Do you happen to have the default street legal/trail/ludi settings. I can’t find them anywhere. Thanks.
Luna X2 - First Impressions
- Thread starter rtp
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IOUZIP
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I do not have the exact stock settings. I have also changed my settings.
Open a support ticket with Luna or Message Marcos:
Thanks. I see people referencing them somewhere but I am not sure where they are finding them. Will open a ticket. Thanks for all the info you post.
perseverantone2.0
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I agree. With the research I've done I was planning to do the exact same thing. Tuning it down, I plan to upgrade hubs(trying to decide between an 11speed Cassette running XD driver or Shimano 11speed setup running micro spline. But By my research, it seems sticking with the GX drivetrain or Shimano XT Deore 8100 10speed or 11speed cassette is most robust for high-powered e-bikes, Many ULTRA 620 motors run 9speed Shimano Alivio setup(i.E Bakcou) combined with the connex Chain, just seems better for the power put out by V2. But I think it would be easier to just put a 12speed GX cassette and run it on XD driven DTswiss 350 Hub with straight spoke, 6bolt hubs, or I've considered the Hope PRO4 hubs(slightly cheaper) and tires I'm undecided on 2.8 or 3.0, rotors, 160mm Crank arms(Can't find any that fit m600 yet.) Pedals(one-up or Stamp7 large), Changing Yari to Lyric quality front shock, when due for service. On my current bike, I do about 200miles every 10 days. Plan to put in a lot more on my X2 Ludi. I just don't want to waste money on things unnecessarily. I put the money aside for $2k in upgrades, but I will for sure take your advice and take my time.
What do you think about going down to a 10speed or 11speed cassette? will the bike still run the same? Did you decide to stick with the 12speed or did you go down to =< 11 speed? Thanks again for all the help. Man, you really have been a lifesaver in educating me through your posts.
perseverantone2.0
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Ahh OK so it is really grainy it reminds me of a windows 98se display. I wonder if any other newer display with better color and contrast will work with the X2Ludicrous because these colors are very hard for me to see. I have issues with the colors of blues grays and blacks. I had hoped the display would be more like its successor the P860C which has real high contrast and graphics.
perseverantone2.0
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I ordered the same style for my X2 Ludicrous V2, Hope it performs as well as the ATV throttles did.
perseverantone2.0
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Curious what do you like more the XT 8100 Deore or the SRAM GX Eagle Setup? I've considered going down to the XT 11speed setup with micro spline or sticking with XD driver and SRAM GX groupset, both considering going down to 11speed. I figured if I stick with 12speed it keeps it simpler. But I know I won't use more than 11 gears anyway.
perseverantone2.0
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I don't know if I should open a new thread or not, but I am having trouble deciding between staying with SRAM & upgrading to GX drivetrain, running XD driver on a 12speed setup, or going down to 11Speed Cassette, I don't even use the largest Gear on the current M600 I ride with stock bafang Software(FLX F5 Trail) I know as I go down in Gears, the robustness of the drivetrain increases. Plus Connex Stops making chains at 11 speed, & I love their chains, super durable. Another option is switching over to the Microspline Drive and running the XT Deore 8100, which is the Shimano equivalent of the SRAM GX setup. The hardest part for me is picking my brand of Hub, I know exactly what type of HUB, but I'd like Hubs that have style plus performance. So I figure I will ride stock for as long as I can. I wonder if downsizing the cassette to an 11speed would mess with anything else on the bike? Again not a mechanical engineer, but luckily my Old man is. Didn't become a big mountain biker till last May when the FLX F5 Trail arrived. It's nice, but kind of heavy, with a clunky drivetrain because it's not using a legit Shimano 10speed cassette(a Chinese knock-off compatible with Shimano 6100 Deore drivetrain.) That bike only has a 10speed and I rarely go past 7th the gear w/ the stock m600 bafang build. I keep researching & reading, but I guess I won't really know till I put a couple of 100+miles on my X2 ludi which should arrive by 8/15 or sooner. If anyone is running XD or Microspline with 11 gears or less love to hear if you like it or not
Yeah, first set was basically to move to known near-bulletproof hubs (DT350) and wanted to give the i40 rim width a try. The X2 wheelset seems decent if heavy overall, with a few people eventually wearing out the rear hubs. Have done some fairly unique long motorcycle trips over time, including 'dirt bike and a map' for a week in a foreign country, longer trips etc., plus have spent some time on tracks with my cars, so I'm all about 'ensured reliability' as much as possible. The Arc i40 wheelset was fine, just felt like building a wheelset and tried the i35s. Pretty much a toss-up but might pick the i40s again in the future.
