The Experience of a Bicycle

[Ravi Kempaiah]

I'm afraid that my-way-or-the-highway and I-know-best-you-suck are baked into human nature.

Both are special cases of the whole us-them thing. And anonymity really brings it out. Examples on this forum that go both ways...
o US = cyclists, THEM = drivers
o US = ebikers, THEM = unmotorized riders
o US = mid-drive fanciers, THEM = hub motor fans
o US = throttle fans, THEM = throttle haters

My other hobby is making things that move in interesting ways with LEGO. The same dynamic plays out in AFOL (adult fan of LEGO) forums.

A perennial conflict sure to cause rancor...
o US = purists who wouldn't dream of modifying a LEGO part, THEM = profligrates who don't think twice when all else fails.

And all this over a toy that, like the bicycle, nearly everyone loves! Astounding.

Great insight!
Yes, anonymity really brings it out and the conflict is astounding!

 

[Djangodog]

You and Mikes are incredibly arrogant to call someone you know nothing about arrogant and self-entitled. It's the pot calling the kettle black from your perceived moral high ground. My cage is capable of 40-50MPH over any maximum limit. We haven't legislated cage engines and classes for cages. It's dumb and it's nanny bullshit. I posted a link to my previous comments. IN FACT I ride like I have a class 1 eBike MOST of the time. But on days crossing town on an empty MUP, I roll out my throttle at 25-28. NO ONE IS ON THE PATH. How am I a danger to you and your nanny state?

It’s not always all about you. That extra speed that you claim to “need” is about want, not need.

Your profanity doesn’t carry the weight that you seem to think it does. Profanity is the effort of a feeble mind to express itself forcibly. You repeatedly show that to be true.

You seem to pick and choose which laws should apply to your desires, yet you call me and Stefan arrogant???

 

[Taylor57]

You and Mikes are incredibly arrogant to call someone you know nothing about arrogant and self-entitled. It's the pot calling the kettle black from your perceived moral high ground. My cage is capable of 40-50MPH over any maximum limit. We haven't legislated cage engines and classes for cages. It's dumb and it's nanny bullshit. I posted a link to my previous comments. IN FACT I ride like I have a class 1 eBike MOST of the time. But on days crossing town on an empty MUP, I roll out my throttle at 25-28. NO ONE IS ON THE PATH. How am I a danger to you and your nanny state?

Sorry for the ignorance, but what is a cage?

 

[m@Robertson]

The classes also protect those that you might mow down at 25 with your throttle.

This makes no sense. 25 mph is 25 mph. It fits within the class definition if pedal-assisted but not if on throttle. In neither case is it any more or less dangerous. You are blaming a throttle for nothing. "mowing down" indeed. I realize you are trying to make a good-faith argument here but really... if you stop for a second and think that statement over its just an expression of prejudice not grounded in anything concrete.

The fastest I have ever gone on a bike is downhill at roughly 55 mph, which is terminal velocity on a 19 lb analog road bike (actually I probably reached 60 or so with my Zzipper fairing). Par for the course riding in the Lower Sierras or any alpine ride anywhere. And downhill here in town speeds in the 30's are routine by not just me. Its not some rare ebike-only phenomenon. One day on my road bike I was coasting at about 30 downhill into Monterey and a lady in a VW bus pulled up beside me and said "you're speeding!". I responded "So are you!" and we both had a good laugh. That was somewhere back in the 1990's.

 

[Taylor57]

You’re not alone. I’ve always preferred lighter ebikes that feel more like a regular bike. So much so that my main bike now is a Specialized Aethos i.e. no motor. I liked my Creo when I got it because it was more responsive and handled better than previous ebikes I had. But the Aethos is just a dream to ride.

There was some post here about smoking Vados, so you’re right there are a lot of people here who want the high powered bikes and they don’t want to pedal a lot. Some can’t but others just don’t want to.

In Canada where I live ebikes are restricted to 32 km/hr, so just as the high power ebike riders who like to smoke Vados, I enjoy dropping ebikes when I ride above 32 km/hr on flats. I just love dropping those riders.

Going downhill, I love going 75 - 80 km/hr, and not many riding those big ponderous bikes are willing to go that fast.

We have 2 Espins Sports same color. I was riding my sons downhill the other day not full bore but making decent time, when I looked down at the display and saw 48. I almost pooped my pants. I pulled over and put my glasses on and looked again. He has his Sport set to kilometers! Whew!!

 

[Djangodog]

This makes no sense. 25 mph is 25 mph. It fits within the class definition if pedal-assisted but not if on throttle. In neither case is it any more or less dangerous. You are blaming a throttle for nothing. "mowing down" indeed. Talk about poisoning the well...

The fastest I have ever gone on a bike is downhill at roughly 55 mph, which is terminal velocity on a 19 lb analog road bike (actually I probably reached 60 or so with my Zzipper fairing). Par for the course riding in the Lower Sierras or any alpine ride anywhere. And downhill here in town speeds in the 30's are routine by not just me. Its not some rare ebike-only phenomenon. One day on my road bike I was coasting at about 30 downhill into Monterey and a lady in a VW bus pulled up beside me and said "you're speeding!". I responded "So are you!" and we both had a good laugh.

