Trip Planning

[Mr. Coffee]

"Plan your trip, but plan to ditch your plan."

Based on some discussion in other threads, I thought I'd open up the floor and put out some thoughts about planning bike trips and some of the things that might go into it. There is kind of a sliding scale of necessity here: if you are making a short ride in an area you are very familiar with you probably don't need much of a plan at all, but if you are making a longer and more complicated trip or are riding with a larger group you'll need more of a plan, and possibly a pretty elaborate one.

"Plans are useless but planning is essential."

In general, one of the more entertaining parts of trip planning is playing around with maps and figuring out where to go. The introduction of various GPS-based cycling apps has made this process pretty fun and almost like playing an interesting video game. These can be a good starting point. Also very helpful is Google Maps and Google Street View.

You might also want/need to scout out parts of your trip. You might do that on a bike or you might use an actual motorcar to do the work. I'll scout to get a feel for what the road surface is like, what complex intersections look like from the ground, what is in stock at various markets on the route, and maybe also getting beta on places to stay along the way. It is also a good idea to make liberal use of your phone and email to ask questions and get more and better information.

It is also a good idea to designate some control points (or decision points). In my terminology those are convenient locations (usually chosen as places you'd like to stop anyway) where it is a good idea to take stock of how the trip is going so far and deciding if you want to change your plan. Some of the questions I'd ask myself at such a point are: "are we on schedule?", "is the weather especially bad or good?", "am I okay?", "is the bike okay?" If you are in a group having such agreed on locations where everyone can gather and take stock of the trip so far is a Really Good Idea.

Also when going on a nontrivial expedition, it is very wise to let some responsible person know what your plan is. When you give them your plan, also attach photos of your bike and you in what you wear on your bike. If you are camping include photos of your tent or shelter. On a multi-day trip have prearranged check in times and dates -- this is kind of on a sliding scale and I generally don't check in more than every other day, although on a complicated and difficult trip this may be twice a day.

If the group is beyond a certain size you probably need to write all this stuff down. If riding in a small group you can huddle over coffee and figure out the Plan for the day -- it helps if someone is carrying a tablet because it is easier for people to see everything.

 

[Kayakguy]

"Plan your trip, but plan to ditch your plan."

Based on some discussion in other threads, I thought I'd open up the floor and put out some thoughts about planning bike trips and some of the things that might go into it. There is kind of a sliding scale of necessity here: if you are making a short ride in an area you are very familiar with you probably don't need much of a plan at all, but if you are making a longer and more complicated trip or are riding with a larger group you'll need more of a plan, and possibly a pretty elaborate one.

"Plans are useless but planning is essential."

In general, one of the more entertaining parts of trip planning is playing around with maps and figuring out where to go. The introduction of various GPS-based cycling apps has made this process pretty fun and almost like playing an interesting video game. These can be a good starting point. Also very helpful is Google Maps and Google Street View.

You might also want/need to scout out parts of your trip. You might do that on a bike or you might use an actual motorcar to do the work. I'll scout to get a feel for what the road surface is like, what complex intersections look like from the ground, what is in stock at various markets on the route, and maybe also getting beta on places to stay along the way. It is also a good idea to make liberal use of your phone and email to ask questions and get more and better information.

It is also a good idea to designate some control points (or decision points). In my terminology those are convenient locations (usually chosen as places you'd like to stop anyway) where it is a good idea to take stock of how the trip is going so far and deciding if you want to change your plan. Some of the questions I'd ask myself at such a point are: "are we on schedule?", "is the weather especially bad or good?", "am I okay?", "is the bike okay?" If you are in a group having such agreed on locations where everyone can gather and take stock of the trip so far is a Really Good Idea.

Also when going on a nontrivial expedition, it is very wise to let some responsible person know what your plan is. When you give them your plan, also attach photos of your bike and you in what you wear on your bike. If you are camping include photos of your tent or shelter. On a multi-day trip have prearranged check in times and dates -- this is kind of on a sliding scale and I generally don't check in more than every other day, although on a complicated and difficult trip this may be twice a day.

If the group is beyond a certain size you probably need to write all this stuff down. If riding in a small group you can huddle over coffee and figure out the Plan for the day -- it helps if someone is carrying a tablet because it is easier for people to see everything.

Planning on a nano scale has become a necessity for me as I grow even more ancient. Used to be, I could drive or ride to any nearby location almost automatically. My aging brain compels me to look at maps (especially biking maps) to figure out a route even though I "know" the way there. As my dad was fond of saying, "Growing old ain't for sissies."

