More Rad lawsuit fallout? (good for the consumer)

[Dorkyman]

Changing company policy right after a major lawsuit implies that, yeah, we were wrong but now we're doing the right thing.

No, the correct response to litigation is to countersue for defamation and fight.

Our Lectric 2.0 bikes had lousy brake feel, but simply removing the cables and generously lubing them made a major difference. I have no experience with hydraulics on a bicycle. If they are smoother and completely trouble-free, then that's great. But if, for instance, they are temperamental or in constant need of tweaking, then I'd stick with the cable version.

 

[smorgasbord]

I have no experience with hydraulics on a bicycle. If they are smoother and completely trouble-free, then that's great. But if, for instance, they are temperamental or in constant need of tweaking, then I'd stick with the cable version.

Hydraulic brakes are better all around. Less tweaking, better performance.

 

[None]

Man files lawsuit against Rad Power Bikes over front wheel disengaging

Man files lawsuit against Rad Power Bikes over front wheel disengaging

SEATTLE (BRAIN) — A Maryland man filed a class-action lawsuit against Rad Power Bikes on behalf of himself and other consumers for manufacturing a faulty fork and quick-release skewer design that combined with the weight of the bike can allow the wheel to disengage.According to the suit, Gary E...

bicycleretailer.com

 

[Gordon71]

Man files lawsuit against Rad Power Bikes over front wheel disengaging

Man files lawsuit against Rad Power Bikes over front wheel disengaging

SEATTLE (BRAIN) — A Maryland man filed a class-action lawsuit against Rad Power Bikes on behalf of himself and other consumers for manufacturing a faulty fork and quick-release skewer design that combined with the weight of the bike can allow the wheel to disengage.According to the suit, Gary E...

bicycleretailer.com

Odd. Sounds to me like he yanked on the front brake to avoid a collision and flew over the handle bars. Not sure what that has to do with the front wheel coming off after the fact.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

There have been recurrent issues with disc brakes and QR skewers since disc brakes became popular and widespread. To me the very best solution is to use a thru axle instead of QR skewer.

The additional problem is that the vast majority of e-bikes (even a lot of high-end e-bikes) come with seriously inadequate brakes for the mass of the bike and likely mass of their riders. That isn't that big a problem if you ride in a flat place at lower speeds, but add big steep hills and screaming fast speeds (and possibly a QR skewer and an improperly designed front fork) you have a recipe for disaster. My observation is that this is true both with mechanical and hydraulic disc brakes.

A lot of the problem is that while it is clearly possible to design a safe assembly for a disc brake and QR skewer, the line between it being very safe and very dangerous is pretty narrow. And over time as they manufacture the bike they will have to change to "equivalent" components that might move that line in an unexpected way. So again I recommend thru axles.

 

[Tars Tarkas]

There have been recurrent issues with disc brakes and QR skewers since disc brakes became popular and widespread. To me the very best solution is to use a thru axle instead of QR skewer.

The additional problem is that the vast majority of e-bikes (even a lot of high-end e-bikes) come with seriously inadequate brakes for the mass of the bike and likely mass of their riders. That isn't that big a problem if you ride in a flat place at lower speeds, but add big steep hills and screaming fast speeds (and possibly a QR skewer and an improperly designed front fork) you have a recipe for disaster. My observation is that this is true both with mechanical and hydraulic disc brakes.

A lot of the problem is that while it is clearly possible to design a safe assembly for a disc brake and QR skewer, the line between it being very safe and very dangerous is pretty narrow. And over time as they manufacture the bike they will have to change to "equivalent" components that might move that line in an unexpected way. So again I recommend thru axles.

Yeah, well, I can't really argue against all that. You might be right but my experience doesn't back it up. Anyway, suing Rad about this seems a whole lot like suing McDonald's after you get burned when you spill their coffee in your lap. (I think McDonald's lost that one, didn't they?) Go after the deep pockets and hope they settle!

I've had QR dropouts since the early 70's and never had any trouble. Do I know what I'm doing or have I just been lucky? Or maybe unlucky? A million dollar settlement might have been nice at some point.

TT

 

[Gordon71]

Yeah, well, I can't really argue against all that. You might be right but my experience doesn't back it up. Anyway, suing Rad about this seems a whole lot like suing McDonald's after you get burned when you spill their coffee in your lap. (I think McDonald's lost that one, didn't they?) Go after the deep pockets and hope they settle!

I've had QR dropouts since the early 70's and never had any trouble. Do I know what I'm doing or have I just been lucky? Or maybe unlucky? A million dollar settlement might have been nice at some point.

TT

What I've learned from owning my Rad Rover is that to remove the front wheel I have to completely unscrew it, remove the axle, and then smack the tire a few times with a rubber mallet before it drops off.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

I've had QR dropouts since the early 70's and never had any trouble. Do I know what I'm doing or have I just been lucky? Or maybe unlucky? A million dollar settlement might have been nice at some point.

Yes, QR skewers have been around for over a century. But disc brakes are pretty recent. And there is a long and well-documented history of their being quality and safety problems with the combination of QR skewers and disc brakes.

This is an enthusiast forum. As such, we need to recognize that our individual expertise is far greater than the average Joe out there who buys an e-bike. Although at the same time I find it humorous that even in this enthusiast forum so many people can't even fix a flat tire -- often the same people who complain that others can't use a QR skewer properly.

