Ultra bikes pas
- Thread starter vincent
- Start date
vincent
Well-Known Member
Just to keep this up to date
Beware there are different dcp18 softwares and not all of these dialogue are the same
Some are locked into eco/sport pas with 5 levels each- some are 9 level pas like most of us are used to
From what I am reading the eco/sport is the old model dcp18
Beware there are different dcp18 softwares and not all of these dialogue are the same
Some are locked into eco/sport pas with 5 levels each- some are 9 level pas like most of us are used to
From what I am reading the eco/sport is the old model dcp18
TomD
Well-Known Member
I don't believe the eco/sport is an older version but rather the version intended for use with the newer torque sensing motors. Apparently they took the 10 assist levels and mapped them to 5 assist x 2 torque sensing (eco/sport). The eco/sport won't make any difference if paired with a BBSxx without torque sensing. With a torque sensing motor presumably eco/sport is more less/more responsive to torque. With the 10 assist version of the dpc18 not sure what recipe you get for torque sensing, presumably sport. Similarly for the other displays that allow for 10 levels unless there is a separate setting to dial in the torque sensing. This is all conjecture on my part. Been conversing with you on ES as well as "Tom".
vincent
Well-Known Member
Good info to have, who told you the eco sport was meant for the torque sensing?
will be interesting to see what happens when I put this 9 level display on there if that is the case
So do you have any idea what happens if I change programming on the PAS levels etc. if I’m using the eco sport display?
Do you think that’s only going to change cadence stuff even if I change things on the torque page?
don’t know what to think about this but I’m definitely not pleased with the bafang for doing this
To me there are only 3 benefits to using their motors
Being able to program
the higher power/wattage
Having a throttle
In every other respect Bosch and Brose and Yamaha are out doing them, so making the programming confusing was a mistake on their part
will be interesting to see what happens when I put this 9 level display on there if that is the case
So do you have any idea what happens if I change programming on the PAS levels etc. if I’m using the eco sport display?
Do you think that’s only going to change cadence stuff even if I change things on the torque page?
don’t know what to think about this but I’m definitely not pleased with the bafang for doing this
To me there are only 3 benefits to using their motors
Being able to program
the higher power/wattage
Having a throttle
In every other respect Bosch and Brose and Yamaha are out doing them, so making the programming confusing was a mistake on their part
TomD
Well-Known Member
I am basting most of my assumptions on what this guy says about programming his ultra. Sounds like eco / sport may actually override the torque programming for one or both modes. I haven't had a chance to play around with it since I don't have an ultra bike yet.
www.pedelecs.co.uk
DP C18.UART Bafang colour display problem
you can try the 961 it will give you a base line to work from
www.pedelecs.co.uk
Pharroh
New Member
I believe you are correct on that because when I have been playing around with the settings they seem to only affect the Sport mode and the Eco mode seems to stay the same.
I have the Ultra 1000w with the DPC 18 uart with Eco & Sport 5 assists and this is what I have been programming with and most of the changes I have done to it seem to ONLY affect the SPORT mode seems to NOT change anything in Eco mode except for the % of current or top speed.
I have been trying to get it to respond similar to the BBSHD I have and I am almost there just have to adjust the % of current on the main tab to how the assists kick in and stay engaged at certain pressures on the pedals this is another thing I am work on . I can give you the .el file of all the setting I have tried so far and are programmed into the bike as of today. here is the program setup i have right now attached to this message
If you download this file just rename it and remove the .zip extension and use the Ultra programming software to load and view my settings what I have now still experimenting with all the settings.
eBikeaholic
New Member
I got my Ultra (G510) kit from a reseller on Alibaba and the DPC-18 from Luna cycle. Mine has no eco or sport modes and the display settings allow for 3, 5, or 9 PAS levels that can be changed via the display.
Pharroh - I figured out how to get the torque sensor setup for a consistent power flow. It's mostly in the relationships within the top 6 rows of the torque sensor matrix. Here's a walk through vid:
I'm also trying to understand how the amps are divied between each of those three PAS setting options. The Bafang controller programming settings (basic tab) allows us to change each of the PAS 1-9 settings using a percentage of the current. Changing these doesn't equally affect the 3 level or 5 level settings though.
Not sure why but I assumed the stock settings would just be a ratio of the total amps. For example (using 52v x 30A = 1560w) I thought 3 PAS levels would be divided equally to about 500, 1000, 1500 respectively. This is not the case on my factory settings.
Pharroh - I figured out how to get the torque sensor setup for a consistent power flow. It's mostly in the relationships within the top 6 rows of the torque sensor matrix. Here's a walk through vid:
I'm also trying to understand how the amps are divied between each of those three PAS setting options. The Bafang controller programming settings (basic tab) allows us to change each of the PAS 1-9 settings using a percentage of the current. Changing these doesn't equally affect the 3 level or 5 level settings though.
