A quick ride review of the Vado SL 4.0

[Stefan Mikes]

Just to clarify: While the Vado SL is my principal e-bike, which I ride almost every day and almost all year long, I also enjoy riding my full power Vado, especially on long weekend paved road escapades and especially in the montane areas on my vacation. There are situations under which the full power is just necessary (I can recollect our epic vacation ride with brother in Czech/Polish Giant Mountains from Trutnov CZ to Horni Mala Upa CZ at the foot of the Snowy White Mt. It was the highest single climb of 556 m or 1,824 ft in my life. Vado SL would not help me making that climb!) Otherwise, the full power Vado feels too strong for me, and its use is justified for very long road trips at relatively low assistance and with spare batteries.

My choice of Vado SL for the majority of the latest ultramarathon was the terrain to be ridden. The "big" Vado is hopeless on sandy or muddy roads, or in the forest. It is too heavy to be carried over terrain obstacles: it feels like a small motorcycle. Necessary to mention, most of other contenders in the race were riding lightweight gravel bikes. Many of them were tired and could not ride fast on the pavement but they zoomed the terrible sandy/muddy/forest roads easily!

A mound made of loose soil, rubble and full of tree roots. A place you could only carry your bike up and downhill.

A high and steep staircase. I cannot fancy myself getting the heavy Vado upstairs there! Yes, the Walk Mode could help.
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Both Specialized e-bikes were real bargains for me (I also owned two other e-bikes including a full suspension Giant bought at the full price). The big Vado 5.0 was the New Old Stock e-bike that was later converted by Specialized twice (all on the regular or lifetime warranty) into a Vado 6.0. @mfgrep: you read my Vado SL demo ride report. I mentioned there was a white Vado SL on the floor of the showroom; in two weeks I bought exactly that white e-bike with a nice discount (for 2020 model in 2021) because the life seemed too short to be waiting for an unicorn Now, it's been exactly two years since I bought that Vado SL I'm talking about now. It has 10,306 km (6,405 mi) on the odometer and counting!
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@dynamic, you are a relatively young person. I'm glad you can ride a lightweight unpowered bike, and I also know about your hilly neighbourhood. Certainly you have got fit because of your workouts and I wish you getting in perfect shape! Yet, many of us here are senior citizen who need at least some e-bike assistance, and Vado SL checks most of the boxes.

Besides: Have you heard of the latest Bosch SX motor and system? It might be the unicorn you've been waiting for! As for me, I'm familiar with Specialized, and I own several SL Range Extenders that are compatible with the new SL 1.2 motor, should I need to buy a new SL e-bike

 

[dynamic]

I know this is an e-bike forum. What I am going to post here is why e-bikes are amazing. I just did my first "real" ride on the Sirrus X 4.0. 7.46 miles in 1 hour and 6 minutes including a stop for a muffin and rests on some hills. The pause break (to buy said muffin) was 8-10 minutes. 58 minutes was "moving time" but that includes time I was recovering on the harder hills. I also stopped and walked the bike several times. It was 597 feet in elevation, the lion's share was in the last 1.21 miles. Those 1.21 miles averaged 3.2 mph (obviously, this includes the walking or resting, didn't pause the app) and I was largely in zone 5 heart rate for climbing 22 minutes with another 15 in zone 4.

I both love and hate this bike. The list of good things is nearly endless. It handles fast downhill like a dream, it makes me *want* to use my legs as suspension to deal with potholes/rough roads that I can't avoid, it tackles gravel almost better than road, it doesn't flop around when I am going really slow, it handles fast S trail turns at obscene speeds... I mean, the list goes on. Fantastic bike.

What don't I like? 1) Chains while climbing or when I forget to downshift at stop still sucks. 2) I still can't handle my hill with my current fitness.

Currently, I am questioning if I should bother putting money into this bike. I still don't have a good grasp on if a change from say 26 gear inches to 20 gear inches (roughly) (11-50 cassette with 36T chainring) will make enough of a difference to *enjoyably* ride this bike up these hills. I can say that the vado SL 4.0 let me climb this hill on turbo without stopping. I also stacked my rest in favor of this working. I haven't done a lifting workout since Saturday, meaning I am as rested as I would ever be to do such a ride (I usually don't take more than 1 day of rest from lifting per week).

