Creo SL vs Vado SL

[Rollegourmet]

Hello,
I m riding a Vado sl,5 days a week, 100 miles a week to commute to work.
On the week end, I m riding 30 miles per day.
I m a beginner.
Now, I would like to get to 60 miles per day on the week end and I m wondering if riding a creo SL will make a difference or it won t really matter?
The creo SL is more set up as a road bike so I wonder.
Thank you.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Now, I would like to get to 60 miles per day on the week end and I m wondering if riding a creo SL will make a difference or it won t really matter?

Hi RG,

I ride a Vado SL 4.0 EQ. I often ride a Metric Century (62+ miles) on one day of the weekend, and it is not uncommon I ride a 50-miler on another day. The longest distance I did on my Vado SL was 147.7 km (91.8 mi) on a single day (using multiple Range Extenders).

If you can ride a road or gravel bike and you feel comfortable with it, the Creo would give you a more aero riding position, making your rides faster. Otherwise, the Creo would not give you any significant advantage over the Vado SL. You could be far better off by buying a Range Extender or two instead, and there is sale of REs in the United States now.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Sorry, I only recollected the Range Extender matter now. See the edit of my post

 

[Rollegourmet]

You are right about the range extender. I might do that. Thank you

 

[Allan47.7339]

It really depends on your riding style and how often you are doing the longer rides. The Vado SL is a much better commuter set up than a Creo. In my case, my former Vado SL was one size too large. I switched to a more comfortable correctly sized Creo. I found the riding positions on the Creo much more appropriate and comfortable for longer road rides. The Creo drop bars have a lot more hand positions than a Vado SL with bar ends/inner bar ends. I am using lower or no e-power more of the time with the Creo than the Vado SL. My longest one day ride on the Creo so far is 135 miles using 1.5 RE and a little of the main battery.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

It really depends on your riding style and how often you are doing the longer rides. The Vado SL is a much better commuter set up than a Creo. In my case, my former Vado SL was one size too large. I switched to a more comfortable correctly sized Creo. I found the riding positions on the Creo much more appropriate and comfortable for longer road rides. The Creo drop bars have a lot more hand positions than a Vado SL with bar ends/inner bar ends. I am using lower or no e-power more of the time with the Creo than the Vado SL. My longest one day ride on the Creo so far is 135 miles using 1.5 RE and a little of the main battery.

It really depends on his riding style. You say Allan your Vado was not properly sized for your body.

I once rented a Creo size M (as I ride a Vado SL size M), was riding it hopelessly slowly and came back from my ride sore. My body was aching. So I didn't buy a Creo although I could.

On the unsuccessful Creo demo ride. I assume the Creo might have been not properly sized to my body.

Average speed of 23.3 km/h? I'm getting 21-22 km/h on my Vado SL. Why should I pay big money for Creo?

 

[gpburdell]

It really depends on his riding style. You say Allan your Vado was not properly sized for your body.

I once rented a Creo size M (as I ride a Vado SL size M), was riding it hopelessly slowly and came back from my ride sore. My body was aching. So I didn't buy a Creo although I could.

On the unsuccessful Creo demo ride. I assume the Creo might have been not properly sized to my body.

Sounds like the Creo might well not have been sized for your body either.

Even though the frames may bear the same size label, you might've needed different stem length/angle or hood positioning or even handlebar width than what that rental Creo was equipped with. With the riding position of a road bike putting more of your weight on your hands, arms, and shoulders there's more need to ensure those compenents are properly sized to your body than with the riding position on an active bike such as the Vado (incl SL).

This is part of the reason you usually see more variations of road bike frame sizes - eight Diverge sizes, six Creo SL sizes, and four Vado SL sizes. The road bike come with varying stem lengths and handlebar widths scaling through the frame sizes so fewer people need to change out components to have their road bike sized properly.

Average speed of 23.3 km/h? I'm getting 21-22 km/h on my Vado SL. Why should I pay big money for Creo?

Buy the bike which fits your needs / preferences.

BTW here are the stats from my lunchtime ride today.

That would be on my non-electric road bike, a Trek Domane SL5.. imagine with a Creo SL!

 

[JeffC57]

I am fortunate to have a Vado 5eq SL and a Creo CC EVO. I think the range on both bikes is about the same. That’s because with a range extender, the bike has a greater range than my body . Usually I get there a bit faster on the Creo because it’s lighter and just likes to go. To me, the Vado is more stable and the Creo is more responsive. I typically ride the Creo on paved roads. I use the Vado on asphalt and gravel trails. If the ride is going to be bumpy or twisting I hop on the Vado because I am more confident. If it’s straight and smooth I hop on the Creo. Also, if you’re considering a carbon frame Creo, your attachment points are limited for things like rear racks. So if I am on an overnight trip or carrying something, I use the Vado. As everyone says buy the bike that best suits your needs.

Edit-As far as frame size, the Vado is a L and the Creo is XL. Clearance the the family jewels is similar.

 

[gpburdell]

if you’re considering a carbon frame Creo, your attachment points are limited for things like rear racks.

Question on this part if you don’t mind.

I thought the carbon frame had rack attachment points near the thru axle, and one just needed to replace the seat tube clamp with the one with rack stay mounts. Is that not the case?

 

[JeffC57]

Question on this part if you don’t mind.

I thought the carbon frame had rack attachment points near the thru axle, and one just needed to replace the seat tube clamp with the one with rack stay mounts. Is that not the case?

View attachment 149998

Frankly I never considered that but I think there are structural limitations for racks with carbon frames. You would probably need to pack lightly.

