Why is the SL motor so very noisy?

[mschwett]

Before I ask this - I LOVE my Creo. Like, love love love. Best purchase of the decade.

But wow, the motor is really noisy. Even on 20% boost. At 50 or 100% it’s quite an unpleasant whine, which makes riding it uphill near other riders a little embarrassing. Not that I give a damn what they think of me riding an eBike, but it just kind of breaks the vibe of a beautiful place.

Is it because it’s a very small, high RPM motor with a ton of gearing?

The 500W front hub motor on my vanMoof is utterly silent by comparison, at full power up a hill it’s a pleasant hum as opposed to an angry grinding whine!

 

[jodi2]

It's not fair to compare a hub motor with a middle motor with gear box. Almost all hub motors are less noisy than middle motors, many hub motors almost unhearable.
But just do 1000-2000 feet uphill with a small&light hub motor, and you will ask whatfor you carry a motor and a battery with you...
So you should compare middle motors with middle motors. But even then the SL motor is quite noisy. But I think it's also a psychological effect, that you don't expect the noise from an almost unvisible motor. If motor&battery would be big&very present you would feel it less noisy I guess.
Also the thin frame of the Creo is a good "sound box" to amplify the motor sound.
And a friend who is deeper in ebike development explained me, that it's easier to put thicker or "noise canceling" materials in bigger/heavier standard motors. In the tiny light assist motors is no room and weight left for this, everything is reduced, so also less or no noise cancelling.

I personally found the noise of the Creo motor at the first test rides very annoying, number two in my list of disadvantages (first the price...). But in level 1 up to 30 or 35% support it's fine for me, only level 2 or 3 are quite loud.
But after a few rides with my own Creo I completely forgot about it. But I ride mostly gravel, so rough roads and mostly alone. In a group with others without ebikes and on smooth asphalt level2+3 can cause quite some remarks I guess... But I doubt that you normally need these levels with others. As I already wrote in another thread, with level 1 a can already stay together with riders two classes better (for riders one class better about 15% should be enough). With level 2 or 50-60% I let almost veryone behind so far and with level 3 you are a candidate for the yellow shirt of the Tour de France.

 

[mschwett]

I always ride alone, but on smooth roads that are popular for roadies, and 99% either motor off or in eco, which I bumped down by 5%. Of course I truly don’t care what other random riders think of my using a bit of assist uphill (not that easy to climb bay area hills with your heart rate under 130!) but I always feel badly about disturbing the solitude with that nasty whine. Today a rider merging yelled out “turn that thing off!!!” while I was pushing up a climb, 250w from me and 50-75w from the SL. Very audible.

Less insulation makes a lot of sense. But the noise sounds mechanical as well, I assume there’s lots of gear reduction and a higher RPM than a hub motor?

 

[Dallant]

I always ride alone, but on smooth roads that are popular for roadies, and 99% either motor off or in eco, which I bumped down by 5%. Of course I truly don’t care what other random riders think of my using a bit of assist uphill (not that easy to climb bay area hills with your heart rate under 130!) but I always feel badly about disturbing the solitude with that nasty whine. Today a rider merging yelled out “turn that thing off!!!” while I was pushing up a climb, 250w from me and 50-75w from the SL. Very audible.

Less insulation makes a lot of sense. But the noise sounds mechanical as well, I assume there’s lots of gear reduction and a higher RPM than a hub motor?

Hope you told him to take a hike. I’m sure his bike isn’t silent and makes the same clicking noise all bikes make when not pedaling. According to some Specialized lovers, it’s the Bosch CX that makes the most motor noise.

 

[mschwett]

Hope you told him to take a hike. I’m sure his bike isn’t silent and makes the same clicking noise all bikes make when not pedaling. According to some Specialized lovers, it’s the Bosch CX that makes the most motor noise.

nah, by the time it registered he was too far behind me to bother with.

 

[mschwett]

My Creo makes a soft whirring sound at 70+ cadence. Not really loud or disturbing, bur people nearby can certainly hear it. Easy for enough me to ignore. Maybe I’m lucky? Bosch and Shimano mid drives are louder in my experience. The SL sound disappears if I drop cadence.

it's definitely cadence sensitive. goes from an annoying whine to a slightly worrisome one!

i'll record a quick clip next time i ride, i doubt there's anything wrong with it (ride feels amazing, power usage is low, boost feels totally naturally and strong) but perhaps others can listen and chime in.

