Newbie looking for an Ebike

[Browneye]

Looks like Juiced is setting the industry on fire.
Rad Power is as well. And there are some other good names out there if you are willing to do your own troubleshooting and maintenance. Like Aventon, although you might find a local dealer selling them, there's Magnum, Haibike, and I just found another one called VoltBike.

I was where you're at a month ago...picking up my Giant Explore+ today.
The Yamaha drive system sold me. Plus Giant builds a really nice bike, lots of upgraded components, hardware, etc.

 

[Lord Polymath]

Looks like Juiced is setting the industry on fire.
Rad Power is as well. And there are some other good names out there if you are willing to do your own troubleshooting and maintenance. Like Aventon, although you might find a local dealer selling them, there's Magnum, Haibike, and I just found another one called VoltBike.

I was where you're at a month ago...picking up my Giant Explore+ today.
The Yamaha drive system sold me. Plus Giant builds a really nice bike, lots of upgraded components, hardware, etc.

Congrats on the new bike! Closest Giant dealer to me is 2 hours away, but I’d still like to try them out.

 

[Browneye]

IMO the sub-$2000 price point will be what sells the most units. It's a matter of capturing enough innovation to get people to make a move - those will be the most popular ebikes.

The way Juice is doing their crowd-funding thing to build new models is pretty innovative - they'll actually sell out some models before they even build them. Now that is capturing future dollars today.

 

[Browneye]

Yeah the Scorpion is tempting at those early bird prices.

As far as just having a 'fun bike' for tootling around under power, I think these and the plain radpower are the kind of bikes that are really going to catch on. I'm tempted to get one just for the fun of it. I rode motorcycles for nearly 50 years, this looks like the closest thing - STAY OFF THE CLASS 1 BIKE PATHS.

 

[Deleted member 4210]

The way Juice is doing their crowd-funding thing to build new models is pretty innovative.

Except CF can be a costly trap. The price has to be Significantly lower than eventual sell price. But then you have next to no margin, you've spent huge gobs of time and capital, and then sales drop way off after the CF. Then you have to make up something new again. It's intoxicating to get all those initial orders, but hardly a sustainable business model. Other ebike brands are now attempting it, that were previously not doing it. They believe there is then sustainable demand. The price is the primary sell point, but when everyone else has that 'feature' your product is out of sight, out of mind. Newbies move on to the next latest thing. The OEM is then left with more new part numbers, and soon drops carrying those parts and the consumer gets left high and dry a mere 2 years down the road. What appliance manufacturer would not want a 2 year obsolescence cycle ? Get consumers to Buy a new ebike every two years ? The model has been there done that, long before crowdfunding came along, and every manufacturer has failed attempting it. The oem who attempts to use indiegogo repeatedly won't last. History of business has proven it time and again, in many prior manifestations of CF.

 

[Browneye]

I don't know about that. Do you have actual stats or are you just estimating based on your own opinion.
I personally, would not want to spend too much money on ebike (that's why I own Juiced, if you're wondering).

But surprising number of people are willing to spend good amount of money.
Pedego is one of the most popular ebike-specific brand in the US, their bikes are well over $2,000.
Giant's ebike sales is soaring and expected to go up to 600,000 units for 2020.

In my mind, I can't believe people are actually buying R&M, but those ebikes SELL!
If you go to Europe, there's bunch of Bosch powered ebikes, and they're quite popular. Some are Chinese bikes, but many are brand name ebikes.

JMHO
Good points. I don't think I'm the average buyer though, maybe so. Still, I thought $2500 was quite a lot to spend for any bike. Have you looked lately at what you can get for a third of that as a pedal bike?

There are 22 million people here, I'll bet half of them have a bike. LOL

 

[Browneye]

Yeah because we tend to think ebike = bicycle.

If you're spending $2,000 on a bicycle, yeah that's pretty expensive.
For an ebike? No.

But we do NOT think bicycle = motorcycle.