 

[Te. S]

its all about your comfort and ride style they are both great bikes, i have SL. and i ride it on trails, roads and gravel usually about 30 to 50 miles and mostly on ECO setting i have maid some changes to make it more comfortable and a better fit for me i did try CREO but SL was better for my ride style my next purchase is going to be a Range Extender good luck

 

[Stefan Mikes]

That would be on my non-electric road bike, a Trek Domane SL5.. imagine with a Creo SL!

Not in the EU or UK This is something I really overlooked in my reasoning!

 

[Allan47.7339]

Question on this part if you don’t mind.

I thought the carbon frame had rack attachment points near the thru axle, and one just needed to replace the seat tube clamp with the one with rack stay mounts. Is that not the case

There are eyelets on the carbon frame just above the through axle (on my 2020-2021 model). The seat clamp accessory (S184700001) is a clamp to attach the top of the rack stays. I use them both for a fender. I have a Tailfin pack that has attaches to a through axle with a quick release and a quick clamp to the seat post. The carbon frame is very limited in rack weight capacity listed in the manual.

 

[gpburdell]

There are eyelets on the carbon frame just above the through axle (on my 2020-2021 model). The seat clamp accessory (S184700001) is a clamp to attach the top of the rack stays. I use them both for a fender. I have a Tailfin pack that has attaches to a through axle with a quick release and a quick clamp to the seat post. The carbon frame is very limited in rack weight capacity listed in the manual.

Unfortunately, Specialized seems to contradict themselves.

According the to manual they say it should be fine in one place:



and they say so again:



... and then they say differently elsewhere...



yet the similarly framed carbon Diverge lists full rear cargo weight capacity? And why is the alloy Creo E5 listed with the no-rack-mount weight limit when it has rack mounts?

I'll contact Specialized but anticipate they'll just regurgitate the manual without validating which guidance is actually correct. Given that the rack mounts could easily be tied into the derailleur and axle mounts underneath the carbon layup, the heavier weight limits are feasible; but it'd be difficult to discern whether such a substructure is present... but why provide rack mounts if they're not able to be used and a seat bag is the only option? Very confusing.

 

[Allan47.7339]

The flow chart and the bottom chart agree 5lb/2.3kg for the rack on a carbon frame. I would need to look at the context of the middle chart and check the footnotes. The strength of the threaded fittings on the carbon frame is probably the limiting factor. The bottom chart also adds the use category which adds dynamics to the loads. I don't know if the Diverge has the same fittings in the dropout area. What are you planning to carry or is this just a study exercise?

 

[gpburdell]

While writing the following, RiderCare responded surprisingly promptly clarifying that the carbon models do not in fact have rear rack mounts (I thought they did), and thus my question/premise is moot.

All charts are from the cited Support document: https://media.specialized.com/support/collateral/0000157810.pdf

Not sure of your take on the flow chart? Way I read it is that if the bike has rear rack mounts then the max cargo weight is 55lb. Done. Carbon vs alloy differentiation is if there aren't rear rack mounts. Notice the carbon Diverge cargo limit - it has rear rack mount points. With the carbon Creo frames appear to have similar mount points, it would suggest they should have the same capability.

My intended use case for a Creo is primarily for drop-bar gravel / adventure riding, some light-utility duty particularly when traveling, and potentially the occasional overnight bikepacking adventure - so the ability to sometimes use a lightweight MIK capable rack would be handy. (I'm aware of Tailfin axle mount racks, and that could be an option, but not my first preference)

So while it's partially a study exercise, I'm also trying to determine which Creo model will best fit my anticipated uses.

 

[Saratoga Dave]

At the $4500 sale price in the US, the aluminum E5 bike is pretty hard to beat, especially if you want to get a little loud with it once in awhile out in the woods, and use racks on it. All responses on these sorts of subjects tend to the openly subjective, as it this one, but it worked for me and saved a ton of cash. I put 42mm tires on it and a 42 tooth chainring and haven’t looked back.

Obviously the comp carbon expert EVO with the 50 tooth cassette has a certain charm, but $9000? Blimey!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

At the $4500 sale price in the US

It is an equivalent of US$3,900 in Poland but only XXL Creos are available.

Obviously the comp carbon expert EVO with the 50 tooth cassette has a certain charm, but $9000? Blimey!

Comp Carbon EVO is US$5,600 here. Not sure about the size available though.

 

[gpburdell]

@Saratoga Dave indeed, though if one were looking primarily for road riding bike (such as the @Rollegourmet seems to be), the $1500 price delta to the 2022 comp carbon which includes a couple upgrades, benefits of carbon frame, and 8% weight reduction, would be pretty compelling. Even more so if a $5250 leftover 2021 were available in the OP's area.

With me looking for gravel/adventure/utility focused usage though, yeah, I'm beginning to lean towards the E5 for that role. Save the extra $$$ towards a future updated Creo when I decide to replace my existing analog carbon road bike.

 

[Allan47.7339]

If you look at the frame weight limits on the support page, the main difference appears to be the tire width. The standard models have 28mm tires and the EVO models have 38mm tires with no other changes that would affect the load rating. It doesn't seem like the E5 model is as commonly available. Maybe the aluminum frames all go to the Vado SLs??

Frames

support.specialized.com

Since I am a little over the recommended weight limit, I switched to a Kinect seat post, standard rail saddle and 32 spoke 650b wheels so I could run 42mm with fenders year round. I try to keep it to type I riding even on occasional packed gravel and I don't jump curbs.