Will eBikes be banned from Federal lands?
- Thread starter tomjasz
- Start date
Stefan Mikes
Well-Known Member
- Region
- Europe
- City
- Mazovia, Poland
Objective 8:
Banned?
Banned?
Avg_Joe
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- RDU, NC
I don't believe ebikes will be banned from federal land, just restricted in where they can be used. The nearest national forest to me has clearly posted that ebikes are considered motorized vehicles and therefore cannot be used on bicycle trails; but they can be used on forest service roads. Perhaps this is true across the USFS?
I fully intend to get a permit for the 4WD trails and ride them on my ebike. (I have ridden the 4WD trails for years in a 4WD so I know what I'm getting into.)
I fully intend to get a permit for the 4WD trails and ride them on my ebike. (I have ridden the 4WD trails for years in a 4WD so I know what I'm getting into.)
m@Robertson
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
This isn't about banning them. Its pursuant to their recently being specifically allowed. Ebike definitions are being put into definitions/code whereas previously they were part of the announcement/releases that preceded the public comment period, followed by the formal rules allowing them subject to local land manager review blah blah blah.
This is just a normal part of post-rulemaking housekeeping.
This is just a normal part of post-rulemaking housekeeping.
Dewey
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Arlington, Virginia
Matt's right, the BRAIN article reporting this mentions e-bikes are currently allowed on roads and motorized trails, which are 38% of trails the Forest Service manages. The announcement permits land managers to reclassify trails from non-motorized to motorized, and creates a new class of "Trails Open to Electric Bicycles Only". This all reads like getting their ducks in a row to permit individual land managers to expand access to e-bikes.
mschwett
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
what’s up with the scaremonger clickbait title? they’re adding the definition of an eBike so that they can clarify where they are - and aren’t allowed.
this was the inevitable result of inexperienced people riding up (and down) trails on public land at high speed on their 1000w + bikes. class 2 and 3 will mostly be banned from off road riding, while all three will likely be allowed on most paved trails, fire roads, etc, on a case by case basis depending on how crowded the location is.
as a local example, the golden gate bridge district did the same thing recently, explicitly ALLOWING eBikes on the bridge but instituting a speed limit.
this was the inevitable result of inexperienced people riding up (and down) trails on public land at high speed on their 1000w + bikes. class 2 and 3 will mostly be banned from off road riding, while all three will likely be allowed on most paved trails, fire roads, etc, on a case by case basis depending on how crowded the location is.
as a local example, the golden gate bridge district did the same thing recently, explicitly ALLOWING eBikes on the bridge but instituting a speed limit.
OK, time for definitions of the two confused agencies.
The Forest Service is not the Park Service. The Forest Service is actually in the Department of Agriculture. The Park Service is in the Department of the Interior.
Park Service people often are wearing the Smokey Bear hats. Forest Service cops only wear those as part of their dress uniform. FS people often wear hardhats and baseball caps.
Park Service manages National Parks and Monuments and Recreation areas. Forest Service manages public lands for multiple use--there can be logging, recreation, mineral extraction, recreational cabins, ski areas, brush picking, berry picking, firewood, etc.
Then, if you want more confusion, there is the BLM which is not Black Lives Matter but the Bureau of Land Management and is in the Department of the Interior. They pay better than the Forest Service.
They manage a goodly chunk of lands too.
A couple years ago Ebikes were cleared for using on bicycle paths on Department of the INTERIOR lands. This did not include Forest Service.
It can be very confusing.
The Forest Service is not the Park Service. The Forest Service is actually in the Department of Agriculture. The Park Service is in the Department of the Interior.
Park Service people often are wearing the Smokey Bear hats. Forest Service cops only wear those as part of their dress uniform. FS people often wear hardhats and baseball caps.
Park Service manages National Parks and Monuments and Recreation areas. Forest Service manages public lands for multiple use--there can be logging, recreation, mineral extraction, recreational cabins, ski areas, brush picking, berry picking, firewood, etc.
Then, if you want more confusion, there is the BLM which is not Black Lives Matter but the Bureau of Land Management and is in the Department of the Interior. They pay better than the Forest Service.
They manage a goodly chunk of lands too.A couple years ago Ebikes were cleared for using on bicycle paths on Department of the INTERIOR lands. This did not include Forest Service.
It can be very confusing.
I am a retired Timber Beast. I just think that as usual, the FS is a little behind. The good news is that the office that I worked out of has a few people who have ebikes in their family and the headquarters had a guy who commuted on one before ebikes were as available as now. Unfortunately, these people all worked in the timber dept., not recreation.
If I was still working, I'd be hauling my ebike around to use to get up old roads to check on units. It would have been pretty handy and saved wear and tear on the feet.
In the 1970's the USFS opened up the roads and trails to dirt bikes of any size an displacement. Many areas allow snowmobiles to roar around during the winter months, even Yellowstone NP.