The vado SL, or really any e-bike that makes that climb more enjoyable is a win. But, even on e-bikes, I tend to route around this climb. There is something about it that is soul sucking. And I tended to choose routes that go up and over the mountain and come out near my house. That's not viable on the Sirrus X, but on a full power e-bike, it's a blast.

Anyway, just reinforcing that the vado SL really *is* a spectacular bike. But, for me, more power is really going to make the difference between going anywhere and not.

Keep riding!

 

[mfgrep]

I know this is an e-bike forum. What I am going to post here is why e-bikes are amazing. I just did my first "real" ride on the Sirrus X 4.0. 7.46 miles in 1 hour and 6 minutes including a stop for a muffin and rests on some hills. The pause break (to buy said muffin) was 8-10 minutes. 58 minutes was "moving time" but that includes time I was recovering on the harder hills. I also stopped and walked the bike several times. It was 597 feet in elevation, the lion's share was in the last 1.21 miles. Those 1.21 miles averaged 3.2 mph (obviously, this includes the walking or resting, didn't pause the app) and I was largely in zone 5 heart rate for climbing 22 minutes with another 15 in zone 4.

I both love and hate this bike. The list of good things is nearly endless. It handles fast downhill like a dream, it makes me *want* to use my legs as suspension to deal with potholes/rough roads that I can't avoid, it tackles gravel almost better than road, it doesn't flop around when I am going really slow, it handles fast S trail turns at obscene speeds... I mean, the list goes on. Fantastic bike.

What don't I like? 1) Chains while climbing or when I forget to downshift at stop still sucks. 2) I still can't handle my hill with my current fitness.

Currently, I am questioning if I should bother putting money into this bike. I still don't have a good grasp on if a change from say 26 gear inches to 20 gear inches (roughly) (11-50 cassette with 36T chainring) will make enough of a difference to *enjoyably* ride this bike up these hills. I can say that the vado SL 4.0 let me climb this hill on turbo without stopping. I also stacked my rest in favor of this working. I haven't done a lifting workout since Saturday, meaning I am as rested as I would ever be to do such a ride (I usually don't take more than 1 day of rest from lifting per week).

The vado SL, or really any e-bike that makes that climb more enjoyable is a win. But, even on e-bikes, I tend to route around this climb. There is something about it that is soul sucking. And I tended to choose routes that go up and over the mountain and come out near my house. That's not viable on the Sirrus X, but on a full power e-bike, it's a blast.

Anyway, just reinforcing that the vado SL really *is* a spectacular bike. But, for me, more power is really going to make the difference between going anywhere and not.

Keep riding!

I understand your dilemma(s) and I don't envy your situation. I did a 'deep dive' reading comments about the SL last night which left me nearly believing that my new Vado SL 4.0 is a slacker's ebike with insufficient power and insufficient range. This morning I went on a relatively leisurely 8 mile ride mostly around my suburban home. Parks, asphalt trails, asphalt streets, and some sidewalks as necessary. I am 5'6" and 155lbs. By your standards I am certain that my terrain is generally 'flat' although I certainly do have some hills and I do welcome the 1.1's assistance. I spent about 50% without power, 40% on ECO, 8% on Sport, and 2% on Turbo. On the flats the bike is fantastic even without power. Long mild inclines are easily assisted by Eco mode. Starting from a dead stop on Eco or Sport really gets me up to speed promptly if situations or traffic dictates. If I'm nearing a hill's crest and I'm pooped....a quick switch over to Turbo offers immense assist. Home now I am nothing but super impressed with the bike. I have not yet charged my battery once....and I have traveled 45+ miles and I have 31% battery remaining.

I've only been here on the forum a short while but have been interested in your posts....mostly because of your interest in the Specialized SL's. You seem like a person who will require more than 1 bicycle to meet your varying needs. I am terrible at estimating hill angles/steepness so I won't bother....only to say that I find the Vado SL and its 1.1 motor to be efficient and sufficient. I knew when I bought the bike that it was not among the more powerful ebikes. I was looking to 'get in shape' and a full power ebike, to me, is 'transportation' and not 'fitness'. The Vado SL is a bicycle that requires input from me....and I am finding that the quality of that input (cadence & pedal power) directly translate to the 1.1's output. In other words....the Vado SL will not pull me up/around on its own but rather requires that I direct its assist (if that makes sense). The quality of my input directs the quality of the SL's motor assist. While not entirely rare anymore among available ebikes....this bike certainly fills a specific niche....and does so with a grace and sophistication that I was unable to experience with hub mounted motors. I don't believe that Vado SL is a 'one trick pony'.....nor do I believe that the Vado SL is a 'one and done' ebike for most people. There are days that I wish to have the full power Vado (or similar full power wide tire suspension bike) too....so that I can choose which pony based upon my outing.

