Winter riding on the Zen Photon.

[DrewInSK]

Having been badly bitten/injured by ice here which is the state of sask roads for much of the time(on another brand of bike with not-these Johnny Watts 365, no complaints about them so far), I'm looking into doing a tire swap to be 100% sure I hurt less this winter. So far, am thinking the Schwalbe Ice Spike pro in 27.5"x2.6" -- has anyone else swapped into something studded? Any recommendations beyond what I'm looking at?

I had been pondering hanging it up for winter, but now I'm thinking the opposite. Why Else have a belt!? Still having a blast out there on this bike now before deep snow/freeze sets in -- and even then, I have the gear

Might even swap seatposts as a result -- did we ever get the authoritative sizing on that? I saw the clamp used somewhere was 34.9? Is that right?

 

[Ravi Kempaiah]

Having been badly bitten/injured by ice here which is the state of sask roads for much of the time(on another brand of bike with not-these Johnny Watts 365, no complaints about them so far), I'm looking into doing a tire swap to be 100% sure I hurt less this winter. So far, am thinking the Schwalbe Ice Spike pro in 27.5"x2.6" -- has anyone else swapped into something studded? Any recommendations beyond what I'm looking at?

I had been pondering hanging it up for winter, but now I'm thinking the opposite. Why Else have a belt!? Still having a blast out there on this bike now before deep snow/freeze sets in -- and even then, I have the gear

Might even swap seatposts as a result -- did we ever get the authoritative sizing on that? I saw the clamp used somewhere was 34.9? Is that right?

The seatpost is 30.9mm, and depending on the customer's request for a suspension seatpost, we would have included a 27.2mm post with a shim or a 30.9mm post.
The Ice Spiker Pro is an excellent tire for Saskatoon. For milder winters in places like Vancouver, Johnny Watts 365 might be a better choice.

 

[DrewInSK]

Ah perfect! Mine's got the suspension seatpost, but I've had my eye on the thudbuster for some time now, and am seriously considering it...soon

Thanks for the confirmation on studded tire, too!

 

[Blunoser]

Hi Drew, I can second the Spiker pros as being a great tire on ice. I use them on my MTB in the winter. Even on bare ice (on a lake for instance) they grip pretty much the same as biking in the summer on hard dirt. They are fairly slow rolling of course, but won't matter with an ebike. Keep in mind the ice gets pretty hard@ -20c and below. We don't see these lows here on the East coast. You might get less bite in those conditions?

 

[mclewis1]

The Spiker pros are indeed great tires but their suitability is totally dependant on the conditions you intend to ride them in. As mentioned they are excellent on smoother hard surfaces (packed snow, ice, etc.) but like most other studded tires you have to be really careful on very hard smooth surfaces (smooth concrete). Rougher asphalt is generally not much of an issue but even so there is some reduced grip (compared to aggressively lugged and studded tires) there. The Spker pros are really ice specialists.

So if you're riding in urban environments that included lots of slush covered roads and paved paths they wouldn't be my first choice, but if I was riding on a lot of paths/streets and trails in really cold well frozen conditions they would be. They also might not be the best choice if those paths were often covered in deep snow.

For me the tire characteristics when riding primarily in the following conditions ...

Ice/hard pack - Spikers
Deep snow - lugged as wide as possible, optionally with studs
Urban snow/slush - narrower well lugged with studs

 

[Stefan Mikes]

The Spiker pros are indeed great tires but their suitability is totally dependant on the conditions you intend to ride them in. As mentioned they are excellent on smoother hard surfaces (packed snow, ice, etc.) but like most other studded tires you have to be really careful on very hard smooth surfaces (smooth concrete). Rougher asphalt is generally not much of an issue but even so there is some reduced grip (compared to aggressively lugged and studded tires) there. The Spker pros are really ice specialists.

So if you're riding in urban environments that included lots of slush covered roads and paved paths they wouldn't be my first choice, but if I was riding on a lot of paths/streets and trails in really cold well frozen conditions they would be. They also might not be the best choice if those paths were often covered in deep snow.

For me the tire characteristics when riding primarily in the following conditions ...

Ice/hard pack - Spikers
Deep snow - lugged as wide as possible, optionally with studs
Urban snow/slush - narrower well lugged with studs

I greatly agree with you. I would say deep snow is a fat-bike territory. I was fond of Ice Spiker Pro on my 2.6" e-MTB, and they rule on ice! Indeed, these are not best for the snow.

I use Schwalbe Marathon Winter Plus on my regular e-bikes during real winter. These ensure safe riding on ice and are adequate for winter rides unless the snow gets really deep. It is 50 mm on my heavy e-bike or 35 mm on my lightweight one.

 

[Blunoser]

Guys, thanks for chiming in on the polished concrete warning. Steel on polished concrete would not be the best combo for sure. Even ice@ -20c and below is pretty hard and I'm not sure the studs would dig in super well. SK. can get pretty cold.

Drew, I would also say that a Thudbuster may not like these cold conditions either. The elastomer must be hard as a rock at those temps, and might even split? I would ask CC about this before using one in winter. I guess the replacement elastomers wouldn't be too expensive but anyway. I look forward to hearing about your experience with the spikers as I'm thinking about a set for my Photon too. They are great on my manual MTB.

 

[mclewis1]

I stayed away from the discussion about elastomers, rubber compounds and cold conditions. This gets into the quality of the winter tire (studs aside) both in the material and the lugged construction and it's something that can be very subjective over a wide variety of winter conditions. In general though, in my experience the cheaper the winter tire the less pliable the rubber material used and the less capable the tire is in transitional conditions (combination of wet, slushy, and snowy).

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Steel on polished concrete would not be the best combo for sure.

