Police - questioning the power rating of your E-bike? or Ticketing you?

[Ebiker01]

There’s a good thread here on EBR by @Ken M that gets into the depth and logical sense of the ebike laws. I’ll put the link shortly.

Very interested in opinion on the Pre-emptive Clause in HR727 defining ebikes....

Note: I also posted this poll in the forum regulations section but I think that is a less read forum on EBR so posting in general discussion as well. Please provide a poll response if you have a few minutes. This section shall supersede any State law or requirement with respect to low-speed...

electricbikereview.com

The main problem is that the people who’ve written the laws + those who signed them into Becoming the law don’t know very well how an ebike functions.

 

[Lightning 123]

I think that in the future there will be more problems with ebike laws when the numbers of them start to steadily increase and put more pressure on paths and trails that also have pedestrian
Traffic on them. Specifically the ones that can exceed 20 mph could be banned because of incidents that will probably
occur from a small percentage of people who don't use common sense.

 

[Kayakguy]

I've had a couple of encounters, one where a county Sheriff at a trailhead said "I sure hope you know the rules about e-bikes on this trail." Which I did and there was no further issue.

The others have more been situation where officers were genuinely curious about my bike and so I politely asked their questions and continued on my way.

I think where you are going to get into real trouble is if you are in an accident. Even if you are not at fault you can be one hundred percent certain that insurance isn't going to pay if they can figure out a way not to, and arguing that your e-bike was not street legal or not permitted in the location where the accident happened would be a sure-fire way to get out of paying you.

When I had my accident in mid-October (I T-boned a passing car at an intersection--totally my fault for not seeing the car, even though I had checked carefully), my auto insurance paid $10k of the hospitalization, etc. No property damage involved, to either the car or my bike. I was surprised they paid without hesitation, but not sorry. In fact, when I first reported it on my auto insurance, they said to have all bills sent directly to them (up to $10k). Other insurance, plus out of pocket, had to cover the rest.

 

[Gordon71]

For some situations it may not be an electric bike if you remove the display Or power it off. I had it powered off, you can't ticket me for anything...

As far as The Class stickers that's only for the law meaning after 2019 they require the ebikes to have stickers ; so if you bought your ebike before 2019 it doesn't need the sticker, b/c they didn't made them and it will Void the warranty on my ebike if I just put an off market not company approved sticker....

The only sticker my Rad Rover ST has is a 1 which I assume means it's the first year they made the Rover with a step through frame. It's obviously a class 2.

 

[Merle Nelson]

Out of five bikes we have only one came with a class sticker. In searching for a sticker small enough to fit a frame well I came across this person making stickers 1.5 in. by 1.5 in.

 

[kmccune]

Once when I riding my bike on the bike lane in Yellowstone national park, I was fined $150.
E-bikes are legal to ride on roads in many of the national parks but I was riding at 25mph and the ranger must have followed me for about 5 miles and then he pulled me over and asked how I was going so fast.
The whole bike lane was empty and I was trying to reach the hotel at the other end before the sunset but he did not care and nor did he understand anything about E-bikes. He thought I was on some sort of motorcycle.

Most of my other experiences have been very positive. But, sometimes you do come across people who have no clue and in unfortunate circumstances like mine, riders may have to pay some fine.

View attachment 79300

Fine looking bike.

 

[kmccune]

Dura lex sed lex was the motto of ancient Romans who first civilised Britain.

Thats what the grinning troopers tell me( no quotas, but promotions are given quicker to state coffer enlargers") as for Quote

 

[kmccune]

How is that possible?

"Diehard" LA?

 

[kmccune]

Out of five bikes we have only one came with a class sticker. In searching for a sticker small enough to fit a frame well I came across this person making stickers 1.5 in. by 1.5 in.View attachment 112803

T o paraphrase "Lil" Bush-"Its a doggone piece of plastic!"

 

[scottsdalecommuter]

T o paraphrase "Lil" Bush-"Its a doggone piece of plastic!"

