George S.
Well-Known Member
This is an interesting frame.
http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=47&product_id=209
http://em3ev.com/store/index.php?route=product/product&path=47&product_id=209
Sonders Experience and modding
- Thread starter one4torque
- Start date
one4torque
Active Member
They will all have a purpose in my garage:
Sonders - cruiser.
Trek w/ Small Block Hub Drive - ??? not sure really how this will ride
Stealth Bomber - single-track monster.
I'll probably end up upgrading the sonders with time, after my research is done..... perhaps dual fr/rear drive motors, or install that big-block hub drive from lightening rods....
Sonders - cruiser.
Trek w/ Small Block Hub Drive - ??? not sure really how this will ride
Stealth Bomber - single-track monster.
I'll probably end up upgrading the sonders with time, after my research is done..... perhaps dual fr/rear drive motors, or install that big-block hub drive from lightening rods....
one4torque
Active Member
Sonders Ebike - round 2 of mods:
* Ordered a 350watt 36 volt front hub fatbike wheel drive/controller/etc....
I already have two batteries mounted, so we'll see how the sonders performs with 2WD.
Will be interesting to see how range, and MPH changes with same 2 36v 10AH batteries on my current single 350 watt rear hub motor setup.
I suspect there is enough heat/friction loss from running fr/rr hubs @ same time to lose some range over the single 350watt rear hub motor with twice the ah capacity.....
I'll defer to my emperical data (coming soon), and the guru's on this board
Hope to get some add'l speed out of this...... and accel up to 20mph... and hill climbing ability on and off road.
re speed improvement - I've got the sonders lcd controller coming.... so I can raise the sp limiter for the rear hub drive.
should be able to keep is fairly clean install: 2nd controller will fit in the plastic sonders compartment, other throttle will go on the left grip side. Not sure I can splice the brake cut-outs for "2" two motors controllers.... just might fore-go motor cut-out for the front hub. Might also fore-go the cadence assist sensor for the front Hub motor.... just treat it as a manual booster.
* Ordered a 350watt 36 volt front hub fatbike wheel drive/controller/etc....
I already have two batteries mounted, so we'll see how the sonders performs with 2WD.
Will be interesting to see how range, and MPH changes with same 2 36v 10AH batteries on my current single 350 watt rear hub motor setup.
I suspect there is enough heat/friction loss from running fr/rr hubs @ same time to lose some range over the single 350watt rear hub motor with twice the ah capacity.....
I'll defer to my emperical data (coming soon), and the guru's on this board
Hope to get some add'l speed out of this...... and accel up to 20mph... and hill climbing ability on and off road.
re speed improvement - I've got the sonders lcd controller coming.... so I can raise the sp limiter for the rear hub drive.
should be able to keep is fairly clean install: 2nd controller will fit in the plastic sonders compartment, other throttle will go on the left grip side. Not sure I can splice the brake cut-outs for "2" two motors controllers.... just might fore-go motor cut-out for the front hub. Might also fore-go the cadence assist sensor for the front Hub motor.... just treat it as a manual booster.
one4torque
Active Member
Here's the log-to-date for the Sonders adventure
Date Miles Avg Peak Time Temp Comments Notes 2 Notes 3
8.15.15 13.3 17.5 21.5 35 85 Fat tires 1 bat bats
8.23.15 16.8 17.1 21.9 58.5 75 V Tires 1 bat
8.24.15 6.12 13.4 22.9 27.5 90 Fat rear/V front 1 bat
8.26.15 15.5 14.8 25.2 62 87 Fat rear/V front 1 bat
8.28.15 18.3 16.9 26.2 64 88 Fat rear/V front 1 bat
8.29.15 24 15 24 90 75 Fat rear/V front rear flat deer
8.29.15 26 16 23 105 95 Fat f/r 2 bat
8.30.15 19.6 16.6 21.2 70 75 Fat f/r 1 batfrg deer2, pigs, skunk racoon, cat, frogs, fish
8.30.15 8.45 9.5 19.7 53.3 80 Fat f/r w/D Coffee Run, max sp on motor 19.4mph
9.1.15 24 16.5 23.1 87.5 80 Fat f/r 2 bat after work ride
9.2.15 13.3 17 22 35 85 Fat f/r
9.3.15 21.3 16.5 21.4 77 90 Fat f/r
9.4.15 19.2 17.4 23.2 66 75 Fat f/r Pigs, (1 in path XX), family of racoons.