It is a carbide, not steel (studs). Carbide is one of the hardest materials on Earth (only diamond is harder). User @Prairie Dog often showed his rides on Spiker Pros on a frozen pond in AB, CA

 

[Prairie Dog]

It is a carbide, not steel (studs). Carbide is one of the hardest materials on Earth (only diamond is harder). User @Prairie Dog often showed his rides on Spiker Pros on a frozen pond in AB, CA

I ran ISPs during the time I was winter riding with the Levo. They were very tenacious on ice but their narrower footprint simply didn't measure up in deep snow conditions like the 4.5 Wrathchilds on my Norco Bigfoot. 252 XL studs offer plenty of traction but it’s their concave shape that allows them to penetrate ice at all angles not just the tip of the stud like the ISPs. However, with a count of 400 studs per tire, I could always depend on the ISPs to handle themselves extremely well on ice. Continuous freeze and thaw cycles enable studded tires to work more efficiently as long as there is solid hardpack or ice underneath the snow. Deep aggressive lugs and an open tread pattern will also help to shed snow and prevent buildup.

 

[Blunoser]

I keep thinking I'd like a fat bike, but lately we just don't get a lot of dep snow that sticks around. They sure look like they would be fun in the right conditions.

 

[Blunoser]

It is a carbide, not steel (studs). Carbide is one of the hardest materials on Earth (only diamond is harder). User @Prairie Dog often showed his rides on Spiker Pros on a frozen pond in AB, CA

Right you are, still I remember driving a car with studded tires in a parkade with polished concrete and it had surprisingly little grip. In fact I almost took out a row of parked cars.. Ah the days of wasted youth.

 

[PCeBiker]

I keep thinking I'd like a fat bike, but lately we just don't get a lot of dep snow that sticks around. They sure look like they would be fun in the right conditions.

You could get a snow ebike conversion kit for fun in the snow.

You just swap it onto your ebike like winter wheels.

SnowBike Conversion Kit

meta desc

envodrive.com

EDIT: I just noticed that the ZEN Photon is a mid-drive, so that gets kinda tricky.

Maybe @Ravi Kempaiah can design an adapter or something?

 

[PCeBiker]

Right you are, still I remember driving a car with studded tires in a parkade with polished concrete and it had surprisingly little grip.

They were banned in Ontario decades ago because they were tearing up the asphalt.
They might be legal in Montreal where snow tires are required by law?

You will get a ticket in Ontario now if you don't have extra wiper fluid in your vehicle.

 

[mclewis1]

Studded tires on cars aren't entirely banned in Ontario ... for the past 10 years or so they are just geographically restricted for use only in Northern Ontario during specific winter months. They are legal to use in many other provinces (Quebec, Atlantic provinces, etc.) during the winter months.

"Extra" ? ... you can get a ticket if you don't have any washer fluid (or if the sprayer isn't functional), but extra?

 

[PCeBiker]

Studded tires on cars aren't entirely banned in Ontario ... for the past 10 years or so they are just geographically restricted for use only in Northern Ontario during specific winter months.

I didn't know that, but I remember driving to Sault Ste. Marie about 25 years ago and they don't use salt on the roads because it's too cold and it doesn't work.

They didn't really plow the roads either and just spread sand on top of the hard packed snow.

The grip was really quite good but it was strange to not be able to see any lines or markings on the roads.

The snowbanks were so big that I couldn't see around them, and I'd be half way into the intersection before I could see a car coming.

"Extra" ? ... you can get a ticket if you don't have any washer fluid (or if the sprayer isn't functional), but extra?

As far as I know, yes.
You can have a full reservoir of fluid, but if you don't have more, you can get a ticket.

My car was good in that I had a "Low Fluid" indicator on the dash, but I would always save a little in the jug in the trunk for an emergency while I tried to remember to buy more.

Driving down the 401 through Toronto at 100 kph and getting your windshield slimed with dirty salty slush is dangerous.

I remember my mother's Dodge car in 1972 didn't have washer fluid or sprayers.
She had to throw handfuls of snow on the windshield to clean it.
That's pretty hard to do when your driving along.
(She had to drive uphill both ways to get us to and from school too. )

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Right you are, still I remember driving a car with studded tires in a parkade with polished concrete and it had surprisingly little grip. In fact I almost took out a row of parked cars.. Ah the days of wasted youth.

On February 1st, 2021, I set off for a ride on my Giant Trance E+ (FS e-MTB, 2.6" tyres) to a nearby town. It was icy at -6 C. When I restarted my ride on an intersection, I violently crashed; I was on black ice. Beaten, I rode home and immediately ordered a set of ISPs. As soon as I could ride on the studded tyres, I rode to the same town again. The streets were shining from the ice, and cars were making zig-zags. Meanwhile, I could ride those streets as confidently as if I were on dry asphalt!

Later, my Trance changed hands. My two other e-bikes were a Vado and a Vado SL. Every winter, I was swapping the summer tyres for Schwalbe Winter Plus on both. No issue to ride on the ice on either of my e-bikes! The only crash I had was riding onto a frozen surface of the parking lot where I lived as the ice surface resembled a stormy sea there I should have stopped and walked my e-bike before.

Ice is not polished concrete!

 

[DrewInSK]

So yeah, have ridden winters on 4" and 4.8" studded fat tire ebikes(beta testing ebikes for a certain local company here). Saskatoon will often have powdery snow topping, hardpack, sheer ice, or cement, or some combo of all 4. Not until late march/april do we get into slushy times usually.
Never ridden something so thin as a 2.6" in winter so it should be an experience...It seems the ISP's are really the only studded option in this size of tire.


...and just my luck, they are stuck with Canada Post during a strike. Have everything else I need in place...here's hoping it ends soon.