I’ve never been questioned and haven’t any seen the police on the bike paths in Scottsdale, that being said, I was talking to a bike shop owner in Illinois and told him I’d be riding on the fox river valley path in west suburbs of Chicago in near future and he told me to be real careful with my ebike because he said they’ve been enforcing it there, not sure if true or rumor but good to know

 

[6zfshdb]

Out of five bikes we have only one came with a class sticker. In searching for a sticker small enough to fit a frame well I came across this person making stickers 1.5 in. by 1.5 in.View attachment 112803

It's easy enough to make your own. Download a picture, such as this one, and print it out on transparent adhesive paper.

 

[HansTrio]

I think that in the future there will be more problems with ebike laws when the numbers of them start to steadily increase and put more pressure on paths and trails that also have pedestrian
Traffic on them. Specifically the ones that can exceed 20 mph could be banned because of incidents that will probably
occur from a small percentage of people who don't use common sense.

This is exactly what happened with drones.

When only a few had them, some were flying them to 10,000 feet and posting it on YouTube.
Some were even chasing airplanes and flying them at the approach path at busy airports.

Today you are virtually limited to flying the within 20 feet of you and less than 50 feet altitude with a plethora of restrictions on even that.
Oh, and you must Federally REGISTER, pay a fee and then attach your registration number to the drone.

Rest assured, some JA will post his ebike "outrunning" cars on the highway for the world to see and this is how a global crackdown on ebikes will occur.

 

[john peck]

Thats what the grinning troopers tell me( no quotas, but promotions are given quicker to state coffer enlargers") as for Quote

Cops here are very well paid out of gas tax to do next to nothing, but that´s fine cuz there´s next to
no crime here, maybe the occasional petty theft or a cat stuck in a tree. They must be bored to tears.
My one horse dorp makes Mayberry look like Chicago in the 20s. Cops here all know my bike & wave.
One did tap his brake to get a better look at my gas bike once. I almost never see state troopers on
the nearby highways. Everyone drives 5 to 10 miles over the limit. I think cops just answer calls
these days. I keep the gas bike within federal standards......sorta.

 

[retiredNH]

This is exactly what happened with drones.

When only a few had them, some were flying them to 10,000 feet and posting it on YouTube.
Some were even chasing airplanes and flying them at the approach path at busy airports.

Today you are virtually limited to flying the within 20 feet of you and less than 50 feet altitude with a plethora of restrictions on even that.
Oh, and you must Federally REGISTER, pay a fee and then attach your registration number to the drone.

Rest assured, some JA will post his ebike "outrunning" cars on the highway for the world to see and this is how a global crackdown on ebikes will occur.

A little bit of exaggeration? As a drone flyer, I'd say so...but it's true that all it takes is a few show offs for any activity to bring the rules down on the rest of us. With ebikes, a big part of the problem is speeding on bike paths. OTOH, bike paths are their own problem, at least in urban areas, aren't they? But *some* ebikes are unique in their ability to call attention to themselves, especially the fat tire ebikes that look (and sometimes drive?) more like motor scooters than bikes. People operating in throttle only mode also tend to be a bit more threatening to the non-motorized crowd, IMHO. After all, they're clearly different from regular bikes in that they don't need to be pedaled.

 

[Gordon71]

A little bit of exaggeration? As a drone flyer, I'd say so...but it's true that all it takes is a few show offs for any activity to bring the rules down on the rest of us. With ebikes, a big part of the problem is speeding on bike paths. OTOH, bike paths are their own problem, at least in urban areas, aren't they? But *some* ebikes are unique in their ability to call attention to themselves, especially the fat tire ebikes that look (and sometimes drive?) more like motor scooters than bikes. People operating in throttle only mode also tend to be a bit more threatening to the non-motorized crowd, IMHO. After all, they're clearly different from regular bikes in that they don't need to be pedaled.

It's the speed of class 3 and the throttle of class 2 that accounts for them banned on the trails where I ride. It's why I have to stop and unplug the throttle on my class 2 before I venture onto the trail.

 

[6zfshdb]

It's the speed of class 3 and the throttle of class 2 that accounts for them banned on the trails where I ride. It's why I have to stop and unplug the throttle on my class 2 before I venture onto the trail.

It's best to check with the rangers or local enforcement before trying this. In some areas, including some National Parks, Class 2 bikes are banned even with the throttle disabled. If your bike has a class 2 label, I would cover or remove it . That way you could always plead ignorance if someone questions you.