You can send me a DM if you'd like. Might be up for selling the Arc i40/DT set.
I wouldn't consider the X2 a motorcycle replacement - the Z1 would be closer to that, although still not as both are speed limited realistically to ~30mph(x2)-~35mph(z1), while the Z1's much bigger Ultra motor does better with sustained heat/thermal loads so is more tolerant of riding by throttle. The X2 is great, as an 'assisted mountain bike' - but not a mc replacement.
Not sure on the Q in there last line - I have kept my Ludi controller firmware up to date. The speed sensor works fine, meaning it's reading and displaying MPH. If you meant cadence sensor, the LudiV2 primarily or possibly even solely is using the torque sensor for assistance algorithms. I know there was some discussion on 'blending' the cadence sensor as another input, but don't think that's the case on current firmware.
Depends - I've had a similar display on my BBHSD fat tire bike, and they're neat but I don't like the placement as it's problematic if you need to flip the bike upside down for maintenance, and in reality it's just not really needed. The OE display meanwhile is nicely tucked out of the way. I wouldn't mind one slightly larger, like a CAN version of the 500C. Meanwhile, some others love the 860c, so YMMV. I just don't spend a lot of time looking at it at all.
Yep, 160mm, from Miranda direct, who shipped amazingly quickly to the US. https://mirandabikestore.com/shop/ebike/cranksets?motor=693
Unsure if they can be bought elsewhere other than their web shop right now.
IOUZIP
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The SRAM 12 speed the X2 comes with is good to start with. I did lock out the lowest gear as it was too low for me to really use. I just adjusted the low limit screw. 11-13-15-17-19-22-25-28-32-36-42-50
To keep from breaking chains I lowered the Current Max setting. This will also reduce battery draw. I am using the Tune => Trail setting. If you have updated to the last firmware from Luna you are good. I believe if you reflash the firmware it resets the setting back to stock.
Hyperglide (HG) is pretty much the long-running Shimano standard. Originally you couldn't run a 12 speed cassette on it, and Shimano pushed Microspline if you wanted to do a Shimano 12s. Meanwhile, SRAM and others offer 12s setups for Shimano HG freehubs. HG freehubs can get some 'spline gouging,' as the cassette 'rocks' in the splines, mores with e-bike usage or hard mtb use, while both Microspline and XD are less susceptible to this type of wear. Having said that, you can get steel freehub bodies which remove this as an issue. You can swap that part only on DT Swiss hubs and some others, and the newer DT 'Hybrid' hubs can be had with steel splines in HG format.
For the most part, I don't see any real net benefit in moving away from HG for ebike use. There aren't many options for Microspline, and I don't really 'need' 12 speeds on an ebike. XD drivetrains aren't cheap either.
Linkglide, on the other hand, is Shimano trying to step up to build an ebike/heavy-duty use drivetrain. The cassette works on HG splines, with the drivetrain offered in either 10s or 11s, and is intended to be better/longer-lived for shifting under load, and overall higher durability. I've been pretty interested in this setup, but the parts have been pretty much unobtanium in the US. I nearly ordered a complete groupset from overseas, but then couldn't locate the LG chain, so put it on pause. Meanwhile, I went ahead with moving to SRAM MMX for combining/positioning controls - while Shimano has their own 'combined control mount' called i-Spec, I think only the Linkglide 11s supports it. So, replacing everything initially IF they're available I might consider LinkGlide, but as I'm using a MMX-compatible dropper remote, I'd now need to replace it with an i-Spec or separate clamp mount..so while I have been and remain interested in seeing how Linkglide develops, I'm not going to jump to it anytime 'soon' unless I find $$ burning a hole in my pocket.
Personally, I waffle all around on brakes. The M600 Ludi can (now) use a brake sensor for motor cutoff (this is what the 'e' versions of brakes add), and I wanted to add a brake cutoff initially, but now I'm not convinced. At this point I'm going to stick with the Guide R2s for a bit, but may later move to Code RSC.