I think that you already know this given your statement "for me, more power is really going to make the difference between going anywhere and not". So there you go. Given (how little) what I know from you thus far I would not suggest the Vado SL because you are still going to need to grunt and sweat on those hills....which is likely to stop you from 'going anywhere or not'. So keep your Sirrus and buy the full power ebike of your choice. That way you have a fitness bicycle and a powerful ebike.

I do not believe that I can currently find a bike that is 35+/- lbs, which rides like a good quality road bike which can be enjoyed without electric assist when desired, and which has electric power to spare on the steeps ready to call up as needed.....and all in a sexy and tidy package.....and all with an intuitive sense of 'responsiveness'.....without behaving/responding more like a moped. The Vado SL in my terrain comes darn close to being a holy grail bike....and if it had the 1.2 motor it may get even closer to that 'holy grail' bike.

I'm not so sure that you don't just need two (or more) bikes in order to 'do it all'......and it seems likely that you will always believe that SL to be underpowered for your terrain.
I don't envy your situation....because I would not be 'happy' if my sole ebike were the full powered Vado.....which to me.....is more motor assist than human assist. That bike is simply too heavy to seriously pedal without at least some electric assistance. It looks fun as hell....it just is not what I was seeking. Vado SL is to me as good as it gets right now.....but it doesn't seem to meet your needs very well.

 

[dynamic]

In other words....the Vado SL will not pull me up/around on its own but rather requires that I direct its assist (if that makes sense).

This makes perfect sense. But I would also reverse this in the case of the full vado. If the vado feels like it's pulling you with the motor, just decrease the power with micro adjust levels (your SL should have it as well). My experience is *any* e-bike that is giving you more power than needed develops that (possibly undesirable) rocket feeling. My flx blade 2.0 feels like that in anything over 4 or 5 assist (out of 9) in nearly any situation. But if I keep the power down, it feels really good. On the flip side, I can go into 9 and casually climb a wall. The big difference on the SL is other aspects of how the bike feels in terms of agility and non-motor feel. With a full vado, the goal is typically to keep the motor at a setting that effectively eliminates (most of) the feeling of a heavier bike. So, I would rarely ride it with the motor off as it *will* feel sluggish. But even 10% micro adjust is enough to eliminate most of that in flat scenarios.

I'm not so sure that you don't just need two (or more) bikes in order to 'do it all'......and it seems likely that you will always believe that SL to be underpowered for your terrain.

The problem is more than one bike doesn't help. On a given 7 mile ride, I have pot hole filled roads, gravel and massive inclines. If I want to go 15 miles, there is even greater diversity in the surfaces. I could have gone on to light trail as well on a similar route. I can't "get away" from that unless I drive somewhere (via car) for a more relaxed ride. As to the SL, it will be under powered until/if/when my power to weight ratio improves dramatically. I am 255+ pounds. Moving that uphill at 10%+ grades takes a massive amount of effort. If I had the weight of pre-kid me (sub 200) and the power I have now (from lifting), I think the SL or even the Sirrus might work.

But yeah, it sucks. And the fact that chain behavior makes me crazy really makes it hard. The best riding experience continues to be 5.0 IGH bikes (when working).

 

[mfgrep]

This makes perfect sense. But I would also reverse this in the case of the full vado. If the vado feels like it's pulling you with the motor, just decrease the power with micro adjust levels (your SL should have it as well). My experience is *any* e-bike that is giving you more power than needed develops that (possibly undesirable) rocket feeling. My flx blade 2.0 feels like that in anything over 4 or 5 assist (out of 9) in nearly any situation. But if I keep the power down, it feels really good. On the flip side, I can go into 9 and casually climb a wall. The big difference on the SL is other aspects of how the bike feels in terms of agility and non-motor feel. With a full vado, the goal is typically to keep the motor at a setting that effectively eliminates (most of) the feeling of a heavier bike. So, I would rarely ride it with the motor off as it *will* feel sluggish. But even 10% micro adjust is enough to eliminate most of that in flat scenarios.



