted both bikes to support the same brake fluid and bleed procedure. Instead of the Wren inverted fork my wife's bike came with a Rockshox Debonair Yari 160mm fork. It also came with a slightly downgraded Rockshox rear shock. Ugh. It also came with a regular aluminum alloy stem and handlebar, which was fine since we replaced those anyway for comfort.
I bought an SRAM GX derailleur, 10-50 cassette, and some X01 chains (after reading that the X01 chains last the longest of any chain). The chain length I needed was a few links longer than the length SRAM supplies, so I've got two master links in place. Come to think of it, the original chain was exactly the 126 link length supplied by SRAM so maybe that's why Luna couldn't get all the gears to work. I sold the NX cassette and derailleur. I ended up buying quad-piston Shimano brakes for my wife and sold the SRAM Guides.
My wife needs a more upright posture than even I need. I used an adjustable stem to find out that we needed a 45 degree Charisma from ErgoTech and then got her a Jones handlebar. I don't have a good photo of her cockpit, but here's another photo of both bikes:
A side note. Eric at Luna is an interesting character, and from the comments in his videos I'm sure he wouldn't approve of our comfort handlebars and seats. I'll argue my age with Eric should that ever come up (my beautiful wife will always be young).
We did end up buying the handlebar bag that Jones sells that fit right in the space between the two bars. It was more expensive than the handlebar itself! But, it fits perfectly and my wife keeps her water bottle in it. That reminds me - there are no attachments for a water bottle cage - not even any space for one. I got a top tube bag to hold my water bottle.
Recently, I purchased the Topeak Tetrarack M1 Rack, which fits onto suspension forks. My wife's fork isn't inverted, so she gets it. Haven't fitted it yet.
One ironic thing is that the second Apollo came with better tires: Maxxis Minons instead of Chronicles. However, those are for off-road only so I ended up selling the Minions and buying another set of Chronicles, which run smoother on pavement. I just can't win.
Some other details: The bikes come with shift sensors that temporarily halt motor output while shifting. Took a bit to get used to it, but it's good to have. The brakes do not have motor inhibitors, which is just fine.
Anyway, at the end of the day after the swaps (which, btw, I never asked nor expected Luna to perform for me
) we now have two very capable and comfortable for us e-bikes with a 500% gear ratio, 1100 watt-hour batteries, and strong Bafang Ultra motors. We're quite happy, although in the back of my mind I'm still considering saving up for a Watt Wagon Archon controller Bafang Ultra motor upgrade. Downside there is I don't think I could continue to use the EggRider.We do get a bit of attention from other riders, people in cars, and even pedestrians at stop lights. The combination of a full-suspension carbon-fiber frame with a big carbon fiber cased battery filling up just about the whole triangle is pretty unique.
Do I recommend the Apollo? I would recommend the bike if it came like our first one. The second one reduces utility far more than any money saved. If anyone in the Silicon Valley area has a Watt Wagon Travalanche, it'd be fun to get not-so-close together to compare/contrast. I can say that after the modifications, we're really happy with out setups and we ride as often as we can.
Finally, I still have some components for sale:
2 sets of 27.5" Boost wheels - Luna Apollo pulls
Luna alloy Handlebars for Sale
Ritchey carbon seatpost, Ritchey "clipless" pedals
A Smorgasbord of Stems! (Risers Sold)
Kriket Gauge for Gates Belt tensioning, $12 plus shipping
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