The X2 isn't really a 'mash the throttle' or 'drive by throttle' motorcycle replacement. I don't use the throttle much so tough to say, but certainly easier on the larger rear sprockets vs smaller/higher gears.
There aren't any 'great' throttles, like a MC throttle, although there are a few 'mc-like' ones - no experience using them on eMTB though.
I did the same - I think my Trail profile is set to max of 35A, haven't 'needed' to raise it for actual usage.
Really depends on riding style, but also consider pad compound as well.
Yeah lol - I'm aware of the Magura colored inserts, but I'm not convinced I want Maguras at this point.
I would not spend high dollar on group sets as the ebikes will still chew them up. If considering going to Shimano and at all looking at consolidated controls (SRAM = MMX, Shimano = iSpec), do it now or next part replacement. The GX shifter is fine IMO..a number have also jumped to GX derailleurs, which I may give a shot mainly b/c of at least temporary 'SRAM lockin' at the moment.
If Linkglide were available when I got my X2, I probably would have immediately jumped to it then gone the iSpec route.
I did a few write-ups on wheelbuilding: https://myrandomthoughts.net/ebike-wheelbuilding/ including component selection. YMMV, but for ebike, I'd stick to DT Swiss or Onyx w/sprag clutch but YMMV.
Depends on riding. I think IOU said he adjusted the derailleur to even lock out the 50T rear sprocket. I agree it's not really needed for most trail type riding, but it could be if you do a lot of steep climbing, technical trails. etc. I was surprised to see LinkGlide is only 10S or 11S, but have long considered 8-9s. Chains are wider and generally stronger, and I've had few issues on my 9s fat tire bike...
perseverantone2.0
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I keep forgetting to ask but how do you like your phone mount? Does the Bluetooth reach the handlebars? I was thinking about ordering an Arm Band to hold the phone and attach it right behind the stem on the bike frame also looked at the Wildman EX center bag for a phone holder. I just got my Samsung S10 for use only with the X2Ludicrous, but the screen is much smaller than I thought, so I have to raise the VESC app display higher. I wanted to attach the new phone to the handlebars. Is that the one they recommend in the LUDI V2.pdf? If not can you send me the link or let me know where to find a quality phone mount like that? I wonder if I should send back the Samsung S10 and buy a bigger used phone? I should have bought the A20 by Samsung big screen, but it had a really poor hardware build for the year it was released. Thanks again. Sorry if I am asking too many questions, but I am super new to Customizing my Mountain Bike. Before the LUNA, I've always kept my bikes stock(TREK, Scott, & a Gary Fisher) But mostly I've ridden motorcycles all my life, so this customizing my bicycle is new. I just want to make sure I don't order the wrong thing. I did get the phone attachment Luna sells with the bike, but I don't know how good it is or if it will work right. Thanks for your help & posts.
perseverantone2.0
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I completely agree. Going down to 10 speed is as small as I'd go. The most powerful bikes run 7speed-10speed. My brother Bakcou Mule running Bafang Ultra 620 1800Watts max power I think it was. He is only running a 7-speed Shimano Alivio and he hasn't had a single issue. But it is a fat tire hardtail E-bike, that weighs 80lbs & meant more for backwoods trails, hunting, or road riding. Couldn't be ridden for downhill or Enduro. My Dads FLX is running a 10speed Deore 6100 groupset, The chain broke, but once we replaced it with a German Brand Chain called "Connex" & put an actual Shimano 10speed cassette, we eliminated all chain issues(noises, clunky shifting, etc.), it even shifts nice under load, super smooth offroad especially with Dynasis engaged on the derailleur. I will eventually graduate my riding to include downhill & where I live everything is steep climbs or steep downhills. I live on side of a valley with mountains on either side. Which is the only reason I considered keeping it 12speed, but I know if I want a true bulletproof Drivetrain I have to go down to 11-speed or 10-speed where the chains can handle the power. Because I want to ride every way possible on the road, mountain, trail, gravel, ENDURO, & downhill. My fear is breaking down 20miles away with no service, or backup parts to repair on trail. I will probably stick with the 11speed conversion. I will admit I like the Shimano Deore XT 8100 11speed GroupSet running micro spline driver. But now that I read about the LinkGlide I am reconsidering the micro-spline setup. That seems to be a hard drivetrain to pass on because great bang for your buck & super strong. But so is the SRAM GX 11speed groupset running XD driver. I haven't gotten my new Luna X2 Ludicrous yet, it's still in route with Fed-Ex(for some reason taking a long time to get here). I haven't ridden many bikes running SRAM, so I can only go by the research I've done. I will luckily be able to compare the LUNA SRAM setup to the Shimano drivetrain on my dad's FLX which I ride all the time. Hopefully, that will help me figure out which way to go. Do you like the Shimano better or are you an SRAM guy? I also plan to upgrade my Brakes eventually to Magura(I'm German & try to go German when I can.)