9.7.15 19 17.7 21.1 64 75 Fat f/r (1 xX pig), bunnies
9.8.15 20.8 16 21.3 78 76 Fat f/r (1 xX pig), (1xx rac)
9.10.15 17.4 16.9 25.4 61 90 Fat f/r after work
9.12.15 19.4 17.1 24 68 74 Fat f/r AM ride Sat. Pigs, Owl, deer
9.13.15 23.8 17.3 20.9 82 64 Fat f/r AM ride sun. 1st cold day. Deer.
9.14.15 17.4 16.4 21 63 78 Fat f/r after work Right pedal noisy. Need new pedals.
9.15.15 22 17 23 70 76 Fat f/r
9.17.15 21.5 16 27.5 80 80 Fat f/r
TOTAL 387.17 16.1238095238095 22.8333333333333 18.3633333333333 80.6190476190476
Date Miles Avg Peak Time Temp Comments Notes 2 Notes 3
8.15.15 13.3 17.5 21.5 35 85 Fat tires 1 bat bats
8.23.15 16.8 17.1 21.9 58.5 75 V Tires 1 bat
8.24.15 6.12 13.4 22.9 27.5 90 Fat rear/V front 1 bat
8.26.15 15.5 14.8 25.2 62 87 Fat rear/V front 1 bat
8.28.15 18.3 16.9 26.2 64 88 Fat rear/V front 1 bat
8.29.15 24 15 24 90 75 Fat rear/V front rear flat deer
8.29.15 26 16 23 105 95 Fat f/r 2 bat
8.30.15 19.6 16.6 21.2 70 75 Fat f/r 1 batfrg deer2, pigs, skunk racoon, cat, frogs, fish
8.30.15 8.45 9.5 19.7 53.3 80 Fat f/r w/D Coffee Run, max sp on motor 19.4mph
9.1.15 24 16.5 23.1 87.5 80 Fat f/r 2 bat after work ride
9.2.15 13.3 17 22 35 85 Fat f/r
9.3.15 21.3 16.5 21.4 77 90 Fat f/r
9.4.15 19.2 17.4 23.2 66 75 Fat f/r Pigs, (1 in path XX), family of racoons.
9.7.15 19 17.7 21.1 64 75 Fat f/r (1 xX pig), bunnies
9.8.15 20.8 16 21.3 78 76 Fat f/r (1 xX pig), (1xx rac)
9.10.15 17.4 16.9 25.4 61 90 Fat f/r after work
9.12.15 19.4 17.1 24 68 74 Fat f/r AM ride Sat. Pigs, Owl, deer
9.13.15 23.8 17.3 20.9 82 64 Fat f/r AM ride sun. 1st cold day. Deer.
9.14.15 17.4 16.4 21 63 78 Fat f/r after work Right pedal noisy. Need new pedals.
9.15.15 22 17 23 70 76 Fat f/r
9.17.15 21.5 16 27.5 80 80 Fat f/r
TOTAL 387.17 16.1238095238095 22.8333333333333 18.3633333333333 80.6190476190476
Cody Maxie
New Member
I just bought my own Sonders narrow tire bike on kickstarter. I've really enjoyed reading this thread. My town is about 5 miles from one end to the other. I'm excited to cruise around with the upgraded battery.
one4torque
Active Member
I just installed a front wheel fat bike hub wheel/motor 350 watt.
$250 for the total wheel, motor, controller, etc.. kit......
I'm off tomorrow, so I'll be tidy-ing-up the install...... need to make some custom wheel safety clips, and custom mount the 2 controllers in the sonders box.
Then some simple wiring...... and test ride time.
The dir drive 350 watt hub motor seemed to have a much higher unloaded rpm when tested than the rear sonders 350 geared hub motor.... so hopefully I"ll get some more top end, and btw end, and all around.
More to come.
$250 for the total wheel, motor, controller, etc.. kit......
I'm off tomorrow, so I'll be tidy-ing-up the install...... need to make some custom wheel safety clips, and custom mount the 2 controllers in the sonders box.
Then some simple wiring...... and test ride time.
The dir drive 350 watt hub motor seemed to have a much higher unloaded rpm when tested than the rear sonders 350 geared hub motor.... so hopefully I"ll get some more top end, and btw end, and all around.
More to come.
one4torque
Active Member
Cody - if you have never ridden and ebike..... then you are in for a treat. I generally get a 18-20mile ride in before my family is awake.... I get up @ 5AM, and run my little route.... at that time in the AM I get to see wild havolina's, deer, skunk, racoons...... it's starting to get cool, so the rides are nice. I like to ride in the dark..... and come up on wild-life... I've got a good set of lights on the bike and helmet for spotting.