My bike is a class 2 but did not have a sticker put on at the factory. I also disconnect the throttle when riding on class 1 only trails. I was questioned by a park ranger on the Pine Creek Trail in PA. last summer when he saw the throttle. I showed him that it was disconnected but he said it didn't matter. He told me they get riders who simply reconnect the throttles when they are alone. He also had a list of bikes and their respective classes on his smartphone. He showed me that my bike was a class 2 and even though it wasn't labeled, it was illegal on the trail. He was nice enough about it though and didn't cite me.

This is probably not a common occurrence but it's something to be aware of. It's only happened to me once on the many, many miles I've logged on Class 1 trails.

 

[Gordon71]

It's best to check with the rangers or local enforcement before trying this. In some areas, including some National Parks, Class 2 bikes are banned even with the throttle disabled. If your bike has a class 2 label, I would cover or remove it . That way you could always plead ignorance if someone questions you.

My bike is a class 2 but did not have a sticker put on at the factory. I also disconnect the throttle when riding on class 1 only trails. I was questioned by a park ranger on the Pine Creek Trail in PA. last summer when he saw the throttle. I showed him that it was disconnected but he said it didn't matter. He told me they get riders who simply reconnect the throttles when they are alone. He also had a list of bikes and their respective classes on his smartphone. He showed me that my bike was a class 2 and even though it wasn't labeled, it was illegal on the trail. He was nice enough about it though and didn't cite me.

This is probably not a common occurrence but it's something to be aware of. It's only happened to me once on the many, many miles I've logged on Class 1 trails.

I did ask. These trails are fairly new and I bought my bike in the beginning of covid so for the first year there was no one to ask as the campgrounds were closed. Last Sumer they were open so I stopped in and told the ranger my bike has a throttle but I unplug it before riding the trail and she said that was fine.

 

[Ken M]

I understand that trail managers think that there is really a difference between a Class 1 and Class 2 bike on trails but if they understood the physics of power then would understand that a rider pedaling a Class 1 ebike is putting more power down (ie more like to move a few more grains of dirt) than a Class 2 rider not pedaling at all. I think it's fair to expect the tax payer workers have to actually critically think before running around banning class 2 ebikes from their trails as they return to watching the next episode of Duck Dynasty.

 

[Ken M]

It's best to check with the rangers or local enforcement before trying this. In some areas, including some National Parks, Class 2 bikes are banned even with the throttle disabled. If your bike has a class 2 label, I would cover or remove it . That way you could always plead ignorance if someone questions you.

My bike is a class 2 but did not have a sticker put on at the factory. I also disconnect the throttle when riding on class 1 only trails. I was questioned by a park ranger on the Pine Creek Trail in PA. last summer when he saw the throttle. I showed him that it was disconnected but he said it didn't matter. He told me they get riders who simply reconnect the throttles when they are alone. He also had a list of bikes and their respective classes on his smartphone. He showed me that my bike was a class 2 and even though it wasn't labeled, it was illegal on the trail. He was nice enough about it though and didn't cite me.

This is probably not a common occurrence but it's something to be aware of. It's only happened to me once on the many, many miles I've logged on Class 1 trails.

I think it's funny that we are seeing more and more "multi-mode" ebikes where a rider at the touch of a button can switch classes. I predicted this the first time I read the 3-class system being promoted by People for Bikes because they were given lobby money to do so. It really wasn't much to ask that someone in that room that day would have questioned the idea of enforcement by stickers.

Note: I do kind of tease People for Bikes occasionally because I want just one time for someone there to stand up and defend 3-class on an EBR forum. Why was it considered an improvement vs HR727 that defined an LSEB as just bike???

 

[retiredNH]

Ah. People for Bikes. They're essentially an industry lobbying group in drag. From their website: "The PeopleForBikes Coalition and Foundation boards of directors as well as the BPSA Trade Association Committee members include executives from leading companies in the U.S. bicycle industry. Their collective experience and commitment to better bicycling guide the PeopleForBikes vision. " Their board includes a good number of major US manufacturers, distributors and retailers. Didn't see anyone from a group that represents riders, though. To me, this helps explain the disconnect between what PFB pushes and what we riders actually want.

IOW, they're not out for our benefit...