We need to stop blaming victims in bike theft!

[Mike TowpathTraveler]

victim blaming his victim blaming period. This has nothing to do with fear mongering. I'm trying to educate people that might not know that by doing this you are victim blaming.

No, "fear mongering" was your other thread that you devoted much time on, ripping others here who are comfortable with the Class 1 through 3 set up; armed with the knowledge of the major battles many, many folks had to fight politically with local land managers, local, county, states laws pertaining to ebikes as well as the same issues in Canada to get the laws changed so that people can ride their ebikes legally. That was that thread. This is this thread. The one where you take umbrage to anyone here asking why you did not at least, lock your bike.

Obviously, the only people you need to educate......is yourself. You make it seem like ebike theft did not begin in this world until it just happened to you. Actually, there are enough threads and posts here about locks and securing your bike; what works, what doesn't. Too bad for you that you did not bother to check them out, to learn a thing or two. You say the lock is too heavy carrying it on your 60 pound bike? So many excuses, so many. So, for the lack of carrying a heavy, 4 pound lock with you on your Burger King stops, you are now free of riding a heavy, 60 plus pound ebike.

That's not victim blaming. It's just calling a spade, a spade. It is, what it is. And yes, while I have great sympathy for people having their rides stolen out from under them, that sympathy gets blunted when you learn they did not protect their costly investment & then in turn, they go off on people here for having the temerity of asking "did you lock your bike up?"...........

Let me not be a hypocrite here with you. I did the same thing you've done. Many times. And in each instance, my eyes were on my bike every second. While I got lucky; you did not. But I bought that Abus Bordo for runs where I KNEW I was stopping at a convenience store. Or pizza shop. And still, my eyes never left the bike as I know a Dewalt battery powered cutting tool can cut that lock in about 10 seconds. So, your stops have to be in and out, no dawdling, everything to go. Situational awareness. Look it up. No lock is infallible. All strangers have to be looked at as suspect when they are hanging around your bike, looking it over. Until proven otherwise.

I wish you luck with your new ride. I wish you a new perspective on situational awareness when riding and parking it. And a wish for you in stopping this blame game you like to play here.

 

[Roamers]

Asking if it was locked is not blaming. Following with "you should have locked it" is blame. "That was stupid to leave it unlocked" is not blame; it is passing judgement.

 

[MrCaspan]

No, "fear mongering" was your other thread that you devoted much time on, ripping others here who are comfortable with the Class 1 through 3 set up; armed with the knowledge of the major battles many, many folks had to fight politically with local land managers, local, county, states laws pertaining to ebikes as well as the same issues in Canada to get the laws changed so that people can ride their ebikes legally. That was that thread. This is this thread. The one where you take umbrage to anyone here asking why you did not at least, lock your bike.

Obviously, the only people you need to educate......is yourself. You make it seem like ebike theft did not begin in this world until it just happened to you. Actually, there are enough threads and posts here about locks and securing your bike; what works, what doesn't. Too bad for you that you did not bother to check them out, to learn a thing or two. You say the lock is too heavy carrying it on your 60 pound bike? So many excuses, so many. So, for the lack of carrying a heavy, 4 pound lock with you on your Burger King stops, you are now free of riding a heavy, 60 plus pound ebike.

That's not victim blaming. It's just calling a spade, a spade. It is, what it is. And yes, while I have great sympathy for people having their rides stolen out from under them, that sympathy gets blunted when you learn they did not protect their costly investment & then in turn, they go off on people here for having the temerity of asking "did you lock your bike up?"...........

Let me not be a hypocrite here with you. I did the same thing you've done. Many times. And in each instance, my eyes were on my bike every second. While I got lucky; you did not. But I bought that Abus Bordo for runs where I KNEW I was stopping at a convenience store. Or pizza shop. And still, my eyes never left the bike as I know a Dewalt battery powered cutting tool can cut that lock in about 10 seconds. So, your stops have to be in and out, no dawdling, everything to go. Situational awareness. Look it up. No lock is infallible. All strangers have to be looked at as suspect when they are hanging around your bike, looking it over. Until proven otherwise.

I wish you luck with your new ride. I wish you a new perspective on situational awareness when riding and parking it. And a wish for you in stopping this blame game you like to play here.

Let me be frank I know you're not being an ass here you are doing exactly what you said calling a spade a spade. People can be a bit hypocritical even myself and we get stuck in our opinions. I'm just hoping this is one thing I can help change this outlook because I really feel people don't understand this comment is victim blaming/shaming. I never knew it was till it happened to me. I'm sure I'm being a hypocrite somewhere in here and I apologies for that.