I'm just saying that it might be a tad unreasonable to expect that a person with scant knowledge of bicycles is going to understand the ins and outs of how a QR skewer and disc brake (and particularly front disc brakes) might interact in catastrophic ways.

Oh, and this is not a new problem. At all.

Our Angle on the Trek Quick-Release Recall

A recall in April, 2015 affected nearly 1,000,000 Trek bicycles.A quick-release lever could open too far, and get caught in the disk-brake rotor, resulting a crash. This article examines that issue and related ones, and tries to draw some lessons.

www.sheldonbrown.com

 

[Mr. Coffee]

Anyway, suing Rad about this seems a whole lot like suing McDonald's after you get burned when you spill their coffee in your lap. (I think McDonald's lost that one, didn't they?)

Actually, the story is a bit more complicated.

Liebeck v. McDonald's Restaurants - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[None]

I suspect with popularity of ebikes, many new riders not familiar with quick release wheel operation,
combined with higher speeds of ebikes, heavier in comparison vs regular bicycles;
mishaps likely occur without rider knowledge, lead to lawsuits.

 

[m@Robertson]

The issue with QR skewers is not one most people understand. Here check this article out from 2015 on the original, actual problem. With pictures. Scroll to the bottom to see the one that matters.

Huffy recalling bikes because of possible QR/brake rotor problem

WASHINGTON (BRAIN) — Huffy is recalling about 460 bikes because the front quick release skewer, when open, can come in contact with the front disc brake rotor, causing an accident.The recall appears similar to a much larger one conducted by Trek Bicycle this year. Trek recalled nearly 1 million...

www.bicycleretailer.com

The issue is with a QR skewer that has been left completely loose. Even with an inexperienced rider, thats gross negligence to ride a bike like that. AND a QR will not help the matter. I've seen those same type of inexperienced riders have wheels fall off when they were bolted on... the bolts had come loose and there was so little care taken the bike was being operated with them loose.

On the other hand, if Rad is using cheap Far Eastern components that ignore the solution to this known problem, then for sure they are liable. One more example of using cheap parts from a segment of the industry (i.e. Chinese manufacturing that is not subject to liability lawsuits) that cares most about low costs and has no accountability to its customers.

Actually, the story is a bit more complicated.

It sure is. That case gets a superficial assessment as an example of people looking for a payday, but (and this part is just my opinion) McDonalds was doing something extremely dangerous and they deserved a much bigger penalty than they got.

The heat of the coffee they served was so high it would take skin off the tongue and mouth (via severe burns) if drank on the spot. McDonalds had done studies saying most people drank the coffee when they got back home, so they superheated it so it would still be hot by then; failing to allow for what would happen to someone who tried drinking it in the car.

I believe it was Snopes who, in their article on the subject, noted the seemingly huge dollar penalty was less than one day's profits on McD's coffee sales alone.

 

[Taylor57]

I had a quick release come loose a couple of years ago and it was my fault. I re-assembled the front wheel on my Espin Sport and either left both springs on one side or tightened the QR the wrong way. Anyway, I was hauling ass down the Tramway road in PS doing close to 45 and I noticed a serious shake wobble on my front wheel. I braked quickly and pulled over. The quick release had come loose but did not fall out. Scared the hell out of me. I then brushed up on proper QR installation technique and even did a refresher course when I saw this thread recently.

 

[Mr. Coffee]

It sure is. That case gets a superficial assessment as an example of people looking for a payday, but (and this part is just my opinion) McDonalds was doing something extremely dangerous and they deserved a much bigger penalty than they got.

The thing that always gets me about that case was the lady with a burnt crotch asked for $20,000 to settle the case. You can barely get any case into court for that much money. So I’ll never understand why McDonald’s didn’t just quietly settle that case and move on.

 

[PedalUma]

All models of Onewheel electric skateboards are being recalled after the maker Future Motion received reports of four deaths of users between 2019 and 2021 and multiple reports of serious injuries.

A bike company that I worked for sold these. One look and you just know it is a deathtrap. Leading up to Christmas of 2019 I could sell one per hour online from stock in 13 retail stores. The thing is what I was selling was often already in the hands of a retail customer standing in line waiting to check out. When they got to the counter they would need to be told that the one they are holding was already purchased and that they can't have it. People were going ape-shite over something that could clearly kill their kids. I wonder how many people will refuse the recall. They sold for $1,000.

 

[m@Robertson]

Most OneWheels can be fixed via an OTA firmware update so its not a recall as we old-timers understand it.

For the oldest models that are not connected to an app, all they are doing is giving a $100 credit towards buying a new one so I doubt thats going to fly very far.

Future Motion // Recall Notices

recall.onewheel.com

 

[PedalUma]

The software update makes what is called a haptic buzz. The motor shudders at limits and high loads. It dose not help with the inherent instability, or the types of people who are attracted to these things.

 

[Tars Tarkas]

So McDonalds can't sell a hot cup of coffee, but OneWheels can sell these things to idiots?

Pogo said it well. "We have met the enemy and he is us."

TT

 

[PedalUma]

Lots of clavicles, tailbones, and split melons. I read that it is mostly because of the wheelbase geo. Some sell for $2000 before add-ons like a fender so it does not suck in your pants' leg. So, no Mc hot coffee for us!

 

[Stefan Mikes]

so they superheated it so it would still be hot by then

You cannot superheat coffee at the atmospheric pressure. It is 100 C at 1 atm max.