When you upgraded your Front/Rear Rotors how come you didn't go to 203mm? Is it because the SRAM guide caliper can only accept a max 200mm rotor? I was planning on sticking with the 6bolt rotor setup on the Hubs when I get them. Thanks again for all your help.
B4 your posts I never even thought about LinkGlide. I considered going with Shimano Micro Spline Driver. But I am researching the 11speed LinkGlide and they compare it to the HG just saying it's more Robust for ROUGH mountainous terrain. Makes me wonder if linkglide & micro spline can be run together? Can you even Buy a high-quality hub that is running Linkglide? Or does Linkglide run on HG+ driver? because I am having trouble finding a linkglide-specific driver. I am for sure loving the linkGlide setup as I research it now. What Driver does linkglide use HG? Or HG+? Can you get LinkGlide Hub with a 6bolt rotor still? I only see 1 hub offered by Shimano for linkglide system & it has Center Lock disk brake & wouldn't work with my boost setup anyway. For some reason I expected Linkglide to run a specific driver to Linkglide. But this kit https://bike.shimano.com/en-EU/product/component/deore-xt-m8130.html is basically the exact kit I wanted to run if I switched to SHIMANO, only I had planned to go with Micro Spline. Now I wonder if that's just a waste of money or not? LinkGlide is meant to be paired with the much weaker Shimano EP5000 I think I read.
Seems perfect. Now I want to find a Comparative SRAM drivetrain. Is running an HG driver a better way to go with E-bikes? When you built your wheels did you stick to the HG driver or did you buy Hub where you can swap out drivers? Thanks for reading my long post. You guys rock! I really appreciate the e-bike education you both have given me.
perseverantone2.0
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perseverantone2.0
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Thank you. Darn, I had hoped it would have better contrast. Funny enough LUNA said that Bafang won't likely be coming out with any other displays for the m600, but I have found several. So I am gonna take advantage of Amazon Prime and try one after another after another until I find a color display I can see that works. If this is running Canbus I know there is a new version of the 860C called P-860C. Really nice high contrast. Hopefully one will work. This one seems hard to see due to my color blindness issues(i see colors but not all of them well) Sadly Blues, blacks, & Grays are the colors I have trouble seeing especially when used in a combined color scheme.
perseverantone2.0
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I found an Unlocking system that unlocks CANBUS displays(WITHOUT THE BESST tool) & removes speed limit/governor. Just the other day.
I found an Unlocking system that unlocks CANBUS displays(WITHOUT THE BESST tool) & removes the speed limit/governor, & allows you to reprogram the M600. Just the other day.Changes and updates after ~3 months and a few hundred miles with the X2.
Would I buy it again?
Absolutely. There is still no bike for my purposes that ticks my boxes better, including the LudiV2 controller.
The Z1 with it's UART Ultra or Hydra w/Archon are the only other options I see at the moment. The Monte Capro is CANBUS and $$, and the Monte Lite is beautiful but Bafang programming. Maybe Luna or Innotrace will sell standalone controllers for M600 in the future, which would be great for existing owners and open up options.
Has anything broken?
Nope. I did have to do a controller swap early on, which may or may not have been needed - the Bluetooth range isn't as far as most of us would like, and the antenna position is kind of important if riding with the phone attached to the bars. It's possible a future firmware update may improve BT TX/transmit power. Odometer doesn't work with the LudiV2, but I know this is in process and likely part of the next firmware update.
What have you changed? Did you need to?
Most changes were from my personal preference, either to make the bike 'mine,' to make it fit better, etc. There really isn't anything I 'needed' to change - other than the atrocious stock seat. Good brand/model (WTB Volt) but way too narrow at 135mm.