I don't use gps or apps, even though I know they would be helpful, because I am also somewhat of a luddite. AI horrifies me.

 

[K PierreR]

Mr. Coffee, have read a lot of journals on CGOAB and one theme keeps standing out and its pretty much what you describe. It seems those who over plan down to making reservations for the trip with set dates do not often complete their routes. It seems they are miserable and give up during monotonous sections of their rides. There are two types of comfort. Physical comfort and logistical comforts. Those who are not miserable are comfortable with uncertainty and in fact, embrace it as the spice of their adventure.
Bottom line, Get comfortable with being uncomfortable. The greater the uncertainty, the greater the adventure and the more stimulating it is.

 

[Art Deco]

Planning on a nano scale has become a necessity for me as I grow even more ancient. Used to be, I could drive or ride to any nearby location almost automatically. My aging brain compels me to look at maps (especially biking maps) to figure out a route even though I "know" the way there. As my dad was fond of saying, "Growing old ain't for sissies."

I don't use gps or apps, even though I know they would be helpful, because I am also somewhat of a luddite. AI horrifies me.

I am no luddite, but I love maps and hate most apps. And the more I know about A.I. the more horrified I become; much like nuclear weapons ...

 

[6zfshdb]

I do most of my trip planning during the off season. Here in the northeastern US, the weather isn't suitable for riding during much of Dec, Jan, Feb and Mar. I find the planning process to be enjoyable and a great way to break the monotony of not being able to ride. I'll spend the time gathering information on possible places to go from a variety of sources including, the internet, printed media, bike forums and, not the least of which, is word of mouth. Trailheads and LBS "hangouts" are a great source. Many of the best places I've ridden were recommended by other bikers.

Due to the increase in distracted driving incidents, these days, I mostly ride trails. I belong to "Rails To Trails" https://www.traillink.com/?gclid=CIS93-rqg78CFUEaOgodOU0AIA and their quarterly magazine is an excellent source of great places to ride. Their website has a wealth of information on thousands of trails across the US. I find the reviews left by other riders to be very helpful.

The planning process for trail riding is quite different than that for roadies. I take the time to compile detailed files which I load into a GPS. These files contain maps, tracks, routes and waypoints for lodging, points of interest, charging locations, LBS and possible hazards along the route. In my case, a GPS is an indispensable tool which makes changing plans on the fly much easier. I use one that has a subscription satellite texting service since some of the remote places I ride have no cell phone coverage.

For those who don't enjoy the trip planning process, there are many organized group rides available where the details are worked out in advance by others. Most even provide a "SAG" wagon that shadows the group to aid stragglers and breakdowns. In the case of long distance trail rides, transportation to and from lodging is also provided.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

On lodging and accommodations, I almost never book anything more than a day in advance, and often don't even do that. You can use tools like expedia to figure out availability on your route and if there is plenty of room I recommend winging it, as that gives you much more flexibility in how far you ride and also can let you skip situations that aren't optimal.

A few things I look for in lodging:

1. Laundry
2. Groceries and other supplies within walking distance
3. Allows me to keep and charge my bike in the room
4. Ground floor rooms (because taking your bike up and down stairs or in a tiny elevator is a hassle)
5. Decent hotel breakfast

It never hurts to call the hotel up and get clarity on the above. Sometimes web sites will give you enough information, but sometimes they won't. If you do communicate with a hotel before arriving, be clear to them you are arriving by bicycle.

Older buildings with steep, narrow staircases and no elevators are to be avoided like the plague. Maneuvering your (possibly fully loaded) bike up and down those will be exhausting. In most cases I have a very low opinion of allowing the hotel to store my bike. Some hotels have pretty secure bike storage accessed by your room key card though and that is not so bad (although I'd still lock the damned bike up in the "secure" bike storage, and wouldn't be as comfortable as having my bike safely in my room).

It also helps if there is a hose outside to clean your bike (and possibly yourself) before taking it all inside.

Another tip: when I start off from a hotel, I top off all bottles but one with ice and then fill with water. The one I am starting the ride with will be all water.

Also, I heartily recommend doing opportunistic resupply. As much as you can, only carry what you need to get to the next resupply point. It is worthwhile planning food carefully because a lot of food can be heavy and bulky. Sometimes having a big feed in a grocery store parking lot is a good idea too. On some of my trips most of my meals were literally at stores.