With that said I will agree to disagree with your view point for a few things, it IS victim shaming/blaming, you can call it a spade but we live in a world where we have lost sympathy for people it seams and we just shame people thinking exactly what you just mentioned above, why not call a spade a spade. Well tell me if you have a partner/family member someone you care about their feeling and you are mad at them and you call a spade a spade. Tell me how well that process works? Tell them exactly how you feel and don't hold back. Calling a spade a spade is not okay for healthy communication but for some reason we feel it's okay to do it to a stranger?

I would agree If we are having a conversation about why things happen or how to fix a problem or shoudl I do this or should I do that. yeah it's great to bring really valid points like a bike lock up. Like repeat it 100x to them because it is so important. Even with my example above about sexual assault victims, I'm not stupid, I know it's not a great idea to dress proactively in a bad neighborhood. We are not dumb here we know what could/will happen. We would all love to live in a society where this is not a problem, but we don't ,we live in reality. BUT if stuff does happen why are we so quick to blame the victim unless they had a good reason to do what they were doing? Oh your car broke down and you had no choice, so you didn't do it on purpose okay well now that's okay yeah you are a victim and I'll give you sympathy. Oh you are a street worker and got sexually assaulted in a bad neighborhood well then you had it coming. So the two victims are somehow different now because a spade is a spade? Why does a victim have to explain why they are a victim to get sympathy or to not have judgement passed on them? It's really confusing to me, to me they are a victim period no matter the story! Again it would be different if a victim asked how they could prevent this in the future, sure that's the time and place for it. So just realize that I now feel like I a HAVE to rationalize why I was a victim so that YOU can can feel better or justified in giving me you sympathy, therefor agreeing that yes I are a victim. Having sympathy does not mean you agree with anything it just means you have sympathy BTW it does not mean you agree that it is okay or not okay to use a bike lock. But for some reason I feel like once people hear the full story they change how they think and are not so judgmental or have sympathy.

So here goes, I ride because I have had 3 collapsed lungs and a stroke so it is hard to find an activity that I like and give me exercise but not too much as I don't like pushing it too much (hence the ebike). I do have a $220 Arbus folding lock for my bike but I use my bike for real mountain biking on real trails and this lock would be what they call "put into a yard sale" in about 10 seconds if I left it on the bike. Its a $220 lock so I don't want to lose it when I ride trails. I also care about our environment and decided to commute to work and get rid of one car also it helped sell the fact of the price tag to my partner for an ebike. I don't always remember to put the lock back on my bike when I commute after i have been out trail ridding. The morning of my partner and I got into a huge fight about something stupid and I needed a breather and I was not thinking straight because I care about my partner and it sucks when you get into fights with the person you love. I was out and had no lock because I was not thinking about lunch when I left, stopped in at a Burger King for 3 minutes.. gone. So now with all this info does this make me seem more of a victim and less dumb for doing what I did.. Or hear me out, people could just accept I am no matter what I did or didn't do to prevent it!

I hope this never happens to anyone else, my heart sank as I watched this POS ride away and look back at me. Then as I ran after them I tripped and fell down on the boulevard hurting myself pretty bad. What a crappy day, then I get "Did you have a lock on it" thanks for calling a spade a spade! There is a time and a place for this discussion so that yes you can call a spade a spade at that time.

 

[MrCaspan]

Asking if it was locked is not blaming. Following with "you should have locked it" is blame. "That was stupid to leave it unlocked" is not blame; it is passing judgement.

I will disagree, if someone just told you they were sexually assaulted, do you follow up with "Were you dressed provocatively?" Sorry to use the sexual assault think here so much I know it is NOT the same in any way but I am trying to draw a parallel because you think it's okay to say this because it's only a bike. It's more about being a victim here and that's it, it does not mater the severity of the crime or even if YOU think this was a crime. The person feels like a victim so they are a victim.

Victim blaming is a devaluing act that occurs when the victim(s) of a crime or an accident is held responsible – in whole or in part – for the crimes that have been committed against them

by passing judgement you are doing this..

 

[tomjasz]

Oy gevalt!

 

[MrCaspan]

Yeah this one was a little extreme haha lets keep the topic on the topic . We are all passionate about what we believe

 

[Nvreloader]

"We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken,
society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker,
It is time to restore the American precept,
that each individual is accountable for their actions."

 

[fooferdoggie]

"We must reject the idea that every time a law's broken,
society is guilty rather than the lawbreaker,
It is time to restore the American precept,
that each individual is accountable for their actions."

I hate to add politics but remember the party of personal responsibility is the party of election deniers it's hopeless.

 

[Roamers]

It's almost impossible to have a conversation these days for fear of offending someone.

A simple question like "was it locked?" Is important for learning; if the answer is yes, what should we be doing differently to improve security. If the answer is no, no more communication needed.

 

[tomjasz]

"Were you dressed provocatively?"

Were you?