Not sure why but I assumed the stock settings would just be a ratio of the total amps. For example (using 52v x 30A = 1560w) I thought 3 PAS levels would be divided equally to about 500, 1000, 1500 respectively. This is not the case on my factory settings.
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Four Corners
Member
Let me relate that things get a lot simpler using the EggRider display. My Biktrix Jugg FS Ultra came with the DCP-18, and I found little to like in it. Decided to try the EggRider. Its main problem is updating its firmware. I had to mess around a bit to make it happen. Otherwise, it's pretty good. I would like some damping of the instantaneous electric value reporting on the smartphone app. You have to use the smartphone app, if you want a decent display, but the B&W ER phone app is way better than color Bafang. Of course a smart phone does multiple duty as a camera, live map, and even a communication device.
The ER offers two programmable modes each with ten levels. So far I have not felt any need to mess with the torque settings from Biktrix. Should also mention that you have access to all the programmable values directly in the app — no cable or laptop required.
I tried using two different ways to step the PAS levels in the two modes. Level 0 is zero in both. Level 1 is 20% in one and 10% in the other. The first mode then uses a constant additive percentage (10%) increase to get to 100% in Level 9. The other mode uses a constant factor (4/3) to get to 100% in Level 9. They feel totally different.
The ER offers two programmable modes each with ten levels. So far I have not felt any need to mess with the torque settings from Biktrix. Should also mention that you have access to all the programmable values directly in the app — no cable or laptop required.
I tried using two different ways to step the PAS levels in the two modes. Level 0 is zero in both. Level 1 is 20% in one and 10% in the other. The first mode then uses a constant additive percentage (10%) increase to get to 100% in Level 9. The other mode uses a constant factor (4/3) to get to 100% in Level 9. They feel totally different.
TomD
Well-Known Member
@eBikeaholic thanks for your video. It was posted in another thread. Good to see you here. Looking forward to more user collaboration on settings!
@Four Corners, can you provide the default torque sensing settings on your Biktrix Ultra? I'm curious how different the Biktrix settings are from the stock Bafang settings. Biktrix has reportedly done a bit of tuning on their Ultra, but it's unclear how much of that is firmware vs. simply tweaking the settings.
Bafang's stock settings:
eBikeaholic's settings (per youtube video):
(Link Removed - Attachment No Longer Exists)
View attachment 45185
@Four Corners, can you provide the default torque sensing settings on your Biktrix Ultra? I'm curious how different the Biktrix settings are from the stock Bafang settings. Biktrix has reportedly done a bit of tuning on their Ultra, but it's unclear how much of that is firmware vs. simply tweaking the settings.
Bafang's stock settings:
eBikeaholic's settings (per youtube video):
(Link Removed - Attachment No Longer Exists)
View attachment 45185
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Ebiker33
Well-Known Member
Another poster here on EBR owns 2 different brands of bikes of G510 Ultra's and he said the Biktrix stock setting performed better, the owner of Biktrix takes his programming to the next level when tuning the motor, apparently he has obtained the root hex codes from Bafang and messed around with them to get a better result for his bike. Of coarse he won't share, he wants to keep his advantage.
From everything I have heard I wouldn't mess with the Biktrix settings.
From everything I have heard I wouldn't mess with the Biktrix settings.
vincent
Well-Known Member
I thought reading on the biktrix forums some said their ultra was smooth and some said it was jerky...
Would be nice to compare settings but if Roshan went further into the system that may be the difference...
I have not gotten to do any programming on mine yet
The 9 level display I ordered is coming from China and because of the virus and holiday is not here yet
But I am hoping that work slows down in a week- and no rain!- so that I can change some stuff and see how it does
Will update this when I do
Would be nice to compare settings but if Roshan went further into the system that may be the difference...
I have not gotten to do any programming on mine yet
The 9 level display I ordered is coming from China and because of the virus and holiday is not here yet
But I am hoping that work slows down in a week- and no rain!- so that I can change some stuff and see how it does
Will update this when I do
Four Corners
Member
Four Corners
Member
Perhaps some of you may have noticed that many of the values are mysterious and without clear meaning or even units. What is needed, more than a set of values that work well on a particular bike, is an explanation of what they are, what they do, and how they interact. A set that works well on a very heavy bike may not be appropriate on a much lighter bike.