I also like to tinker, but here's the list so far:
I'll be building a wheelset shortly, mostly for grins. Components are somewhat difficult to get at the moment, but will be building a set of 32H (good luck finding 36H > i30mm rims..) ARC35s, DT240S Hybrid J bend front, DT350 Hybrid rear, Alpine 3 rear spokes, probably DT Comp front, and put another set of Johnny Watts on them. The 240 front was down to parts availability - want the wheels to be semi-indestructible so going ahead with the Hybrid hub variants, which have larger bearings in them, but it was impossible to find a DT 350 Hybrid front hub...as it was, I did get a nice deal on the 240S Hybrid front, so no harm, no foul..
- Hope red floating rotors F/R, and will be moving to 200mm in rear shortly. Have a few different pad compounds to play with.
- SRAM 'deslackinators' to take up free-play in the SRAM G2 levers.
- Ergon SMC Core seat
- Front/Rear MuckyNuts fenders, mini - will be replacing with the longer versions soon - the minis work well to protect the chainstay/suspension pivot from crap, but still spray my back.
- Re-arranged controls and added a thumb-drive throttle @JRA found from someone in Poland. Much better than the OE one, although I had initially filed that one down to make it narrower/more usable with controls layout.
- Ergon GA3 grips - because they don't suck.
- Granite Stash tubeless repair kit in bar end
- Mirracycle bar end mirror on left
- Lamin-X and 3M clear film - battery cover and chainstay under chainstay protector mainly at this point
- 'Fire Lizard' chainstay protector
- Alston mtb pedals
- Miranda 16-mm crank arms, after also trying the Luna 150mm arms
- Replaced Alex MD35 wheelset with a set of ARC40/DT Swiss 350 hubs running Johnny Watt 27.5x2.8 - converted to tubeless. I like DT Swiss, and wanted a more 'dual-sport' on/off-road tire. Working well so far.
- Foam strips on top/inside of battery cover to remove any minor rattling
- Replaced KS 125mm dropper post with SDG Tells 170mm post. Nice dropper, and user-serviceable with parts. However, the RaceFace universal dropper lever is a huge POS with a single grub screw that lets the cable strip. Replacing the dropper lever/remote.
- Replaced the SX or NX shifter with a GX MMX shifter. Didn't 'need' to, but wanted to condense bar clamps etc. Works fine, not a huge difference in feel but more metal vs plastic, and a low $ part at ~$42.
- Added a Spurcycle compact bike bell - after jogger u-turned as I was passing on the left and did a stoppie that nearly became more.. yeah, need a bell.
- Added a front light which I like pretty well. Good mount, USB-C charging although a bit finicky on cables. Ironically they give a 'free' CR-2032 tail light that is actually awesome and wish was rechargeable - I just put it on slow pulse mode when I remember. Victogen off Amazon...just ignore the claimed Lumens.
- DVO Topaz Air T3 rear shock - was considering going coil, but wanted to see what a higher end air shock felt like first, so picked up used (210x55) along with a (non-offset) bushing kit and DU bushing tool from offsetbushings.com
- Only have 15-20 miles on it, but seems like a huge improvement over the RS Deluxe+ at this point, much more compliant at chatter/low-speed compression. Probably still needs some adjustment yet, but am liking it so far.
- Yari to Lyric Charger upgrade kit - damper and air spring.
- The Yari is decent overall. I do notice some fork flex, but all forks will have some flex to them. What I haven't yet been able to tune out entirely is low-speed chatter, much like the difference I noticed with the DVO Topaz rear vs the prior rear RS shock.
- Have not yet installed, but will bring the Yari up to Lyric Ultimate specs. Note on the air spring - this is a cheap ~$40 upgrade, and you can change your fork suspension travel distance by selecting a different length air spring. Stock is 160mm; I believe 140-180mm are available.
- Will see how things feel after this upgrade, and either stick with it or possible pick up a used DVO as backup plan.
View attachment 116123
It uses the same app but it does work with the m600, I found it on Alibaba Chinese site. This supposedly works with M600. Another option is to upgrade to EggRider V2 on Canbus bikes, & use this app w/bluetooth to upgrade and unlock the controller.
