Pinion Motor.Gearbox.Unit (MGU)

[Deacon Blues]

This Pinion/motor combo makes a lot of sense. Motorcycles have combined transmissions and engines together for many, many years, with excellent reliability. It's about time that ebikes did the same.
I try to avoid new models of anything, so I wouldn't consider a new ebike with this combo for at least a year or two, so they could work the bugs out.

 

[fooferdoggie]

This Pinion/motor combo makes a lot of sense. Motorcycles have combined transmissions and engines together for many, many years, with excellent reliability. It's about time that ebikes did the same.
I try to avoid new models of anything, so I wouldn't consider a new ebike with this combo for at least a year or two, so they could work the bugs out.

it will take more then a year or two to even know knowing one will last let alone if the design is good. it would beard to test it to say 20,000 miles in two years.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Motorcycles have combined transmissions and engines together for many, many years, with excellent reliability.

Motorcycles weigh 10 times more than e-bikes.

 

[Gionnirocket]

Motorcycles weigh 10 times more than e-bikes.

Not true in many cases but irrelevant in all

https://www.jdpower.com/motorcycles/shopping-guides/how-much-does-a-motorcycle-weigh#:~:text=Some%20dirt%20bikes%20have%20engines,trips%20and%20are%20less%20common.

 

[Deacon Blues]

Motorcycles weigh 10 times more than e-bikes.

Stefan, what does this have to do with the overall concept?

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Stefan, what does this have to do with the overall concept?

E-Bike components must be lightweight. Whatever has worked in motorbikes might not necessarily prove itself in ebikes. No one has tested the novelty combination of the Pinion with a powerful e-bike motor in the long run. And, eh, the electronic gremlins that seem to infest most of e-bike systems?

Question: Do electric motorcycles have any gearbox?

 

[mschwett]

E-Bike components must be lightweight. Whatever has worked in motorbikes might not necessarily prove itself in ebikes. No one has tested the novelty combination of the Pinion with a powerful e-bike motor in the long run. And, eh, the electronic gremlins that seem to infest most of e-bike systems?

Question: Do electric motorcycles have any gearbox?

some do, mostly ones meant to go very, very, very fast.

there is zero doubt that such components (gearbox, belt, etc) could be designed and manufactured to withstand any force an e-bike rider and motor would subject it to. the question is, how light and affordable would such a thing be and will pinion (or others!) do it correctly….

 

[Gionnirocket]

E-Bike components must be lightweight. Whatever has worked in motorbikes might not necessarily prove itself in ebikes. No one has tested the novelty combination of the Pinion with a powerful e-bike motor in the long run. And, eh, the electronic gremlins that seem to infest most of e-bike systems?

Question: Do electric motorcycles have any gearbox?

A gear box becomes necessary on a bicycle as the human input needs to be amplified in order to be sustainable and enjoyable for the various riding scenarios
Curious if your resistance to new technology is based on that fact that you've spent all the insurance money and can't afford any advancements making your future relevance... well irrelevant.

 

[scrambler]

On an electric bike, the motorization only needs gears if the motor power is limited. When you have enough power, you can drive the back wheel with a single gear ratio at any speed and on all terrain.

BUT if you are going to pedal the bike then you need gears to maintain a comfortable pedaling cadence at all speeds and on all terrains.

On low power e-bikes (roughly under 1500W) you normally have a single drivetrain that does both pedaling and motorization, so both share the same gears, which both help the motor and allow a comfortable pedaling cadence across all terrains and speeds.

On high power bikes (e-motorcycles), you have a single drivetrain for the motorization, and with enough power, there is no need for multiple gears, just a single gear ratio.

On mid power e-bikes (2kw-10kw) that also offer pedaling, you ideally find a dual drivetrain, one for the motorization with a single gear ratio, and one for the pedaling with traditional gear range for pedaling. This allows for simpler motors, easy throttle mode, and protects the pedaling gear system from the high power of the motor.

One last remark, combined motor an gears do not introduce any new technology. All of what is used in them has been done for decades and fully tested. The only thing new about them is the desire for them, which emerged from the use of E-bikes. This is why I am not worried about the technology itself, but only by its adoption, which is required for its ongoing availability and development.

 

[Stefan Mikes]

Now, Rotwild showed RX 1000 e-MTB with Pinion MGU E1.12 and a 960 Wh battery (Eurobike Fair). Guess what Rotwild used for transmission of the power to the rear wheel

Anyone?

 

[mschwett]

there are nine e-bikes already shown with the MGU. most but not all use belts. when you remove the need for moving the thing back and forth across the cogs most will choose a belt.

simplon:

flyer:

 

[Gionnirocket]

Now, Rotwild showed RX 1000 e-MTB with Pinion MGU E1.12 and a 960 Wh battery (Eurobike Fair). Guess what Rotwild used for transmission of the power to the rear wheel

Anyone?

A kielbasa carved into a screw?
Curious are you going to keep changing the argument reasoning until you bore everyone to the point of not replying further and you can claim victory?

 

[Art Deco]

Get into a time machine and transport yourself back 15 years.
Now change the question below to "Why would I ever need an ebike instead of a bicycle?" and read the answer:

Get back in the time machine and transport yourself back 100 years. Now change the question to "Why would I ever need a derailleur instead of a fixed gear?"

Some ideas take a while to catch on ...

 

[Gionnirocket]

Some ideas take a while to catch on ...

Looks like a locomotive style connecting rod to drive the rear wheel. Looks like chains and belts are both out!

 

[Rás Cnoic]

Now, Rotwild showed RX 1000 e-MTB with Pinion MGU E1.12 and a 960 Wh battery (Eurobike Fair). Guess what Rotwild used for transmission of the power to the rear wheel

Anyone?

It's a nice bike that Rotwild. But sadly it didn't win the Gold Award at Eurobike.

This one did:

 

[Stefan Mikes]

This one did:

I would have to read a report from someone who has actually crossed Pamir with that e-bike

 

[Explorer-1]

Tested on the RotWild RX1000 in Austria

 

[Johnny]

Tested on the RotWild RX1000 in Austria

Finally something different and it seems great and that is only a test bike.

 

[Kayakguy]

Rohloff was great until they delivered their R14 for e-bikes. Pinion has just built their two early motor prototypes. They even do not own the battery or display! Who makes and owns the controller?

We all might be riding e-bikes with motors similar to MGU in a few years, or, we could be laughing at how naieve we had been. I simply do not believe in "revolutionary inventions" when it comes to e-bikes. Pinion is a company of a certain size. Now fancy the Big Three all want the MGU. Will Pinion grow to the size they could deliver as many systems as to satisfy the OEM demand? What quality control issues are expected in the future?

I am not overly enthusiastic. It is the time that has to pass to prove or bust the new patent. What if Pinion goes belly down? Haven't we had so many fantastic systems such as Bionx or Continental? Now, everybody is delighted with Pinion MGU. I need to hear a user experience report first to get carried away. Note: I was very slow with buying a Vado SL and only decided to buy after I heard no negative reports and could try the e-bike myself.

Now, no-one here has even touched an MGU e-bike. Did they mention the battery size? What is the motor peak power?

Not "belly down" but "belly up." I think it comes from the fact that when your goldfish dies, it will float belly up. (Sorry--long time English teacher here).

 

[TrevorB]

Motorbikes have had integrated gearsboxes for over 100 years, is about time ebikes did same. This is future of ebikes and will be my next upgrade in few years. Wont be sad see back of chain maintenance.