 

[Scott Adams]

When riding the Levo SL last fall, the SL motor sounded like a toy RC car, though maybe a bit louder. As I was climbing a trail, two hikers ahead of me turned around to see what was approaching when they heard it about 30 feet behind them. As you said, it does break the silence of the woods. The whining sound of the Levo SL motor gave the impression to me of something that was more breakable than rugged, as I said, like a toy. That was just the sound of it, I do think they are durable and overall the SL bikes are well made.

The first Creo I rode, right when they were first introduced, was on the quiet side, in my opinion. Perhaps the SL motors on the Levo are geared differently and thus louder as they have a 20mph limit in the USA. I've ridden a few Vado SLs and they were quiet enough that I didn't take much notice of the noise, but they certainly were not silent.

 

[CreoGuy]

I ride with my wife's Turbo Vado, a friends Vado SL and 2 Creo's. I have a Turbo Creo SL Comp Carbon EVO. The motor has been excessively noisy from the git go and way noisier than any of my fellow riders. The Vado SL and the 2 Creo's have the same motor. Thanks to my dealer, I'm getting a new motor tomorrow.

 

[StmbtDave]

Prior to my Creo I had a Yamaha Wabash. The dealer replaced its motor because of excessive noise. I guess all brands deal with the occasional lemon.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

@mschwett:
Specialized 1.1 (Mahle) motor is indeed perceived as noisy. It is a feature, not fault. I just want to tell you that:

• Specialized 1.2e, 1.2, and 1.2s motors (Brose) are totally silent;
• Specialized 1.3 motor (Brose) is audible under heavy load but generally silent
• Specialized 2.1 motor (Brose) is noisy at general levels expected from an e-MTB motor
• Specialized 1.1 motor (Mahle) produces the level of noise as you describe.

Have you had any chance to listen to Bosch motors?

P.S. Brose motors are driven by carbon fibre belt. All other are driven by solid gears, hence the noise.

 

[Dallant]

@mschwett:
Specialized 1.1 (Mahle) motor is indeed perceived as noisy. It is a feature, not fault. I just want to tell you that:

• Specialized 1.2e, 1.2, and 1.2s motors (Brose) are totally silent;
• Specialized 1.3 motor (Brose) is audible under heavy load but generally silent
• Specialized 2.1 motor (Brose) is noisy at general levels expected from an e-MTB motor
• Specialized 1.1 motor (Mahle) produces the level of noise as you describe.

Have you had any chance to listen to Bosch motors?

You need to take those headphones off.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

You need to take those headphones off.

Yes Dallant I know you're riding your Bosch motor e-bike in noise-cancelling headphones. You're deaf or what?

 

[Scott Adams]

Still hoping to find out if the Levo SL is noisier generally than the ostensibly similar / alike Mahle motors in the Creo and Vado SL. The Levo SL I rode was brand new and had a markedly more "tinny" or "whining" quality with greater volume as well.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Still hoping to find out if the Levo SL is noisier generally than the ostensibly similar / alike Mahle motors in the Creo and Vado SL. The Levo SL I rode was brand new and had a markedly more "tinny" or "whining" quality with greater volume as well.

That could be the matter of MTB tuning. Generally, motors used in eMTBs are noisy. Even Specialized 2.1 (Brose S Mag) used in full power Levo is noisy.

 

[Rás Cnoic]

My Vado SL is pretty whiny. Oddly it's worst on Eco, more high pitched then on Sport, which seems quieter. Don't use Turbo much at all to notice how it sounds. After reading this thread I'm now wondering if the whine has increased since I got it, can't remember what it sounded like new! Reading EBR forums is like googling for head cold symptoms and becoming convinced you have cancer...

 

[PedalUma]

This was a disaster, but it did the trick.

 

[Dallant]

This was a disaster, but it did the trick.

I wanna see a video of that!

 

[PedalUma]

If you try this @Dallant, make sure that you plug up all the little holes in the frame! It shot out the back of the chainstay onto the rear disc. I also did the downtube. and twenty-minutes later some came out of the well greased headset. It did make it quiet. Soon I will do it on another bike. Cover the area surrounding the entrance hole with a coating of dish soap, so that it cannot stick to the paint. Use more dish soap than you think will be needed and cover a larger area of the bike than you think you can manage.

 

[Dallant]

This was a disaster, but it did the trick.

I’m assuming it didn’t quiet the motor, just the rest of the bike?
Isnt that stuff fairly caustic and couldn’t it get into bearings?

 

[PedalUma]

I’m assuming it didn’t quiet the motor, just the rest of the bike?
Isnt that stuff fairly caustic and couldn’t it get into bearings?

It did make it quiet. The motor was loud and filling the 'sound box' made it quiet.