Losing proposition dealing with Bosch

[topcatken]

I have two 2017, Trek XM 700 ebikes. I recently had a factory update done and now my bike is doing some quirky things such as the light comes on automatically when turning the battery on. My range dropped on both my batteries also. Since I purchased the first bike a year ago, I have tried to contact Bosch, ebike division, about issues.

I wrote to Bosch 3 times about a different issue. I never even got the courtesy of a reply. I used their own contact system so there is no email to document contact. I called corporate and they seemed sympathetic but urged me to write again. Nothing.

Then recently, I contacted them again, this time about this update. Nothing.

My ebikes are not entry level and have Bosch on the battery, motor and controller. My LBS is always as helpful as can be but they have limitations as to their knowledge and the service manager and Trek suggest contacting Bosch. I wish I could get out of my bikes into a different brand with a company that would be responsive to concerns and problems.

 

[Dionigi]

With the new Bosch firmware update the light remembers it’s status from the last time it was used.

 

[topcatken]

With the new Bosch firmware update the light remembers it’s status from the last time it was used.

Thanks. That answers one question. Now all I need to know is whether the update affected my range. I have a 500 and 400 pack and both seem to have dropped range since the update. I am willing to consider alternative possibilities, (like number of cycles) but given the timing, that is the best place to start. And the fact remains that Bosch should respond to customer inquiries sent in compliance with their customer service protocol.

 

[Dionigi]

Actually I noticed the same mileage decrease. I used to get 15 miles before dropping one bar now it’s 12 to 13 miles. I assumed Bosch just fine tuned their mileage algorythem.

 

[MadProphet]

I thought I had a problem with my Super Commuter and used Twitter and Facebook messenger to contact both Trek and Bosch and found both to be extremely responsive (within hours). Since the advent and increasing importance of social media, I've used the public route to corporate help a number of times.

In this case, it wasn't the Bosch but rather the carbon based operator that turned out to be the issue. I publicly apologized and thanked both companies for their help in determining the source of the problem.

Similar requests for help from the maker of the real problem, unfortunately, have as yet gone unanswered.

 

[Chris Nolte]

The new update is more accurate, but depending on the age of your bike and the last time you received an update the power might have been increased. Bosch is really not set up to support the end consumer in this way, but they have a dealer network throughout the country. If you have trouble with your dealer being able to provide reliable information you could look for an Expert Service Center on their dealer locator. These dealers receive additional training and should be well equipped to solve some of the more complex issues.

Unfortunately, not all dealers are going to be up to date with all of the little nuances, but they do have a support line available to them which they can call. This is only for dealers though.

 

[topcatken]

So just want to report that customer service at Bosch will not answer questions and has no interest in whether we repurchase their products. That is a company that has made too much money. I know it is a good product but I can switch to Shimano going forward. Chris, my LBS has done plenty including doing the software update. My bike is one year old and I followed Bosch protocol in seeking their help, via their site, their instructions. If they are not set up to help either do not set up the question form or reply and say you will not assist me. I have had ebikes longer than most. Worst case of customer service I have experienced in my several years of owning ebikes.

 

[DDBB]

From reading these forums it seems to be an industry wide problem, even with the big some big brands. If Pedego had the type of bike I wanted, I'd buy two of them as I've heard nothing but good things about their dealer service and the dealer I went to for a test ride was outstanding.

 

[JRA]

I thought Magura was going to do the Bosch service here in the US? I wonder what happened or if that is still the case.

 

[tomjasz]

Not unlike the scooter market. Vespa has long farted off NAmerica. But it’s all about poor sales. Two bits says Bosch sells more in a EU country, USA state sized, in a year than here. Until dealers begin to unite rather than back bite and fight for scraps, and we organize with them, it’ll continue to suck. Mountain bike groups are a good sample of how organizing improves the market.

 

[Chris Nolte]

As many of you know I’m a big fan of Bosch. Partly because the level of support they deliver. They invest heavily in training their dealers so they can support their customers. I think it makes sense to put their resources into what they have been, supporting the dealers that interact with their customers, the dealers are really the ones that can best support you.