If there is a decent hotel breakfast, don't be shy about grabbing any snacks you'll need that morning on the ride.

Similarly with water. If you have a long waterless stretch in front of you, in particular if the weather is hot or there is no shade, top up everything you have and drink until you are about to burst before departing.

 

[PatriciaK]

On lodging and accommodations, I almost never book anything more than a day in advance, and often don't even do that. You can use tools like expedia to figure out availability on your route and if there is plenty of room I recommend winging it, as that gives you much more flexibility in how far you ride and also can let you skip situations that aren't optimal.

A few things I look for in lodging:

1. Laundry
2. Groceries and other supplies within walking distance
3. Allows me to keep and charge my bike in the room
4. Ground floor rooms (because taking your bike up and down stairs or in a tiny elevator is a hassle)
5. Decent hotel breakfast

It never hurts to call the hotel up and get clarity on the above. Sometimes web sites will give you enough information, but sometimes they won't. If you do communicate with a hotel before arriving, be clear to them you are arriving by bicycle.

Older buildings with steep, narrow staircases and no elevators are to be avoided like the plague. Maneuvering your (possibly fully loaded) bike up and down those will be exhausting. In most cases I have a very low opinion of allowing the hotel to store my bike. Some hotels have pretty secure bike storage accessed by your room key card though and that is not so bad (although I'd still lock the damned bike up in the "secure" bike storage, and wouldn't be as comfortable as having my bike safely in my room).

It also helps if there is a hose outside to clean your bike (and possibly yourself) before taking it all inside.

Another tip: when I start off from a hotel, I top off all bottles but one with ice and then fill with water. The one I am starting the ride with will be all water.

Also, I heartily recommend doing opportunistic resupply. As much as you can, only carry what you need to get to the next resupply point. It is worthwhile planning food carefully because a lot of food can be heavy and bulky. Sometimes having a big feed in a grocery store parking lot is a good idea too. On some of my trips most of my meals were literally at stores.

If there is a decent hotel breakfast, don't be shy about grabbing any snacks you'll need that morning on the ride.

Similarly with water. If you have a long waterless stretch in front of you, in particular if the weather is hot or there is no shade, top up everything you have and drink until you are about to burst before departing.

"top up everything you have and drink until you are about to burst before departing."

Assuming you are a guy and can pee by the side of the road .

 

[Kayakguy]

"top up everything you have and drink until you are about to burst before departing."

Assuming you are a guy and can pee by the side of the road .

My wife uses a woman's peeing aid called "Freshet", I believe. Enables her to write her name in the snow, join the guys marking trees, and works out great on beaches. I'm sure there are other brands. True women's lib!

She calls it her "whiz kit."

 

[PDoz]

On lodging and accommodations, I almost never book anything more than a day in advance, and often don't even do that. You can use tools like expedia to figure out availability on your route and if there is plenty of room I recommend winging it, as that gives you much more flexibility in how far you ride and also can let you skip situations that aren't optimal.

A few things I look for in lodging:

1. Laundry
2. Groceries and other supplies within walking distance
3. Allows me to keep and charge my bike in the room
4. Ground floor rooms (because taking your bike up and down stairs or in a tiny elevator is a hassle)
5. Decent hotel breakfast

It never hurts to call the hotel up and get clarity on the above. Sometimes web sites will give you enough information, but sometimes they won't. If you do communicate with a hotel before arriving, be clear to them you are arriving by bicycle.

Older buildings with steep, narrow staircases and no elevators are to be avoided like the plague. Maneuvering your (possibly fully loaded) bike up and down those will be exhausting. In most cases I have a very low opinion of allowing the hotel to store my bike. Some hotels have pretty secure bike storage accessed by your room key card though and that is not so bad (although I'd still lock the damned bike up in the "secure" bike storage, and wouldn't be as comfortable as having my bike safely in my room).

It also helps if there is a hose outside to clean your bike (and possibly yourself) before taking it all inside.

Another tip: when I start off from a hotel, I top off all bottles but one with ice and then fill with water. The one I am starting the ride with will be all water.

Also, I heartily recommend doing opportunistic resupply. As much as you can, only carry what you need to get to the next resupply point. It is worthwhile planning food carefully because a lot of food can be heavy and bulky. Sometimes having a big feed in a grocery store parking lot is a good idea too. On some of my trips most of my meals were literally at stores.