The problem is more than one bike doesn't help. On a given 7 mile ride, I have pot hole filled roads, gravel and massive inclines. If I want to go 15 miles, there is even greater diversity in the surfaces. I could have gone on to light trail as well on a similar route. I can't "get away" from that unless I drive somewhere (via car) for a more relaxed ride. As to the SL, it will be under powered until/if/when my power to weight ratio improves dramatically. I am 255+ pounds. Moving that uphill at 10%+ grades takes a massive amount of effort. If I had the weight of pre-kid me (sub 200) and the power I have now (from lifting), I think the SL or even the Sirrus might work.

But yeah, it sucks. And the fact that chain behavior makes me crazy really makes it hard. The best riding experience continues to be 5.0 IGH bikes (when working).

Well then. Years ago when I was younger and without a child.....I was into motorcycles. I had some Japanese bikes....then moved on to Triumphs....and landed on BMW. Should you wish to 'change gears' and put a huge smile on your face.....buy yourself a BMW R1150R (or whatever similar model is made today). It was an unbelievable machine.....and it didn't use a chain!!!

 

[dynamic]

Well then. Years ago when I was younger and without a child.....I was into motorcycles. I had some Japanese bikes....then moved on to Triumphs....and landed on BMW. Should you wish to 'change gears' and put a huge smile on your face.....buy yourself a BMW R1150R (or whatever similar model is made today). It was an unbelievable machine.....and it didn't use a chain!!!

Yay belt drive! No, I still want the fitness aspect. But it also can't be so hard that my soul is sucked out of me (like this morning). The way I challenged myself on the vado is I said: "Let me try and do this ride in eco only". Or a really hard ride without any turbo. And, of course, there are days where the same route is torture because I am just tired. And pushing turbo lets that ride be fun again. No one says you need to use a full power e-bike *at* full power.

 

[mfgrep]

Yay belt drive! No, I still want the fitness aspect. But it also can't be so hard that my soul is sucked out of me (like this morning). The way I challenged myself on the vado is I said: "Let me try and do this ride in eco only". Or a really hard ride without any turbo. And, of course, there are days where the same route is torture because I am just tired. And pushing turbo lets that ride be fun again. No one says you need to use a full power e-bike *at* full power.

Nope. Shaft drive.

"no one says you need to use a full power ebike at full power". I know this....but....the bike is 100% worthless without battery power. You cannot be satisfied with chains. I cannot be satisfied with a "bicycle" that cannot be reasonably used without motor assist. At that point....at least in my head....it is no longer a "bicycle" at all.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Gents,

While my "big" Vado shines on asphalt (that's why I nicknamed it Roadrunner) and it is excellent on steep climbs, nothing can be done about its heavy weight. Enter the forest and the e-bike becomes sluggish and hard to manoeuvre, making it terribly slow. Compared, Vado SL feels a heavier gravel bike there.

Regarding the motor power... It is not really that the more powerful motor gives you less workout. The more powerful e-bike lets you travel faster with the same effort. However, faster ride takes less time to cover the same distance and that gives you less workout on the more powerful e-bike.

 

[dynamic]

Regarding the motor power... It is not really that the more powerful motor gives you less workout. The more powerful e-bike lets you travel faster with the same effort. However, faster ride takes less time to cover the same distance and that gives you less workout on the more powerful e-bike.

Or you spend the same amount of time but go further. See more things.

the bike is 100% worthless without battery power.

I honestly wouldn't put it that way. I used my vado to haul my toddler in a burley trailer with the motor off. The planted feeling of the heavier bike became a benefit in that scenario. That was one thing that really surprised me: How different trailers feel on the various bikes.

That said, there are not many scenarios I would choose one of these heavier bikes with the motor off. My blade 2.0 can be used like that for neighborhood riding with my son *because* the gear range (rohloff) is insane. Again, the weight actually becomes an advantage. Doing that on the sirrus would be tough because I would have to severely limit my own power so my son could keep up. On flat/minor rolling hills, I fly on the sirrus.