If you ride at night...... be sure to get alot of high vis tape, clothing and lights front/rear. I also bought a nice reflective back-pack cover. Cheers.
Hopefully I'll be testing the sonders 2WD tomorrow! .
If you ride at night...... be sure to get alot of high vis tape, clothing and lights front/rear. I also bought a nice reflective back-pack cover. Cheers.
Hopefully I'll be testing the sonders 2WD tomorrow! .
Cody Maxie
New Member
Looking forward to it. I'll be sure to fit it with a light and tape. I probably wont get it until January but I've got my diamondback until then. I've never ridden an electric bike.
one4torque
Active Member
Got the 2WD working this morning.. and pretty happy with the sano- install ( if I say myself).
My goal was to keep it looking like a stock sonders with the exception of the motor in the front hub
Quick ride shows 24mph no pedal, and alot more tq off btm end.
I've got batt's charging for a 20 mile test ride........
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
My goal was to keep it looking like a stock sonders with the exception of the motor in the front hub
Quick ride shows 24mph no pedal, and alot more tq off btm end.
I've got batt's charging for a 20 mile test ride........
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
jazz
Well-Known Member
@one4torque -- That is pretty sweet. So is each controller running paired with battery and hub to run independently from one another? Is there any heat issues with controller in the plastic box?
Hurley
Active Member
Got the 2WD working this morning.. and pretty happy with the sano- install ( if I say myself).
My goal was to keep it looking like a stock sonders with the exception of the motor in the front hub
Quick ride shows 24mph no pedal, and alot more tq off btm end.
I've got batt's charging for a 20 mile test ride........
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
Double the fun!!
one4torque
Active Member
Just got back from my 1st 2wd ride:
22.6 Miles
Avg 17mph
Peak MPH = 29 with pa
Peak MPH = 24 w/o pa (fresh battery)
Very happy to have at least the same range/speed as before.
When I got home I spent some add'l time 15 mins running up down grass hills, and no power loss.... so still have charge AH left after this.
I'm pleased.
Impressions:
1. tq/hp - this pulls out of the hole and mid range so much better now.. more fun.
2. I'm seeing an opt use setting in: the sonders 350watt geared rear hub for low end, getting started, then the front dir drive hub 350 watt for 20mph plus..... actually seems that above 20, the rear geared hub has no influence... so just use the throttle for the front dir motor above 20mph...... and use them both for out of the hole.
3. Warning - do not ride no handed above 26mph! LOL.... crazy harmonic with the front hub motor and the sonders forks..... will not do that again.
4. HEAT - the front dir drive controller runs cooler than the sonders rear hub controller. I might install some passive vents in the sonders box.... but we'll see.
5. The ride - bike actually rides better if that is possible.... seems more balanced and smooth now.
6. The controls.... since I did not have a left handed throttle, I just put the sonders thumb on the left.... and put the fr hub drive throttle on the right...... which actually worked out well, because above 19mph... you just use the motorcycle throttle and no input from the thumb.....
7. Brake defeat.... I just left the brake defeat hooked to the sonders. I roll off the throttle before hitting the brakes. I will eventually reseach for a way to merge the brake defeat cables to both controllers....... not sure if you run this parrellel or series. More to come.
8. I left the PA hooked to the sonders only. I thinking about adding a send pa sensor to the ring for the front.... but that will come later.
The extra 3-5mph and tq really wakes up this heavy beast.
This mod cost me $250 for the cheapo 350 front hub kit, then you will need to source a 36v 10ah frog battery for the seat post.
I may eventually get rid of the sonders and frog batteries... and put a rear rack and some better quality batteries on this. but that is $$$....... it would free up some storage space in the sonders box..... for more stuff.
Cheers,
Jeff
22.6 Miles
Avg 17mph
Peak MPH = 29 with pa
Peak MPH = 24 w/o pa (fresh battery)
Very happy to have at least the same range/speed as before.
When I got home I spent some add'l time 15 mins running up down grass hills, and no power loss.... so still have charge AH left after this.
I'm pleased.
Impressions:
1. tq/hp - this pulls out of the hole and mid range so much better now.. more fun.
2. I'm seeing an opt use setting in: the sonders 350watt geared rear hub for low end, getting started, then the front dir drive hub 350 watt for 20mph plus..... actually seems that above 20, the rear geared hub has no influence... so just use the throttle for the front dir motor above 20mph...... and use them both for out of the hole.