If there is a decent hotel breakfast, don't be shy about grabbing any snacks you'll need that morning on the ride.

Similarly with water. If you have a long waterless stretch in front of you, in particular if the weather is hot or there is no shade, top up everything you have and drink until you are about to burst before departing.

Your accomodation approach highlights the downside of larger groups - try booking accomodation for anything more than 4 people with short notice !

I've been caught on the flip side of that - a group of 30 booked into ski lodges over summer. We ride between alpine villages and enjoy spectacularly cheap / good accomodation, BUT these places rely on numbers to be viable. What should have been cheap and easy gets difficult if 1/2 people bail during a trip +/- if someone arrives as an extra! Especially with meals, or even supporting a group by carrying luggage ( especially if 1/2 people don't understand " pack light" )

 

[Kayakguy]

"top up everything you have and drink until you are about to burst before departing."

Assuming you are a guy and can pee by the side of the road .

Even though I usually have to pee a lot, when I'm kayaking my body seems to sense that it should retain water for evaporative cooling (which works very well with a Gore Tex dry suit). So I can usually hold it until we get to a beach.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Here's a 509 km route for the Mazovian Gravel 500 (2023) ultramarathon that led through underdeveloped area of Mazovia in Poland up to the Belarussian border:

The route was scouted both by the organizers and volunteers many times in months and weeks before the race. (They had to do the same to another route for MG 250). There was a big doubt whether the racers could cross River Fiszor, the level of which could greatly vary depending on rainfall, and the bottom of which was full of rough stones.

The area has poor network coverage, no overnight stay base, hardly any restaurants, and very few shops (especially ones open on Sundays). The organizers sought assistance of some boroughs that helped organizing pit-stops with food (meat or vegan)/water/fruit and places to sleep (if the participant brought their own sleeping bag). Many people choose to camp in the forest.

The organizers provided not only the GPX files but also a printed booklet with maps and the list of available grocery stores en route. Any participant could come to a pre-race party organized some 10 km to the starting line.

Any participant rode on own responsibility, was obliged to wear a helmet, and be self-sufficient.

The organizers set many "traps" for the participants so the latter could prove they were real adventurers.

600 people paid the non-returnable participation fee. 211 riders completed the MG 500, and 277 people reached the finish line of MG 250 (I was 248th but was not assigned a place because of riding an e-bike).

The preliminary result list based on the trackers carried by the racers.

The final result list.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

Your accomodation approach highlights the downside of larger groups - try booking accomodation for anything more than 4 people with short notice !

Maybe it is how I roll, but I really am not at all good at achieving precision on trip itineraries. I for one doubt that most people are. The Plan inevitably ends up being too ambitious or not ambitious enough.

If you go trekking in Nepal, the itineraries are very rigid and it is difficult to deviate from them. This is okay and kind of reasonable when you are ascending as you need to acclimatize, but if you are going downhill I don't see how it should matter as much or at all. Sometimes you might want to sit and hang most of the day and have a short (or zero) day. Maybe you find someplace just magical or want to take a side trip. Sometimes you may get into the zone and want to put down some miles. Being locked into an itinerary just isn't going to be very fun.

On peeing alongside a busy road. I'd argue that is embarrassing but embarrassment isn't as bad as severe dehydration. In hot, dry weather without any shade you can go from completely waterlogged to needing an ER in a couple of hours, so you need to stay on top of it. I've also noticed, at least for me, that I can sometimes become somewhat dehydrated in cooler, wet weather just because I never feel very thirsty. So I like to get into a pattern of forcing myself to eat and drink every half hour or so, at least.

 

[PDoz]

Maybe it is how I roll, but I really am not at all good at achieving precision on trip itineraries. I for one doubt that most people are. The Plan inevitably ends up being too ambitious or not ambitious enough.

You articulate well some of the reasons I moved away from organising large group rides.

That constant need to monitor and adjust routes to suit ability / time to destination - whilst trying to keep everyone happy their ambition matches reality.. It can be an enjoyable challenge with a cohesive group, but only takes one dysfunctional person to make the exercise unpleasant.

Meanwhile, the stars align perfectly - a discussion about dehydration and roadside micturition by coffe. Gold

 

[Mr. Coffee]

Meanwhile, the stars align perfectly - a discussion about dehydration and roadside micturition by coffee. Gold

Heh.

I've been playing around with a Polar Heart Rate monitor these past few months.