But, then again, those rides aren't meant for fun. They are accomplishing a task. Riding with the family is fun, but not directly because of the ride, but because I am spending time with the family (this is the primary purpose of the sirrus at this time: family bike rides where we drive somewhere with our bikes for relatively flat rides). Hauling groceries is a job for a full power e-bike. It just happens to also give me some bike time.

At that point....at least in my head....it is no longer a "bicycle" at all.

Sure. Until that bike enables you to reach the peak of a mountain that a lower power bike can't. I think you would feel the same about a full vado on harder/more hilly terrain where the power isn't just justified but necessary for you to tackle those climbs. It very much doesn't take the feeling of biking yourself away and adds a great sense of exhilaration when you reach a new mountain view you could never have otherwise reached. In my area, in terms of climbing, there is always something harder to tackle. I think stefan is on point about more agile riding. That said, I have done light single track on my full vado, and it was an absolute blast.

The full power e-bike enable seeing parts of vermont I would never otherwise see. I would recommend trying it somewhere where the vado SL isn't enough and then see how you feel. It honestly seems like a common pattern where people call anything more powerful than what they need a motorcycle. Stefan does the same thing. My blade lets me climb steeper and higher than anything the vado can handle. The sense of accomplishment when I do something new on that bike is every bit as good as on the vado or sirrus.

I wouldn't recommend ruling out full power vado (or any full power bike) until you experience what the full power of a vado can do for you. The fact that your most common rides around you fit the vado SL is awesome. But I would argue that it doesn't make the more powerful bikes more of a "motorcycle". They are simply unnecessary on your terrain.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Or you spend the same amount of time but go further. See more things.

You are limited by the battery range.

 

[dynamic]

You are limited by the battery range.

Sure, but if you are pushing the limits of range on a full vado on terrain you can't handle on a vado SL, you have but two options: 1) That route is unobtanium for you. Don't do it. or 2) put a second full vado battery in a pannier. I mean, you own both bikes for a reason. Right?

The full vado still enables routes that can't be done on a vado SL for *most people* from a raw climbing perspective. Whether or not those routes exist for a given person depends on the terrain they access on their bike and their current fitness.

It's the difference between saying "how far can I go with sufficient assistance?" vs "what can I do on *this* bike?". Both are great questions. Both lead to fantastic fitness. Both push yourself to new heights (often, literally).

 

[mfgrep]

We all view use(s) and usefulness of ebikes through differing perspectives. Some for fitness, transportation, entertainment, work, racing etc. Our differing location(s) and geography add yet another dimension.
While still technically a 'bicycle'.....these 50+ lb powerful motor ebikes begin to take a differing form in my mind. This is subject to change over time as my experience(s) multiply, however, my Vado SL choice as a first ever ebike for me hinged upon its usefulness for fitness. Could I get a workout with a full power Vado?....probably. The SL version, however, is nearly as nimble as a Sirrus and that is precisely what I sought.

 

[dynamic]

Could I get a workout with a full power Vado?....probably

It's not probably. It's simply a choice. I can input *exactly the same amount of power* from me whether I am on a vado, an SL or a sirrus. If I input the same power, the only difference will be how far I go in the same amount of time based on the power settings (or lack there of) of the motor. For me, the sirrus requires a level of power that is not obtainable at my current fitness within my time frames on my terrain. It's simple math. Now, this equation changes if you can't keep your finger off the turbo button. If the reality is that you *reduce* your effort simply because you can, then the minimum bike you can deal with becomes important for a fitness perspective as that will become the natural limit. Make sense? Essentially, if I can't stay off the higher level of assistance on my blade, which is way way beyond what my terrain currently "needs" based on my fitness level, than I won't make as much fitness progress. But, damn, flying 15-20mph *up* these hills does put a smile on my face. Something I can only do on the blade 2.0.

The SL version, however, is nearly as nimble as a Sirrus and that is precisely what I sought.

