Ok: 'Fess up.

[pmcdonald]

What gets my goat is this was so avoidable.

In Australia there seems to be an overwhelming support for the government's response. They acted hard and fast, implementing some of the toughest restrictions in the world. These were accepted largely without protest by the public (there were some small, scattered protests).

It was pretty grim a few months back, particularly in Melbourne where they had a second wave. The response has largely been effective, supported no doubt by our location in the world.

Now you wouldn't know we lived through a pandemic. You barely see a mask anywhere. Shopping centres are full, as are gyms, sports facilities, pubs, schools. Social distancing is practiced, but it's down to 2 square meters per person. Testing is still encouraged and mandated in some areas. Less progressive workplaces are back face to face. I haven't done a Zoom meeting in weeks.

I was able to see my 104 year old grandfather the other week. He was fortunate to survive the Spanish flu as a toddler. His attitude is very laissez-faire this time round, but fortunately the systems in place around him have kept him safe so far.

That's what I don't understand about many of the western responses. Half measures, underfunded public health institutions, porous borders and an eroded faith in good governance and science all conspire to drag this misery out way beyond that of a swift, effective, unified and multipronged response.

Those leaders aren't doing anyone any favours by trying to go soft on the economy or liberties - they're just baking in a long, bleak series of months until the vaccines can be distributed in sufficient numbers to take effect.

 

[voidedwarranty]

What gets my goat is this was so avoidable.

In Australia there seems to be an overwhelming support for the government's response. They acted hard and fast, implementing some of the toughest restrictions in the world. These were accepted largely without protest by the public (there were some small, scattered protests).

It was pretty grim a few months back, particularly in Melbourne where they had a second wave. The response has largely been effective, supported no doubt by our location in the world.

Now you wouldn't know we lived through a pandemic. You barely see a mask anywhere. Shopping centres are full, as are gyms, sports facilities, pubs, schools. Social distancing is practiced, but it's down to 2 square meters per person. Testing is still encouraged and mandated in some areas. Less progressive workplaces are back face to face. I haven't done a Zoom meeting in weeks.

I was able to see my 104 year old grandfather the other week. He was fortunate to survive the Spanish flu as a toddler. His attitude is very laissez-faire this time round, but fortunately the systems in place around him have kept him safe so far.

That's what I don't understand about many of the western responses. Half measures, underfunded public health institutions, porous borders and an eroded faith in good governance and science all conspire to drag this misery out way beyond that of a swift, effective, unified and multipronged response.

Those leaders aren't doing anyone any favours by trying to go soft on the economy or liberties - they're just baking in a long, bleak series of months until the vaccines can be distributed in sufficient numbers to take effect.

Is Australia hiring? Is it legally acceptable to burn your house down if there is a spider the size of a small dog? Like some kind of spider insurance?

I'm not saying I'm afraid of spiders but the world has a perfectly acceptable limit on the reasonable size a spider can be and Australia has not gotten that memo.

 

[pmcdonald]

Is Australia hiring? Is it legally acceptable to burn your house down if there is a spider the size of a small dog? Like some kind of spider insurance?

I'm not saying I'm afraid of spiders but the world has a perfectly acceptable limit on the reasonable size a spider can be and Australia has not gotten that memo.

1) Very possibly if you don't mind a 2 week quarantine on entry. Two quick citizenship questions first: how quickly can you skin a kangaroo, and sing the second verse of our national anthem. (One of those is a trick question.) Our immigration is way down this year, and it's an important economic driver. Actually, I quite like the US so perhaps we can arrange a deal, one in, one out swapsies?

2) In Australia it's in fact a legal responsibility to raze your house to the ground when any of the following are encountered indoors: great white shark, king or regular brown snake, funnel web spider, taipan, bull shark, mako shark, hammerhead shark, tiger shark, tiger snake, cassowary, red back spider, blue-ringed octopus, fear snake, saltwater crocodile, stone fish, empty beer fridge. As a result we Australians tend to build new houses every few years. Still, the beaches are nice.