If you're spending $5,000 for a motorcycle, I don't think anyone would feel like they have spent too much money, because it's a motorcycle.
Even if it's $10,000, it's not that bad, and some are willing to spend well over $20,000 if it's a Ducati or Harley-Davidson.

But ebike still is a bicycle in many ways.
So when you get a $2,500 ebike, people would go like "You spent $2,500 on a bicycle???"

But in reality, it's not rare to see $4,000+ ebikes if it's a good one like Trek, Specialized, Giant, etc.

My point is, people are very clear that bicycle is not a motorcycle. But people still think ebikes are just bicycles and prices should be similar to bicycles.
Which is not possible, while you can buy a bicycle for $98, if you want to get an ebike from Walmart, it's $598.

Agreed.
I put up nearly $23K for a BMW R1200GS. Best motorcycle I ever owned - out of a couple of dozen of them.

Where are them haibike things now...

 

[Lord Polymath]

Now I'm debating the Juiced crosscurrent s2. So many choices!

 

[Browneye]

I was looking over the specs on that one yesterday - liked it a lot. It's very much like my Giant Explore - I'm picking it up today. I had not seen it 'till after I bought my Giant. If I had I might have gone that way, especially for the price point. They charge $150 to ship, right? It's still a bargain.

The problem with the RadPower City IMO is that it has a direct-drive hub. I have not tested it, but ridden a few of the geared Bafang hubs and they are really great.

The S2 is their latest and greatest, with the biggest Bafang hub-drive, new torque sensor AND pedal sensor, and the bigger 52v battery. It's really a 'comfort' cross bike oriented for road-going, but with a suspension fork. Pluses are Altus derailleur, hydraulic discs, 700c wheels, torque sensing controller, looks to be all upgraded components.

Too bad you can't test ride one. Based on the specs, had I not fell in love with the Yamaha mid-drive on the Giant, I would take this one in a heartbeat. It beats out everything else I'v looked at for the money.

Keep in mind you won't have a local bike shop to support you with it, should it need to be worked on. Well, unless you're in San Diego. LOL

For me, a comfort cross bike on 700c wheels is my go-to. I've had a Trek FX, and the Specialized Crossroad Elite - both are just outstanding crossbikes. Easy pedaling, fast enough, comfortable more upright position than a drop-bar road bike, can do hardpack dirt trails in a pinch, are lightweight, and very fun. My Trek has 35-38 mm tires, the Crossroads 45's. I would really like a 50mm tire for an ebike, but likely you could add them if you wanted, would probly fit. They soak up bumps better, but are also a drag if you have to pedal. That's why we're going electric drive, right??

Have you watched any of their vids? I looked at some of what they had last night, thought they were really impressive the way they've developed their product and production processes.

 

[Lord Polymath]

Yeah the CCS2 is very cool. Haven't found a review video for it yet though, I guess it is too new. I've watched a ton of the Juiced videos, Tora seems like a super intelligent and good guy. Oh and shipping is free on orders over $99!

 

[Browneye]

Written review:

Juiced Bikes launches 33 mph electric bicycle for just $1,799

Juiced Bikes has just announced the latest edition to its already sprawling electric bicycle lineup: The 52V CrossCurrent S2. And...

electrek.co

The previous model - should give you a real good idea of what you're getting, and the new one will be even better:

ZDNet review:

Juiced Bikes CrossCurrent X electric bike review: The complete commuter experience

Electric bikes are a fun method of commuting to work and there are some affordable options. After a month with the CrossCurrent X, it is clear that Juiced Bikes offers a complete commuter experience at less than $2,500.

www.zdnet.com

Well gee, you can google it. LOL

Yeah, I was impressed with their business model. They seem to enjoy good enthusiasm and support from their customers as well.

 

[harryS]

What I dislike about crowd funding is the long waiting period. I suppose one could wait one winter for something, but once riding season arrives, it's time to ride.