It sounds like your getting mad at Bosch because your dealer and bike brand isn’t supporting you. That doesn’t really sound fair. Maybe I’m misreading the situation or I have a skewed perception, but this seems a bit odd.

Keep in mind that companies like Trek (the brand of your bike), have recently made a choice to go exclusively Bosch and pull their business from Shimano even after investing heavily in creating bikes with those systems.

I know they are working on more remote diagnostic and updating features with some of their newer systems, but I’m not sure how effective they can be at email support on your system. Certainly not as effective as a dealer can be when your system is connected to their diagnostic software.

I hope this is helpful in bringing another perspective to this situation.

 

[rich c]

I completely agree with Chris. This isn't a Bosch customer support issue. You didn't buy the bike from Bosch, they didn't directly install the update, you bought it from Trek and they did the update. The dealer is your contact. Can you imagine how big of staff Bosch would need to answer all the personal questions, on all the Bosch components, on all the bicycles, cars, and trucks sold around the world? That's why they have chosen to work with dealer networks. You can't order components from them directly either. If you had a Takata air bag issue on your Honda car, would you contact Takata? I'm also a huge Bosch fan.

 

[AlanDB]

My only complaint about Bosch so far is that they won't sell the Nyon in the US, not even through their dealer network.

 

[tomjasz]

Bosch allows untrained dealers to sell their products. They damn well ought to support the end customer. Then again they were bunk at supporting their household appliances 30 years ago. I didn’t expect better.

 

[Chris Nolte]

Bosch allows untrained dealers to sell their products. They damn well ought to support the end customer. Then again they were bunk at supporting their household appliances 30 years ago. I didn’t expect better.

This is not supposed to be the case. As a dealer you’re required to do the Bosch training before recieving bikes. Most quality brands ensure this rule is followed.

In the next 6 months Bosch will be offering training in 76 cities. Name another brand coming close to this level of outreach and training. If your dealer can’t get their tech to a training then I think that’s their shortcoming IMO.

 

[rich c]

Bosch allows untrained dealers to sell their products. They damn well ought to support the end customer. Then again they were bunk at supporting their household appliances 30 years ago. I didn’t expect better.

You've personally dealt with a dealer that has no employees that have gone through training? My LBS has a lead tech that has gone through training for Bosch, and they don't even sell them.

 

[tomjasz]

You've personally dealt with a dealer that has no employees that have gone through training?

yes.

 

[Over50]

...In the next 6 months Bosch will be offering training in 76 cities. Name another brand coming close to this level of outreach and training. If your dealer can’t get their tech to a training then I think that’s their shortcoming IMO...

The lead tech at my LBS just came back from updating his Bosch training. He returned eager to tell me about all the new stuff he saw. It is nice to see that my LBS was working on Bosch certifications and sending multiple techs to Bosch training.

 

[Chris Nolte]

@Over50 It’s a good way to go and a good indicator of how serious a retailer is.

Most people focused on DIY will usually look down upon Bosch, but the reality is it’s the most reliable and supported ebike system out there. It’s not a system designed for the end user to work on, not unlike most sophisticated tech these days.

That being said, there is little outside of updating the system and running diagnostics that can’t be done by anyone skilled in basic bike maintenance.

 

[LimboJim]

I've ridden substantial eMTB miles on Bosch, Shimano, Brose and Yamaha pedal assist bikes. I love that Shimano allows consumers to update (and customize) their system with the eTube Project, and wish that the others did too.

I think the Specialized Ground Control app lets users update and customize their Brose system, but my Bulls with Brose definitely does not. I've heard that some new Haibikes will have Bluetooth access; I wonder if Bosch updates will become consumer-accessible on them.

In the future, it seems inevitable that they will all need to be more end-user-friendly - it's annoying to have to bring the bike in for a simple software update, especially when certified techs are few and far between.