 

[BarryS]

Saying a lot of different things does not mean that any one of them is any good or even relevant. There are so many flawed and willfully ignorant assumptions in your text that I can't really even help you make it right.

Diseases spread stochastically because there is an element of random chance on who catches a disease and who spreads it. If a disease is relatively easy to spread during certain activities (e.g. if a group gathers indoors) it might not spread if such activities are less common during certain times of the year, than rapidly spread when such activities are more common. If you look at the ebb and flow of cases across the United States, it becomes clear that groups gathering indoors are a strong driver: cases exploded in colder northern states when the weather got cooler, at the same time along the Gulf Coast case growth slowed down because the cooler weather let people dine and drink outside.

By your "math" 44 million people have died in the United States since March 1st. I think you are gravely in error. For the record covid-19 is now the number one cause of death in the United States. Good luck pretending otherwise.

LOL SEE This is why there's not honest debate .Covid isn't the number 1 cause of death in the US . Maybe in Victims over 80 because Democrat Governors intentionally threw sick people into Nursing homes causing the death of many elderly . Plus look how you intentionally imply I'm wrong because my facts are wrong . You left out 2000 deaths per day from Covid . How can that be in the USA alone ? Everyone knows 2000/daily C-19 deaths is Global. So was that an error by you or intentional ? WHich is what we see with fact manipulators
If what you claim is True . Then Churches should be seeing massive cases . Ironically 2 churches I know of with 7000 or more attending 3 times a week . Sitting side by side . HAVE NO CASES . Why?
Also we were told 2 weeks to curb the out-break they were telling us would be massive that NEVER Arrived . We were also told that The younger you were the better chance you had for being symptom free. But we needed to be exposed for crowd immunity.
Today we know the infection -to death ratio is 99 to less then 1 . Plus we also know age isn't as much of a factor as general health .
The Lockdowns have proven to be far far far worse then catching the virus . When did we become a society that is afraid to live . You can't delay your own death . It is an appointed time .

Worry never solves anything . Worry is not only a waste of time . It also causes health issues in most people .

Nobody is saying don't be careful . Just practical .

 

[BarryS]

1) Very possibly if you don't mind a 2 week quarantine on entry. Two quick citizenship questions first: how quickly can you skin a kangaroo, and sing the second verse of our national anthem. (One of those is a trick question.) Our immigration is way down this year, and it's an important economic driver. Actually, I quite like the US so perhaps we can arrange a deal, one in, one out swapsies?

2) In Australia it's in fact a legal responsibility to raze your house to the ground when any of the following are encountered indoors: great white shark, king or regular brown snake, funnel web spider, taipan, bull shark, mako shark, hammerhead shark, tiger shark, tiger snake, cassowary, red back spider, blue-ringed octopus, fear snake, saltwater crocodile, stone fish, empty beer fridge. As a result we Australians tend to build new houses every few years. Still, the beaches are nice.

I have no problem if you want to burn down your own house. What I do have a problem with is you wanting me to because you did . Just generalizing an example

 

[BarryS]

Here's a copy of a few paragraphs from an article about a county in KA I just read:

As of Thursday, coronavirus has killed a higher percentage of Gove County residents than any other county in the United States: One out of every 132 people has died.

Their intertwined stories illuminate the toll the pandemic has taken on communities across the country as emotional debates over how to control the infection have unfolded amid mounting losses.

Even today, mask-wearing remains controversial in Gove County, and friendships are being strained as authorities struggle to persuade their neighbors to follow basic public health guidelines, such as avoiding large gatherings.

President Donald Trump won the county with 88% of the vote in November, and many of the residents, including the farmers who raise up corn and sorghum, are deeply skeptical of government and public health orders, often echoing the language Trump has used about mask-wearing and the pandemic's severity.