Totally with you. Sirrus is the most fun thing I have ridden within the parameters of what I can achieve on that bike. My only point is that people shouldn't be discouraged because some cyclists call a vado or a blade a motorcycle. Essentially, this comment is more for others reading the thread rather than you. If I had your terrain, I would be on a vado SL as well. However, the full vado could easily be one of the best bikes for the average consumer given the average fitness of people in the U.S. ;P Not being afraid of almost any hill is liberating. I would also argue that giving up agility to enable otherwise unobtanium routes is a fair exchange for a lot of people (particularly non-bikers). I would encourage those people to go get on any bike that enables their terrain.

FYI: there are some aftermarket motors coming out that can be attached to a bike sometimes via the disc brakes (haven't dived deeply into these yet). Something like that is *incredibly* appealing to me on the Sirrus. That plus a bit of re-gearing/chain updates could turn that thing into my unicorn.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Sure, but if you are pushing the limits of range on a full vado on terrain you can't handle on a vado SL, you have but two options: 1) That route is unobtanium for you. Don't do it. or 2) put a second full vado battery in a pannier. I mean, you own both bikes for a reason. Right?

There is terrain that cannot be ridden by the full power Vado. I'm now planning a 316 mile ride (a 4-day tour) to recreate what the MG500 riders had to suffer on their ultramarathon. Note: The winner rode for 316 miles of gravel/dirt/asphalt in 17 hours and 45 minutes start/finish! The time limit was 3 days; I can only make it in 4 days, 80 miles a day.

It is enough to be forced to negotiate a loose soil mound. A 50 ft high steep staircase. Or, cross a river:

No way the full power Vado could be used on that "ultra".

If I rode paved roads only, I could carry two spare Vado batteries to make 100 miles a day. However, I will be riding hard terrain, and that would be 4 SL Range Extenders (an overkill!), two chargers, etc.

Vado SL uses far less energy per distance unit at the cost of a slower ride.

 

[mfgrep]

View attachment 156397

Sorry. This just made me laugh. Humans are peculiar indeed. I can tell you that none of my rides involve 50 ft staircases, high soil mounds, or crossing rivers.
We have elevators, pavement, and bridges here. Stefan....do you need a place to stay/live that is more inviting? Why on earth are you punishing yourself so?

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Sorry. This just made me laugh. Humans are peculiar indeed. I can tell you that none of my rides involve 50 ft staircases, high soil mounds, or crossing rivers.
We have elevators, pavement, and bridges here. Stefan....do you need a place to stay/live that is more inviting? Why on earth are you punishing yourself so?

"Gravel cycling" is the concept invented in your great country @mfgrep
"Ultramarathon" (also invented in the United States) is not only for the distance itself. It is about the difficulty. Pushing the limits. A challenge.

"Gravel Grinder" ultra, VA, USA. Don't you people have any bridges?

 

[TrevorB]

I know this is an e-bike forum. What I am going to post here is why e-bikes are amazing. I just did my first "real" ride on the Sirrus X 4.0. 7.46 miles in 1 hour and 6 minutes including a stop for a muffin and rests on some hills.

Currently, I am questioning if I should bother putting money into this bike. I still don't have a good grasp on if a change from say 26 gear inches to 20 gear inches (roughly) (11-50 cassette with 36T chainring) will make enough of a difference to *enjoyably* ride this bike up these hills. I can say that the vado SL 4.0 let me climb this hill on turbo without stopping. I also stacked my rest in favor of this working. I haven't done a lifting workout since Saturday, meaning I am as rested as I would ever be to do such a ride (I usually don't take more than 1 day of rest from lifting per week).



Keep riding!

I'd start with 11-46 or 11-50t cassette. You will need new longer chain. Do your homework on 11-50t cassette as derailleur may not support it.

 

[mfgrep]

"Gravel cycling" is the concept invented in your great country @mfgrep
"Ultramarathon" (also invented in the United States) is not only for the distance itself. It is about the difficulty. Pushing the limits. A challenge.

View attachment 156399
"Gravel Grinder" ultra, VA, USA. Don't you people have any bridges?

I would make a fantastic spectator for such an event. Perhaps even a great heckler. But I will pass on participating. More power to you!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

I would make a fantastic spectator for such an event.

Some people were doing that
Some people were just watching the wretches crossing the river with their bikes

An old-schood telephone included!

 

[mfgrep]

Some people were doing that
Some people were just watching the wretches crossing the river with their bikes


An old-schood telephone included!

Oh yes!.....I'd do that!.....with a beer please!