One Big Thing I noticed right away was that my heart rate would run noticeably higher if I was even a little bit dehydrated. And if I was a lot dehydrated it would often go really insanely high. So another thing to remind me to drink.

Where I really get into trouble is, ironically, during cooler and wet weather where it is easy to think you aren't thirsty and forget to drink much at all. Trust me, you are still losing water if you are active.

Most people on these fora, most of the time, only ride their bike for 1-2 hours at a time. So they probably won't ever notice.

 

[PDoz]

Heh.

I've been playing around with a Polar Heart Rate monitor these past few months.

One Big Thing I noticed right away was that my heart rate would run noticeably higher if I was even a little bit dehydrated. And if I was a lot dehydrated it would often go really insanely high. So another thing to remind me to drink.

Where I really get into trouble is, ironically, during cooler and wet weather where it is easy to think you aren't thirsty and forget to drink much at all. Trust me, you are still losing water if you are active.

Most people on these fora, most of the time, only ride their bike for 1-2 hours at a time. So they probably won't ever notice.

If your hr goes up from dehydration, you're at least 10% dehydrated and likely to be less alert ( unless you are on bp meds that increase hr or have a kidney / heart condition / getting dehydrated by coffee)

 

[DiggyGun]

Most of our holidays involve bike riding.

One we know where we’re going, book either a cottage or hotel, I start planning potential routes.

Do the research on the web for off-road cycle trails and go on from there. Usually find more than we need. Most have some route map or directions, so print them off and laminate them.

So, when we’re out for the day, we have the OS map and our laminated ones. If we do get lost, we can always put the GPS on to put us back on track.

We have done the following areas like this;

• New Forest
• Norfolk Broads
• Lake District
• Peak District
• South Downs
• Isle of Wight

So far, the planning has not let us down.

DG…

 

[old guy 666]

"Plan your trip, but plan to ditch your plan."

Based on some discussion in other threads, I thought I'd open up the floor and put out some thoughts about planning bike trips and some of the things that might go into it. There is kind of a sliding scale of necessity here: if you are making a short ride in an area you are very familiar with you probably don't need much of a plan at all, but if you are making a longer and more complicated trip or are riding with a larger group you'll need more of a plan, and possibly a pretty elaborate one.

"Plans are useless but planning is essential."

In general, one of the more entertaining parts of trip planning is playing around with maps and figuring out where to go. The introduction of various GPS-based cycling apps has made this process pretty fun and almost like playing an interesting video game. These can be a good starting point. Also very helpful is Google Maps and Google Street View.

You might also want/need to scout out parts of your trip. You might do that on a bike or you might use an actual motorcar to do the work. I'll scout to get a feel for what the road surface is like, what complex intersections look like from the ground, what is in stock at various markets on the route, and maybe also getting beta on places to stay along the way. It is also a good idea to make liberal use of your phone and email to ask questions and get more and better information.

It is also a good idea to designate some control points (or decision points). In my terminology those are convenient locations (usually chosen as places you'd like to stop anyway) where it is a good idea to take stock of how the trip is going so far and deciding if you want to change your plan. Some of the questions I'd ask myself at such a point are: "are we on schedule?", "is the weather especially bad or good?", "am I okay?", "is the bike okay?" If you are in a group having such agreed on locations where everyone can gather and take stock of the trip so far is a Really Good Idea.

Also when going on a nontrivial expedition, it is very wise to let some responsible person know what your plan is. When you give them your plan, also attach photos of your bike and you in what you wear on your bike. If you are camping include photos of your tent or shelter. On a multi-day trip have prearranged check in times and dates -- this is kind of on a sliding scale and I generally don't check in more than every other day, although on a complicated and difficult trip this may be twice a day.

If the group is beyond a certain size you probably need to write all this stuff down. If riding in a small group you can huddle over coffee and figure out the Plan for the day -- it helps if someone is carrying a tablet because it is easier for people to see everything.

I had the perfect 30 mile loop planned, and even checked it out with Google street view. But the day of the ride was fresh tar & gravel. Have maps that do not need cell service to figure out plan B.

 

[kiyar]

Good info here, thanks. I'm planning my first long trip and I need to prepare my bicycle. It is about safety, so it is important. I also surfed the Internet and found a good article on the topic https://www.bikertricks.com/bicycle-safety-check/ It provided me with some helpful tips and I think I can use it as a guide. But it is great to learn from more experienced riders.