30 Days Ago, Needed Oxygen, a Walker, and a Home Health Aid to Leave The House. Today...

[Jeremy McCreary]

The real danger is that the Lizard People hack the app and gain access to my heart and soul, transforming me into some kind of zombie cannibal. (Okay, it's possible that I'm only 99.6% cognitively intact. I may have acquired some very low-level delusions, though that is speculative.)

I used to worry about the Reptilians. But after 20 years of living near the huge colony in the vast underground beneath Denver International Airport, I think they're harmless.

The ones I worry about now are the Zargonians — those pesky alien pranksters in the mothership hiding behind the moon. Wouldn't put it past them to hack our HRMs and power meters just to make us think we're drifting out of Zone 2.

And sit there at the viewer laughing at us the whole time. But what do you expect when you put a master class in pranking Earthlings like the Allen Funt Show out there for all the aliens to see?
;^}

 

[Jeremy McCreary]

Actually, I do not have a cardiologist, though my GP consults with one regarding my case. I meet with my GP in a couple of weeks, and I'll ask her what HR she might recommend or if she has any thoughts on the situation. She may either give me numbers to hit for each zone, or refer me to cardiology or something else. No, I have not been given any heart rate or any other restrictions by any specialist, incredibly, though I asked whether I had any on multiple occasions.

If you've asked several times, and no one taking care of you is offering restrictions, I'd put a lot of weight on not needing restrictions at this point. Maybe ask one more time, but docs tend to err on the side of caution.

Problem is, few docs have had the training or experience to fully understand a patient like you. And fewer still understand zone training.

So you're on your own with zones, just like the rest of us. Before commiting to strict zone-based training, though, look at the 2 GCN videos below. Well-researched and clear-eyed about the established benefits and open questions as of 2026.

Look especially at the sections at 10:45 and 13:40. These outline the zone guidance you can get just by paying attention to your breathing. Might be all you need for a casual training program.

Answer to the title question: Yes, strict zone training works for elite cyclists. For the rest of us, not so clear.

 

[stompandgo]

Jeremy's point about being able to speak normally while in zone 2 and not above, that's not too far off. It's not a metric, but it's probably true for most non-elite riders who are not training for racing. One thing, anyone who has a heart condition should NEVER even utter the words "maximum heart rate". There's only one way to find out. It's dangerous, and Max HR is not a meaningful metric, anyway. Just say no.

Getting into FTP testing, workout tracking, managing power, HR, and RPE, should be above what most recreational riders should be concerning themselves with, unless they're used to doing it because they used to do it in the past, or they're curious. If so, go for it.

Some people love to throw around power numbers, that stupid race category power chart, and HR numbers. It's a waste of time for recreational riders, and for racers, results are all that matter.

The most important metric out of the three I mentioned above is the one that has no numbers, RPE (Relative Perceived Exertion). It's how you are feeling at the moment. For those recovering from trauma, it's the best way to measure effort when fitness is changing irregularly. You don't need any hardware to measure it, either.

 

[stompandgo]

This is a good entry level book on the subject.

 

[Catalyzt]

These are great resources and I will look into them!

What I'm wondering now is if WALKING in my neighborhood qualifies as Zone 2. For the hills at least, yes, I can speak in complete sentences, but my speech would reflect the fact that I'm exercising.

Given the topography of where I live, that might be what I have to do for my Zone 2 days.

 

[Jeremy McCreary]

The most important metric out of the three I mentioned above is the one that has no numbers, RPE (Relative Perceived Exertion). It's how you are feeling at the moment. For those recovering from trauma, it's the best way to measure effort when fitness is changing irregularly. You don't need any hardware to measure it, either.

Any thoughts on how @Catalyzt would operationalize RPE in a casual endurance-oriented training program?

There are many RPE rating charts out there, but the various descriptions for, say, RPE 6 give me no confidence that I could reliably target RPE 6 from one session to the next.

 

[stompandgo]

You can try and put numbers to it but it's not a number, it's a perception, which is subjective. Each athlete has to develop it for themselves. I think in his situation, I would start with respiratory rate. Zone 2 usually tops out with a resp rate that's higher than sitting, but steady and effortless. Once breathing starts to take some effort, you're typically in zone 3 or higher. Racers call it "nose breathing".

I would strongly suggest that the OP get an HRM. It doesn't have to be a chest strap. HR and RPE is how everybody trained and raced before there were power meters.

 

[Jeremy McCreary]

Reviewed several interviews yesterday with Dr. Inigo San Millan, Pogi's training physiologist. A pioneer and still a leading authority in metabolic zone training.

This guy's got all the lab equipment and experience in the world at his disposal. And yet, he's a big believer in using breathing/talking patterns to individualize key metabolic zone boundaries in riders with no lab access.

He's NOT a fan of generic zone boundaries based only on FTP or heart rate stats.

You can bracket Zone 2 and identify the upper bound of Zone 4 with the key breathing observations detailed below at 10:45 and 13:40.

Then you correlate these personal boundaries with your power meter or HRM to make them easier to apply in the saddle. San Millan says both metrics work well for this purpose.