3. Warning - do not ride no handed above 26mph! LOL.... crazy harmonic with the front hub motor and the sonders forks..... will not do that again.
4. HEAT - the front dir drive controller runs cooler than the sonders rear hub controller. I might install some passive vents in the sonders box.... but we'll see.
5. The ride - bike actually rides better if that is possible.... seems more balanced and smooth now.
6. The controls.... since I did not have a left handed throttle, I just put the sonders thumb on the left.... and put the fr hub drive throttle on the right...... which actually worked out well, because above 19mph... you just use the motorcycle throttle and no input from the thumb.....
7. Brake defeat.... I just left the brake defeat hooked to the sonders. I roll off the throttle before hitting the brakes. I will eventually reseach for a way to merge the brake defeat cables to both controllers....... not sure if you run this parrellel or series. More to come.
8. I left the PA hooked to the sonders only. I thinking about adding a send pa sensor to the ring for the front.... but that will come later.
The extra 3-5mph and tq really wakes up this heavy beast.
This mod cost me $250 for the cheapo 350 front hub kit, then you will need to source a 36v 10ah frog battery for the seat post.
I may eventually get rid of the sonders and frog batteries... and put a rear rack and some better quality batteries on this. but that is $$$....... it would free up some storage space in the sonders box..... for more stuff.
Cheers,
Jeff
one4torque
Active Member
Jazz.. yes each system is independent: front system has hub motor, controller, and throttle, and battery.
rear system has hub motor, controller, and throttle, and battery.
The rear sonders geared hub actually does a decent job on it's own pushing the dir drive motor...... surprising.
The front motor pulls the entire bike very well.
For safety I've got a tq arm coming for the front hub. It's only 350 watts,,,,, but the little safety item is only 15$.... so cheap insurance, plus I'll have it If I upgrade too 1000watt fr/rr
rear system has hub motor, controller, and throttle, and battery.
The rear sonders geared hub actually does a decent job on it's own pushing the dir drive motor...... surprising.
The front motor pulls the entire bike very well.
For safety I've got a tq arm coming for the front hub. It's only 350 watts,,,,, but the little safety item is only 15$.... so cheap insurance, plus I'll have it If I upgrade too 1000watt fr/rr
jazz
Well-Known Member
Thanks. Yes TQ arm is always a good idea whether you think you need it or now. Cool. Didn't know if you planned on using a dual controller or not.Jazz.. yes each system is independent: front system has hub motor, controller, and throttle, and battery.
rear system has hub motor, controller, and throttle, and battery.
The rear sonders geared hub actually does a decent job on it's own pushing the dir drive motor...... surprising.
The front motor pulls the entire bike very well.
For safety I've got a tq arm coming for the front hub. It's only 350 watts,,,,, but the little safety item is only 15$.... so cheap insurance, plus I'll have it If I upgrade too 1000watt fr/rr
one4torque
Active Member
Just installed some new fenders built spec for the sonders bike... still some custom tweaking to make fit.... but much better than my last effort. These were from big-o.
I had to clearance the fenders a bit to fit.
I had to clearance the fenders a bit to fit.
one4torque
Active Member
Upgrading from 160mm front rotors to 180mm. Extra wgt of front hub motor requires the upgrade.
one4torque
Active Member
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
Update:
1. got rid of the goofy red tape in the rims.... added 3m reflective blue tape.
2. added 2wd
3. added v8 rubber
4. added big-o fenders.
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
Update:
1. got rid of the goofy red tape in the rims.... added 3m reflective blue tape.
2. added 2wd
3. added v8 rubber
4. added big-o fenders.
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
one4torque
Active Member
(Link Removed - No Longer Exists)
Changes:
1. Changed out the silly red wheel strip to reflective 3m tape in blue.
2. Changed tires to vee8's... less rolling res, better ride... and smaller dia keeps motor's in sweet spot. Non pas tops out @ 22 mph instead of 25 with stock tires.
3. Big-o fenders.
Yahoo.
Thx on the back-yard..... a pool is a MUST to survive south Texas heat/humidity. dog loves it too .
Changes:
1. Changed out the silly red wheel strip to reflective 3m tape in blue.
2. Changed tires to vee8's... less rolling res, better ride... and smaller dia keeps motor's in sweet spot. Non pas tops out @ 22 mph instead of 25 with stock tires.
3. Big-o fenders.
Yahoo.
Thx on the back-yard..... a pool is a MUST to survive south Texas heat/humidity. dog loves it too .
Similar threads