Only exception is the special treatment for horse riders who get to go anywhere at any time and leave their crap behind.
Every National Forest has a Forest Plan. You will find different management areas in the plans and what can and cannot happen. The same goes for transportation. And there are trails where horses are not allowed, but I can't think of them right now. Acoustic bicycles cannot be ridden in wilderness. I've also been on trails outside of wilderness areas where bicycles are not allowed.
Regulations vary and it pays to know where you are going and what the rules are, except in some areas, the likely hood of getting caught is pretty low.
Regulations vary and it pays to know where you are going and what the rules are, except in some areas, the likely hood of getting caught is pretty low.
Mr. Coffee
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- A Demented Corner of the North Cascades
Just my $0.02
Nobody is going to make very much progress on this issue unless they have educated themselves on which land management agency is which, and which one you want to deal with to support access to the trails you are interested in. Otherwise you are just wasting your time and everybody else's as well.
Also, I will point out there are many thousands of miles of little-used roads on public lands. Nearly all of these roads are completely open to e-bikes. With a little bit of research and exploration you can find great places to ride where you are unlikely to see anybody else. There is a reason "gravel cycling" is a thing.
Nobody is going to make very much progress on this issue unless they have educated themselves on which land management agency is which, and which one you want to deal with to support access to the trails you are interested in. Otherwise you are just wasting your time and everybody else's as well.
Also, I will point out there are many thousands of miles of little-used roads on public lands. Nearly all of these roads are completely open to e-bikes. With a little bit of research and exploration you can find great places to ride where you are unlikely to see anybody else. There is a reason "gravel cycling" is a thing.
Nvreloader
Western Nevada
- Region
- USA
I have 6400 Square miles in just my county, 90%+ is open to ride anywhere,
at any time, all of it is is under BLEM management, (except the private ground),
I do miss my tall pine trees.
at any time, all of it is is under BLEM management, (except the private ground),
I do miss my tall pine trees.
chunk
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
I think most of where I ride motorcycles and bicycles is also BLM land. In 40 plus years of riding, I've never been stopped or questioned by anyone. It must be okay to ride there, just miles of open land. I'm just careful and try to be courteous to anyone I encounter and stay off private land when i come upon it. And always pack out any trash.
Nvreloader
Western Nevada
- Region
- USA
Not around here, playa's are open to everyone anytime of the year,
and you find the DUMB one's STUCK up to their door handles,
the old saying about the playa is "If there is a color change, your stuck",
and the Black Rock is one of the biggest plays around here...
Here is some info, great place to play golf with colored balls.....LOL
100 yd putts are the norm.
Black Rock Desert - Wikipedia
Don
Indeed. This is the USFS finally getting around to taking a look at ebikes and how to incorporate them into their existing trail systems. It cuts both ways. In the positive, it more accurately defines what is and isn't an ebike, which helps with management, and how a district can allow them on trails where they currently aren't allowed. In the negative, to do that, proposed trails will have to undergo a NEPA review which is expensive, takes a good chunk of time, and frankly, isn't likely to happen in districts that aren't tourism and recreation driven. Even if it does, don't expect any significant change for years if not decades, bureaucrats drive the bus. Another negative is that ebikes are still classified as motor vehicles under their definition. If trails do get reclassified from non-motorized to motorized to allow ebikes, I expect war to break out from two directions. The hiker and environmental groups will immediately file suits to stop the change, and OHV groups will also sue, because if the trail is now classified as motorized, they'll want access as well.
tomjasz
Well-Known Member
- Region
- USA
- City
- Minnesnowta
I sailed my dirtboat on the Blackrock, but the other activity was a PIA. SO, I sailed the BLM playa at the NV CA border. I worked for The Mirage and rooms were free to me there. I'd book a room overlooking the playa and use my high-power spotting scope to check activity on the playa. I really miss the desert!Not around here, playa's are open to everyone anytime of the year,
and you find the DUMB one's STUCK up to their door handles,
the old saying about the playa is "If there is a color change, your stuck",
and the Black Rock is one of the biggest plays around here...
Here is some info, great place to play golf with colored balls.....LOL
100 yd putts are the norm.
Tia,Black Rock Desert - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Don
Nvreloader
Western Nevada
- Region
- USA
Tom
The newest hot spot for dry land boat sailing is called Smith Creek Playa,
see info here:
They also hold Flight distance shooting here, when the wind is just right some record shots are made:
I have had lots of fun on this playa in the FROZEN Wintertime ...... had some local kids using skate boards and kites, fun to watch..........
The newest hot spot for dry land boat sailing is called Smith Creek Playa,
see info here:
They also hold Flight distance shooting here, when the wind is just right some record shots are made:
I have had lots of fun on this playa in the FROZEN Wintertime ...... had some local kids using skate boards and kites, fun to watch..........
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