To put my comment in context, he was claiming that the law was written to only pertain to the rider’s safety, (more accurately, his), and I don’t think that this is the case at all. There are many places that a class 3 and a throttled class 2 are not permitted because it is perceived that they pose a danger, and I happen to agree. A kid or animal can appear in an instant and a heavy bike and rider riding at 25 mph under power is a hazard on a path, period.

Regarding poisoning the well, Tomjasz is never shy about making ”absolute” statements and getting nasty. My opinion is just that, but I don’t feel any great need to be silent just to avoid the wrath of the garbage mouthed types.

 

[m@Robertson]

Sometimes, an e-bike is not a good solution or fit. It sounds like you need something more substantial.

Correction: Not a good solution or fit for your personal taste or desires. Those things are yours alone. His needs are for a cargo bike. They are VERY common. Just not around you, so you haven't had or taken the time to understand them and integrate them into your idea of what a bicycle is. You have to come to the understanding that bikes can be - and commonly are - more. And you're going to have to do it regardless of anything I say, because their use is growing in the US, and nobody in government has anything but praise for them and their benefits both to riders and their reduction to traffic and pollution.

There's a bigger world out there that we would all do well to take note of and appreciate.

 

[Djangodog]

Correction: Not a good solution or fit for your personal taste or desires. Those things are yours alone. His needs are for a cargo bike. They are VERY common. Just not around you, so you haven't had or taken the time to understand them and integrate them into your idea of what a bicycle is. You have to come to the understanding that bikes can be - and commonly are - more. And you're going to have to do it regardless of anything I say, because their use is growing in the US, and nobody in government has anything but praise for them and their benefits both to riders and their reduction to traffic and pollution.

There's a bigger world out there that we would all do well to take note of and appreciate.

I understand his ”needs”. I think that it may be you that is “poisoning the well” now.

When I said that an e-bike may not be a good fit, it was because he says that he requires more than a legal e-bike can offer. It’s like trying to use a car as a truck. It doesn’t always work out. If a legal e-bike won’t do the job, then it seems reasonable that it is not the right tool for the application. Having to get the bike across a six lane highway should have been a clue. From his description it sounds like a very dangerous place to ride and an e-bike isn’t seeming to work very well for him, so yeah, it sounds like a bad fit. Bicycles and motor scooters don’t belong on an interstate either. Maybe you think that they are a good fit everywhere. I don’t.

 

[PedalUma]

Like OP I like bikes that feel like bikes. I am the one who started the Smoking Vado's thread, for entertainment. I followed a thread on what seniors want in a bike here on EBR, and purchased the right bike to convert last Thursday. Because I listened and implemented what they said, it sold on Sunday. That is a fast turnaround. A step thru with huge grips and a throttle is not for me. The cargo market is huge around here and moms are wild for them. Listen to the market. But, I will not go near the electric motorcycles. They are bad news for everyone. Here is the senior bike and a cargo.

 

[Cowlitz]

Does my bike wobble all over with a load on it? No. I haven't noticed that. It does take more effort, as it should, to pedal when it is loaded down and starting from a stop is more difficult. I've usually got a headwind on the way home, but it is only a couple of miles from the store.

Note: Do not leave cantaloups in pannier overnight unless you enjoy having your bags smell like cantaloups for a couple of months.

Toilet paper is bulky, but not heavy. Got it home OK. A step through is a good thing to have.

 

[indianajo]

When I said that an e-bike may not be a good fit, it was because he says that he requires more than a legal e-bike can offer. It’s like trying to use a car as a truck. It doesn’t always work out. If a legal e-bike won’t do the job, then it seems reasonable that it is not the right tool for the application. Having to get the bike across a six lane highway should have been a clue.

Old men that ride around in cars and sit around die quickly. My father sat around 2 years after retirement reading books then a stroke ruined his brain. Riding my bike with too much cargo keeps my heart so that it "has nothing wrong with it" to quote Baptist Health cardiologist that spent $7000 medicare money testing it. (I needed shoulder surgery).
I've been off work 14 years. Pedaling the bike 70 miles/week in summer 20 miles/week winter may be why my heart is in so good shape. Making the electric package I had for a couple of years illegal makes me livid. In the same category as repainting Hwy 31 south of Sellarsburg to direct motor vehicles onto the former bike berm, as I discovered last week. Death to climate change preventers!!!!!!!!!!! A red mantra , favorite of Sen Joe Manson.

 

[Djangodog]

Old men that ride around in cars and sit around die quickly. My father sat around 2 years after retirement reading books then a stroke ruined his brain. Riding my bike with too much cargo keeps my heart so that it "has nothing wrong with it" to quote Baptist Health cardiologist that spent $7000 medicare money testing it. (I needed shoulder surgery).
I've been off work 14 years. Pedaling the bike 70 miles/week in summer 20 miles/week winter may be why my heart is in so good shape. Making the electric package I had for a couple of years illegal makes me livid. In the same category as repainting Hwy 31 south of Sellarsburg to direct motor vehicles onto the former bike berm, as I discovered last week. Death to climate change preventers!!!!!!!!!!! A red mantra , favorite of Sen Joe Manson.