1 out of 132 ? that's .0075% . That's a community hit hard ? And we shut down the whole country for this? The article is dishonest . It gives you the figure correctly . Yet tells you this is a catastrophic issue in the community . Then plays it off that they are Trump Voters ?? Can't you see how they manipulated how they phrased things ?

No death is good . But come on : THE ODDS of dying when you get behind the wheel of you car is 1 out of 103 LOL . THINK

 

[Gordon71]

LOL SEE This is why there's not honest debate .Covid isn't the number 1 cause of death in the US . Maybe in Victims over 80 because Democrat Governors intentionally threw sick people into Nursing homes causing the death of many elderly . Plus look how you intentionally imply I'm wrong because my facts are wrong . You left out 2000 deaths per day from Covid . How can that be in the USA alone ? Everyone knows 2000/daily C-19 deaths is Global. So was that an error by you or intentional ? WHich is what we see with fact manipulators
If what you claim is True . Then Churches should be seeing massive cases . Ironically 2 churches I know of with 7000 or more attending 3 times a week . Sitting side by side . HAVE NO CASES . Why?
Also we were told 2 weeks to curb the out-break they were telling us would be massive that NEVER Arrived . We were also told that The younger you were the better chance you had for being symptom free. But we needed to be exposed for crowd immunity.
Today we know the infection -to death ratio is 99 to less then 1 . Plus we also know age isn't as much of a factor as general health .
The Lockdowns have proven to be far far far worse then catching the virus . When did we become a society that is afraid to live . You can't delay your own death . It is an appointed time .

Worry never solves anything . Worry is not only a waste of time . It also causes health issues in most people .

Nobody is saying don't be careful . Just practical .

In the last 4 days IN THE USA we've had two days where there were over 3,000 AMERICANS killed by covid,1 day with over 2500 and one day almost 2500. Churches ARE seeing massive cases.

 

[Gordon71]

1 out of 132 ? that's .0075% . That's a community hit hard ? And we shut down the whole country for this? The article is dishonest . It gives you the figure correctly . Yet tells you this is a catastrophic issue in the community . Then plays it off that they are Trump Voters ?? Can't you see how they manipulated how they phrased things ?

No death is good . But come on : THE ODDS of dying when you get behind the wheel of you car is 1 out of 103 LOL . THINK

I do think and if those figures are accurate and applied to the rest of the country we would have over 2.5 million dead Americans from covid. Luckily most Americans are smarter than the folks in that county and tend to listen to the science over the fools which is why we only have 300,000 dead Americans from covid which is still a lot higher than it had to be.

 

[voidedwarranty]

1 out of 132 ? that's .0075% . That's a community hit hard ? And we shut down the whole country for this? The article is dishonest . It gives you the figure correctly . Yet tells you this is a catastrophic issue in the community . Then plays it off that they are Trump Voters ?? Can't you see how they manipulated how they phrased things ?

No death is good . But come on : THE ODDS of dying when you get behind the wheel of you car is 1 out of 103 LOL . THINK

Math is hard. And yours is incomplete. 1 of 132 is 0.7%

 

[voidedwarranty]

1 out of 132 ? that's .0075% . That's a community hit hard ? And we shut down the whole country for this? The article is dishonest . It gives you the figure correctly . Yet tells you this is a catastrophic issue in the community . Then plays it off that they are Trump Voters ?? Can't you see how they manipulated how they phrased things ?

No death is good . But come on : THE ODDS of dying when you get behind the wheel of you car is 1 out of 103 LOL . THINK

I wonder what the odds of dying behind the wheel in a car were before seatbelts became a law.

I assume you do wear a seatbelt.

I also assume you wear your helmet when your ride your bike. How much does that decrease your chances of dying in a bike accident? A lot I'd guess.

Why would wearing a mask be any different.

It was never and should never be political.
Your lord a savior Trump made it political.

 

[Gordon71]

"THE ODDS of dying when you get behind the wheel of you car is 1 out of 103 LOL . THINK"
I should have added that is totally wrong. It may be the odds of dying IF you get in an accident but not every time you get in a car.