TomD
Well-Known Member
Thanks for posting. Many of the settings are explained in the video above. Here is a comparison:
| Stock | eBkhlc | Biktrix | |||||||||||||||||
| Voltage (mV) | |||||||||||||||||||
| Base | 0 | 0 | 0 | ||||||||||||||||
| Error Min | 300 | 300 | 300 | ||||||||||||||||
| Error Max | 4300 | 4300 | 4600 | ||||||||||||||||
| 0 Speed Boost Time (x10ms) | 120 | 120 | 250 | ||||||||||||||||
| Delta Voltage | |||||||||||||||||||
| 0-5 Kg | 200 | 200 | 150 | ||||||||||||||||
| 5-10 Kg | 200 | 200 | 150 | ||||||||||||||||
| 10-15 Kg | 200 | 200 | 150 | ||||||||||||||||
| 15-20 Kg | 200 | 200 | 150 | ||||||||||||||||
| 20-30 Kg | 400 | 400 | 300 | ||||||||||||||||
| 30-40 Kg | 400 | 400 | 300 | ||||||||||||||||
| 40-50 Kg | 400 | 400 | 300 | ||||||||||||||||
| 50-60 Kg | 400 | 400 | 300 | ||||||||||||||||
| Spd0 | |||||||||||||||||||
| Start (kg) | 20 | 20 | 15 | ||||||||||||||||
| Full (kg) | 50 | 50 | 50 | ||||||||||||||||
| Return (kg) | 12 | 0 | 12 | ||||||||||||||||
| MinCur (%) | 10 | 20 | 20 | ||||||||||||||||
| MaxCur (%) | 100 | 100 | 100 | ||||||||||||||||
| KeepCur (%) | 4 | 20 | 10 | ||||||||||||||||
| CurDecay | 3 | 3 | 3 | ||||||||||||||||
| StartDegree | 1 | 1 | 1 | ||||||||||||||||
| Spd20 | |||||||||||||||||||
| Start (kg) | 16 | 16 | 12 | ||||||||||||||||
| Full (kg) | 45 | 40 | 45 | ||||||||||||||||
| Return (kg) | 9 | 0 | 10 | ||||||||||||||||
| MinCur (%) | 10 | 40 | 15 | ||||||||||||||||
| MaxCur (%) | 100 | 100 | 100 | ||||||||||||||||
| KeepCur (%) | 4 | 40 | 8 | ||||||||||||||||
| CurDecay | 3 | 3 | 3 | ||||||||||||||||
| StartDegree | 1 | 1 | 1 | ||||||||||||||||
| Spd40 | |||||||||||||||||||
| Start (kg) | 12 | 8 | 9 | ||||||||||||||||
| Full (kg) | 40 | 30 | 40 | ||||||||||||||||
| Return (kg) | 6 | 0 | 7 | ||||||||||||||||
| MinCur (%) | 15 | 60 | 10 | ||||||||||||||||
| MaxCur (%) | 100 | 100 | 100 | ||||||||||||||||
| KeepCur (%) | 3 | 60 | 6 | ||||||||||||||||
| CurDecay | 3 | 3 | 3 | ||||||||||||||||
| StartDegree | 1 | 1 | 1 | ||||||||||||||||
| Spd60 | |||||||||||||||||||
| Start (kg) | 10 | 6 | 6 | ||||||||||||||||
| Full (kg) | 35 | 25 | 35 | ||||||||||||||||
| Return (kg) | 5 | 0 | 5 | ||||||||||||||||
| MinCur (%) | 15 | 80 | 10 | ||||||||||||||||
| MaxCur (%) | 100 | 100 | 100 | ||||||||||||||||
| KeepCur (%) | 2 | 80 | 5 | ||||||||||||||||
| CurDecay | 2 | 2 | 3 | ||||||||||||||||
| StartDegree | 1 | 1 | 1 | ||||||||||||||||
| Spd80 | |||||||||||||||||||
| Start (kg) | 8 | 0 | 5 | ||||||||||||||||
| Full (kg) | 30 | 20 | 30 | ||||||||||||||||
| Return (kg) | 4 | 0 | 4 | ||||||||||||||||
| MinCur (%) | 10 | 100 | 10 | ||||||||||||||||
| MaxCur (%) | 100 | 100 | 100 | ||||||||||||||||
| KeepCur (%) | 2 | 100 | 4 | ||||||||||||||||
| CurDecay | 2 | 2 | 3 | ||||||||||||||||
| StartDegree | 1 | 1 | 1 | ||||||||||||||||
| Spd100 | |||||||||||||||||||
| Start (kg) | 6 | 0 | 4 | ||||||||||||||||
| Full (kg) | 25 | 10 | 25 | ||||||||||||||||
| Return (kg) | 4 | 0 | 3 | ||||||||||||||||
| MinCur (%) | 10 | 100 | 10 | ||||||||||||||||
| MaxCur (%) | 100 | 100 | 100 | ||||||||||||||||
| KeepCur (%) | 2 | 100 | 3 | ||||||||||||||||
| CurDecay | 2 | 2 | 3 | ||||||||||||||||
| StartDegree | 1 | 1 | 1 |
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