I’m sorry if my post was offensive to you. It sucks when laws change and things go from legal to not. It happens in other activities as well.

Maybe the solution is making more trips with lighter loads. Maybe a trailer. I don’t really know. Whatever the e-bike, the route sounds hazardous and that was why I responded as I did. I was just going by what you had said.

For the record, I am in favor of replacing as many fossil fuel burning vehicles as possible. Maybe it wouldn’t be the end of the world for a class of e-cargo bike to come into existence. It may require registration and insurance in some states, but it might be a useful addition to the EV field. I also lean blue, not red and I don’t like Joe Manchin, but I also don’t want him to defect over to Mitch’s team. You can probably determine if a rule is just by the outrage on both ends. If everyone is outraged, you probably nailed the center.

 

[Rome]

One of the best experiences I have on bicycle was when one of my daughters was living in Maui and I went for a visit. Rather than just sitting around and barbecuing I went on a guided bicycle tour of Haleakala Volcano you are driven to the top 10000 feet of elevation very early to witness the most spectacular sunrise. Then your group will ride downhill approximately 20 miles to a town called Makawao where the scenery just takes you back in time and the local foods are amazingly delicious very satisfying. The daiquiris made with island brewed rum are some of the best.
If I have to do it all over again it will be on an ebike I would ride up enjoying the fantastic views then ride down as fast as my bike could possibly go.

 

[PedalUma]

One of the best experiences I have on bicycle was when one of my daughters was living in Maui and I went for a visit. Rather than just sitting around and barbecuing I went on a guided bicycle tour of Haleakala Volcano you are driven to the top 10000 feet of elevation very early to witness the most spectacular sunrise. Then your group will ride downhill approximately 20 miles to a town called Makawao where the scenery just takes you back in time and the local foods are amazingly delicious very satisfying. The daiquiris made with island brewed rum are some of the best.
If I have to do it all over again it will be on an ebike I would ride up enjoying the fantastic views then ride down as fast as my bike could possibly go.

Is that a false color infrared camera?

 

[Taylor57]

One of the best experiences I have on bicycle was when one of my daughters was living in Maui and I went for a visit. Rather than just sitting around and barbecuing I went on a guided bicycle tour of Haleakala Volcano you are driven to the top 10000 feet of elevation very early to witness the most spectacular sunrise. Then your group will ride downhill approximately 20 miles to a town called Makawao where the scenery just takes you back in time and the local foods are amazingly delicious very satisfying. The daiquiris made with island brewed rum are some of the best.
If I have to do it all over again it will be on an ebike I would ride up enjoying the fantastic views then ride down as fast as my bike could possibly go.

You had me up until the ride down part

 

[JedidiahStolzfus]

One of the best experiences I have on bicycle was when one of my daughters was living in Maui and I went for a visit. Rather than just sitting around and barbecuing I went on a guided bicycle tour of Haleakala Volcano you are driven to the top 10000 feet of elevation very early to witness the most spectacular sunrise. Then your group will ride downhill approximately 20 miles to a town called Makawao where the scenery just takes you back in time and the local foods are amazingly delicious very satisfying. The daiquiris made with island brewed rum are some of the best.
If I have to do it all over again it will be on an ebike I would ride up enjoying the fantastic views then ride down as fast as my bike could possibly go.

Wife and I Honeymooned in Hawaii and spent a day on Maui. Rented a car and drove to the top of that volcano. Fun drive up a narrow two lane unguarded blacktop, that is until 40 people come screaming down the mountain in snow suits right at you.

 

[J.R.]

Sorry for the ignorance, but what is a cage?

Mostly biker (MC) lingo from the late 50's on. Some car club guys will use the term. Cage means car.

Springsteen mentioned it in Born to Run. "Sprung from cages on highway 9.... it's a death trap, a suicide wrap..." Cage wrecked.

 

[Rome]

Next time you and the Mrs. come try the bike tour.
They get their share of snow in the winter months.
The Maunakea Volcano on the Big Island with higher elevation gets enough snow and people ski. There's bicycle tours there too.

 

[PedalUma]

You really feel the micro-climates change with the altitude in the tropics. The amount of sun is the same, it is just the temperature. It also really matters what side of the mountain. One side can be dry and the other jungle.

 

[JedidiahStolzfus]

Next time you and the Mrs. come try the bike tour.
They get their share of snow in the winter months.
The Maunakea Volcano on the Big Island with higher elevation gets enough snow and people ski. There's bicycle tours there too.

I doubt we'll ever make it there again, that's why we picked it then. We drove to the top and then went snorkeling at Kapalua. Really fun day, wish we would have spent more time on Maui.