 

[indianajo]

I ride because I have had 3 collapsed lungs and a stroke so it is hard to find an activity that I like and give me exercise but not too much as I don't like pushing it too much (hence the ebike). I do have a $220 Arbus folding lock for my bike but I use my bike for real mountain biking on real trails and this lock would be what they call "put into a yard sale" in about 10 seconds if I left it on the bike. Its a $220 lock so I don't want to lose it when I ride trails. I also care about our environment and decided to commute to work and get rid of one car also it helped sell the fact of the price tag to my partner for an ebike. I don't always remember to put the lock back on my bike when I commute after i have been out trail ridding. The morning of my partner and I got into a huge fight about something stupid and I needed a breather and I was not thinking straight because I care about my partner and it sucks when you get into fights with the person you love. I was out and had no lock because I was not thinking about lunch when I left, stopped in at a Burger King for 3 minutes.. gone.

I carry a 7 lb 6'x1/2" SS sling https://www.mcmaster.com/8942T14 $80 and a 2 lb Abus 92/80 lock $50 everywhere, in a $100 pannier bag because sling drags the ground wrapped around the seat post. If I rode in the woods, (I do, on road) I would carry it, because if I destroyed a derailleur takeup with a stick, I'd have to push the bike miles to phone service or lock it to a tree or fence post. 4 years, thousands of shopping restaurant and concert/meeting stops, no bike theft. 2 lights stolen, one vandalized because it wouldn't come off, tool box stolen with $50 tools, two tires knifed because the bike was locked up. I quit driving cars except on interstate vacations (rental).
I might lock up (bad knees, very light bones that might break, 72 year old body post covid 4 mutants 216 days) and have to be taken out by ambulance. If I don't lock the bike up, it gets taken to the tow yard by a wrecker ($280) and incur $60 a day storage charges.
The thief that stole $36000 of tools, sound equipment, media, Sept 2020 was a house painter for cash, to look at the tools he left in the yard. Used a folding ladder to come in through upstairs window. During covid19 2020 nobody would hire anybody like that. The government wouldn't give him unemployment because he never paid taxes, I assume. I feel sorry for him, but doesn't mean I didn't let the county convict him and sentence him to 255 days in jail. He might serve 62 days. Hope he learns something from the experience, he was very smart. I'm fortunate Clark county responds & prosecutes burglary calls. Louisville police stopped responding to burglary summer 2020 and only restarted last week.

 

[MrCaspan]

two tires knifed because the bike was locked up.

Wait the POS knifed your tires because it was locked up?? WT Actual F, this is just low, play fair man! I remember when people used to bolt there sub boxes into their trunks to stop thieves, problem was when thieves found boxes like this they would take a screw driver to your speaker so no one could enjoy it. The more I read about this the more I just don't want to go anywhere but hide in a hole!!

 

[Mr. Coffee]

If you've ever had to report the theft of an expensive bike to the cops, you'll see victim blaming:

"Your bike was worth $6000? Why didn't you just buy a car and not waste our time?"

Oh, and it is reasonable to ask what kind of lock you used. If only to let others know that the Bike Thieves Network knows how to defeat those locks.

 

[Gordon71]

In my case the bike is either in my garage or under my ass so I've not bothered to buy a lock.

 

[MrCaspan]

In my case the bike is either in my garage or under my ass so I've not bothered to buy a lock.

Even under your butt or on a car its not safe, people have told me that bike thieves will just run up and push you over and just take it. thieves are becoming so brazen. They are even talking it right off the back of vehicles at stop lights! Here is some video footage of a failed attempt but it happens all the time now! My son works at HomeDepot and they come in with a cart and just fill full of tools and just walk out with it! They don't give a crap which scares the crap out of me ridding an expensive bike.

Dashcam captures a brazen man try to steal a bike off the back of a car | Daily Mail Online

Dashcam captures a brazen man try to steal a bike off the back of a moving car in Tower Bridge, London. Thankfully he was not able to unlock it in time

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[fooferdoggie]

In my case the bike is either in my garage or under my ass so I've not bothered to buy a lock.

actually thats the place more bikes are stolen.

 

[MrCaspan]

If you've ever had to report the theft of an expensive bike to the cops, you'll see victim blaming:

To be honest the police officer here in Waterloo, Ontario was 100% understanding and seemed like her really wanted to make sure I got my bike back. He toured some of the bad parts of the city that were known bike thief places. I didn't think I would get such polite and understanding service from them but I was mistaken. He made sure I was okay first and then asked details of the event, asked me to email them a picture of the bike so they could put it on their network ASAP. It was a great experience.

 

[Gordon71]

actually thats the place more bikes are stolen.

Maybe but I've lived here for 50 years and not had anything stolen yet.

 

[Gordon71]

actually thats the place more bikes are stolen.

Wait, from where? From my garage or from under my ass?

 

[fooferdoggie]

Wait, from where? From my garage or from under my ass?

well that would depend on how fast you are it would be pretty emberassing of some old lady ran up and stole the bike from you will putting along.