So, trying to think of a less subjective way to operationalize this when there's no one to converse with. For example, you could use standard sentences — say, from some passage you've memorized.

One promising approach I'm trying now: Repeatedly counting out loud to see how far I get before having to inhale: 1 one thousand, 2 one thousand, 3 one thousand...

Now I just need to calibrate the counts against the standard approach in the video. And ultimately correlate with my power meter and HRM.

Has anyone else tried this? Maybe you have an even better way?

 

[gromike]

I'm more inclined to pedal and sing. Started touring before the Walkman, so it's natural for me.

 

[Jeremy McCreary]

I'm more inclined to pedal and sing.

For zone training purposes?

 

[gromike]

At 72 I don't worry about zone training, just enjoy the ride.

 

[stompandgo]

He's NOT a fan of generic zone boundaries based only on FTP or heart rate stats.

Neither am I. I prefer all three, and so do most cycling coaches.

Once you have a base of effort where you know well what is feeling good and what is not, you will define your own RPE. Resp rate can certainly be a part of this. I have talked to myself as I crossed zones, and I'm not crazy (I think).

 

[Jeremy McCreary]

Once you have a base of effort where you know well what is feeling good and what is not, you will define your own RPE. Resp rate can certainly be a part of this.

Slowly coming around to that point of view but having a hard time putting it into practice by myself.

For example, lots of noise in my RPE signal. Paid attention to 3-second rider power, HR, breathing, and RPE on today's 25 mi hill and coast fitness ride. The first 3 tracked together pretty well, but RPE felt all over the map — surprisingly low sometimes at 250-300W and high sometimes at 150-200W.

Hard to see how I'm going to turn RPE into a reliable training guide. The traffic stops and ever-changing gradients here aren't helping.

I have talked to myself as I crossed zones, and I'm not crazy (I think).

That's not what it says in the bathroom.
;^}

 

[stompandgo]

If this is the first time you've consciously paid attention to all three, give it time. The noise is inexperience. You may be looking at it like a number, similar to the other two. Finite. Defined. It's not, and it's not supposed to be. I know you're a scientific guy so it might not be easy to adapt to this.

 

[Jeremy McCreary]

If this is the first time you've consciously paid attention to all three, give it time. The noise is inexperience.

OK, I'll keep at it.

You may be looking at it like a number, similar to the other two. Finite. Defined. It's not, and it's not supposed to be.

No, not looking at RPE levels as quantities, just as ordered labels for certain feelings on the bike. Same with zone numbers — just labels.

If we have no labels for these things, how can we recognize and track them — even informally?

I know you're a scientific guy so it might not be easy to adapt to this.

True, but I'm prepared to go all Zen on this if I have to. Lots of practice becoming one with the ocean in the last 3 years.

 

[Jeremy McCreary]

A GCN video reminded me yesterday of a major gotcha in zone training (ZT):

If you can't actually stay in Zone 2 when you're supposed to, maybe ZT isn't for you.

Many credible sources on ZT recommend a roughly 80/20% mix of Zone 2/4 riding. But to reap max benefit, you really need to stay in Zone 2 (Z2) when it's Z2 time.

And many find that very hard to do in practice, myself included. Oh, so easy for me to keep straying into Z3, and I'm by no means alone in this.

Problem is, if you indulge in Z3 or Z4 for even a few minutes, it could take your metabolism 30 minutes to return to the state actually targeted in Z2 riding. If you're committed to ZT, 30 minutes of Z2 time is a lot to lose.

My main impediments to Z2 compliance are jumbled hilly terrain and insufficient discipline. It's easiest to stay in any zone on long straight, flat roads with no traffic interference. No such roads where I live, even on the coast. Gradient's constantly changing.

Having seen the mountains where @Catalyzt lives, I think terrain's going to be a major barrier to ZT for him as well.

As for discipline, not really looking for more discipline in my retirement. Z3 and Z4 can feel very good at times. Hard to resist when the mood strikes, and why should I? To me, the bicycle is first and foremost a fun machine.

Also hard to stay focused on an HR or rider power display when there are so many better things to see, hear, and think about on a bike.

@Catalyzt has a strong incentive to train right now. Question is how best for him to do that. I'm thinking now that ZT may not be the answer.

As for me, well, I'm not training for anything. My TdF days are over. Just want to get stronger over time. Just can't see how I'm gonna stay in Zone 2 when I'm supposed to. So ZT's probably not for me, either.

However, ZT isn't our only option. The GCN videos I linked above make a very important point: Current research indicates that if you're not already a highly trained rider, ANY effort in the saddle will be beneficial. For recreational riders, the shortest path to greater fitness may well be above Zone 2.

I take that as permission to exercise any way I want on the bike. Every ride has fitness segments already. Keep it fun, and I'll do more.

 

[stompandgo]

That's what I've been saying for a while now. You have to have discipline to stick to the workout and not gun it because you feel good.

I was able to do Z2 rides in a very hilly area. Remember, it's Zone 2 average for the interval. These are best done on a loop. What goes up must come down.