 

[Lord Polymath]

What I dislike about crowd funding is the long waiting period. I suppose one could wait one winter for something, but once riding season arrives, it's time to ride.

Very true, and the waiting period for the Scorpion being during the winter is one reason I'm even considering such a wait. Having said that, it says shipping "March 2020" which means it will probably be late March as a best case scenario. I wouldn't be surprised if it is actually at doorsteps in late April or even in May. Just too long to wait.

 

[Browneye]

Very true, and the waiting period for the Scorpion being during the winter is one reason I'm even considering such a wait. Having said that, it says shipping "March 2020" which means it will probably be late March as a best case scenario. I wouldn't be surprised if it is actually at doorsteps in late April or even in May. Just too long to wait.

Rad Mini Step thru...in stock.

 

[steve mercier]

I might be a bit of an outlier here, but I wouldn’t have bought an ebike if they didn’t make them in Class 3 mode. Before I bought my Class 3 gravel bike, I took a 25 mile ride on a friend’s Cannondale Synapse NEO.

That was a beautiful bike— drop bars, Apex groupset, integrated battery... but, alas, it was speed limited to 20 mph. Whenever I hit that wall (which seemed like five times a minute), it seemed like I was hitting an invisible force field whose purpose was to impede my progress.

Now, I don’t always trundle along at 28mph, but I’m often pedaling at 22 or 24 mph, and it’s so much nicer to have the motor able and willing in that zone.

For the life of me, I don’t understand how anyone can be content with a Class 1 bike. I know: different strokes for different folks, but why impose a draconian speed limit on yourself? Would you buy a car, no matter how sexy, if was governed to 55 mph?

That is why we have Bikespeed delimiters.

 

[e-boy]

Take a look at the Giant Explore e+ 4 .
I'm 5'9" with a 29" inseam and the Medium fits me well .

https://electricbikereview.com/giant/explore-e-plus-4-gts/

 

[Over50]

So when you get a $2,500 ebike, people would go like "You spent $2,500 on a bicycle???"

But in reality, it's not rare to see $4,000+ ebikes if it's a good one like Trek, Specialized, Giant, etc.

Its not rare to see regular bikes over $2500 or $4000 for that matter. Just spec a good touring bike. The folks that express that disbelief on hearing about the money spent on an e-bike usually know little about bikes in general (that's been my experience). Furthermore, they apply their own set of priorities when judging someone else's expenditures (hence the comment I always receive of "I could buy a car for that"). Which is similar to the thought I always have when I see someone driving a high-end luxury vehicle "I could buy a good car for half that amount of money and spend the difference on bicycles".

 

[Lord Polymath]

Rad Mini Step thru...in stock.

Now you've got me thinking how cool it would be to have a folding bike!

 

[Browneye]

Now you've got me thinking how cool it would be to have a folding bike!

Just know they're rather heavy. So lifting them into any kind of storage compartment or car trunk is going to be a feat unless you're Charles Atlas. My limit is about 45lbs with my bad back. 75lbs would be a non-starter for me.

I picked up my Giant Explore yesterday, we haul bikes in our Colorado pickup - it was pretty easy to lift the front wheel to the tailgate, then the rear up and into the bed. But then this new bike is just 50 pounds.

Also for a folder - unless your lift-over height is really low for a car trunk or wagon, you have to clear the bumper and feed it in without scraping the crap out of your vehicle.

Like I say, if I had a Cessna, or a Winnebago, or a mega-yacht, a folder would be a great option. I would take a Rad-Min just cuz they're compact, low to the ground, and more like a scooter, just for powered wheel fun. But surely some will actually fold them for storage and transport as well.

 

[ElevenAD]

What I dislike about crowd funding is the long waiting period. I suppose one could wait one winter for something, but once riding season arrives, it's time to ride.

that time will fly by, $2000 hyper is well worth that kind of wait imo!

Now I'm debating the Juiced crosscurrent s2. So many choices!

this is the x but still basically the same bike,this video really shows what the CC can do