Indiegogo, Kickstarter, Crowd Funding???

[DrJay]

I understand that this is a means for companies to capitalize or fund their development of new products. But what exactly is the "contribution"? Is there a minimum contribution? Does one get anything for the contribution? As for the "perks" it appears to me that they are just opportunities to buy the bike, multiple bikes, or bikes plus accessories at price lower than the anticipated MSRP. So is there a relationship between the "contribution" and the "perks". I'm admittedly an older guy who is just used to buying things.

 

[Al P]

Contributions are really deposits for a product that is promised in the foreseeable future. For being an early project "backer", you are usually offered a discount, sometimes substantial. The discounts decrease as time goes on and there is a set number of backers allowed at each discount level. You are, in effect financing their product development, assembly and shipping costs. The risk is that some companies don't, or can't always follow through with their promise, so there is always some measure of risk to the backers. I have bought two items on Kickstarter and have had no complaints, other than the extended production time on the Shock Stop seat post I recently received. It took an extra year before they finally shipped the product, but they updated us every month with pictures and details. The end result was that the product is excellent. The wait time was due to design improvements. I have no problem with that. I liked it so much, I ordered a second one.

I'm not familiar with Indiegogo, but I'm sure it works similarly.

 

[DrJay]

Contributions are really deposits for a product that is promised in the foreseeable future. For being an early project "backer", you are usually offered a discount, sometimes substantial. The discounts decrease as time goes on and there is a set number of backers allowed at each discount level. You are, in effect financing their product development, assembly and shipping costs. The risk is that some companies don't, or can't always follow through with their promise, so there is always some measure of risk to the backers. I have bought two items on Kickstarter and have had no complaints, other than the extended production time on the Shock Stop seat post I recently received. It took an extra year before they finally shipped the product, but they updated us every month with pictures and details. The end result was that the product is excellent. The wait time was due to design improvements. I have no problem with that. I liked it so much, I ordered a second one.

I'm not familiar with Indiegogo, but I'm sure it works similarly.

Thank you for taking the time to explain. Much appreciated.

 

[GypsyTreker]

I was also confused at first. The explanation you just got was a good one. I was a contributor on the Rattan folder with recharging as a feature. When the offer to pay the "balance" in November came up I was confused as to what the actual finished product would be. There had been some confusion as too the final product. I mentioned my confusion and to their credit I had an instant refund waiting when I ended the email I was on. As far as I know none have been delivered. I might be wrong but I have seen no reviews or media push. If someone knows differently let me know.

Many of what I see as crowed funding are marketing and branding companies that need a way to finance (OPM) build orders from off shore manufactures with slight changes in order to offer a different product.

With Rad, Ecotric and a few other established marketing pros why finance the new guy on the block?

Rad was just given a $25 million injection for their operations. They are world wide with over 200 employees who are pretty much on top of the low to mid market on eBikes. They are not the small Wa garage start-up, not that that's a bad thing. I have a competing brand product but am very aware of Radpowers excellent rep.

My personal fear is that some of these "projects" won't launch as more and more branding companies enter the fray. Not only will a consumer lose receipt of his /her product but perhaps money too.

I may simply be to old to grasp the value of this form of purchasing but on something that is still "new to market" as eBikes are ( granted they are growing in numbers) I would be concerned about a company there to deliver the product and to back the boo boos, so to speak.

Inexpensive eBikes can fit a particular price point because new consumers are easy to confuse when it comes to specs. I just met a guy who bought an eBike for his wife in pretty pink for $1000. It looked like a Wall Mart $99 beach cruiser. It looked to have a 250w hub motor and a 24v 7 maybe 8ah battery ( It was too small to be much more). When he saw my 26 fattie ($779) and my wife's folder ($749) I could tell he knew he should have done more research. I didn't even want to tell him what we paid but he insisted.

So I guess what I'm saying it's probably a safer bet to go with an eBike brand with an existing track record, one where you can find reviews on and customer testimonials. Sorry for the long winded response I just hate to see someone go into a very fun New market place blindly, there really is no need to do so.

 

[DrJay]

I was also confused at first. The explanation you just got was a good one. I was a contributor on the Rattan folder with recharging as a feature. When the offer to pay the "balance" in November came up I was confused as to what the actual finished product would be. There had been some confusion as too the final product. I mentioned my confusion and to their credit I had an instant refund waiting when I ended the email I was on. As far as I know none have been delivered. I might be wrong but I have seen no reviews or media push. If someone knows differently let me know.

Many of what I see as crowed funding are marketing and branding companies that need a way to finance (OPM) build orders from off shore manufactures with slight changes in order to offer a different product.

With Rad, Ecotric and a few other established marketing pros why finance the new guy on the block?

Rad was just given a $25 million injection for their operations. They are world wide with over 200 employees who are pretty much on top of the low to mid market on eBikes. They are not the small Wa garage start-up, not that that's a bad thing. I have a competing brand product but am very aware of Radpowers excellent rep.

My personal fear is that some of these "projects" won't launch as more and more branding companies enter the fray. Not only will a consumer lose receipt of his /her product but perhaps money too.

I may simply be to old to grasp the value of this form of purchasing but on something that is still "new to market" as eBikes are ( granted they are growing in numbers) I would be concerned about a company there to deliver the product and to back the boo boos, so to speak.

Inexpensive eBikes can fit a particular price point because new consumers are easy to confuse when it comes to specs. I just met a guy who bought an eBike for his wife in pretty pink for $1000. It looked like a Wall Mart $99 beach cruiser. It looked to have a 250w hub motor and a 24v 7 maybe 8ah battery ( It was too small to be much more). When he saw my 26 fattie ($779) and my wife's folder ($749) I could tell he knew he should have done more research. I didn't even want to tell him what we paid but he insisted.

So I guess what I'm saying it's probably a safer bet to go with an eBike brand with an existing track record, one where you can find reviews on and customer testimonials. Sorry for the long winded response I just hate to see someone go into a very fun New market place blindly, there really is no need to do so.

Thanks for your explanation and viewpoint. I own 2 ebikes: A Raleigh Misceo IE Sport mid drive and a Qualisports Volador, both purchased at my LBS. I feel that it is one thing for a venture capital firm to invest in a new company as there is a contract with specific provisions. It is another to ask individuals to fund the project with the "promise" of a great deal. From my reading it seems that there is no guarantee of a product delivery or even a guarantee of a date certain for delivery. Rad Power Bikes $25 million cash infusion is going into expanding their retail outlets and the new Rad mobile delivery and service. This is very forward thinking. I know Court did a review of the Blix Packa while it was in the crowd funding stage but was already in production. I was initially surprised that he did that but I guess he had a long term relationship with Blix and trusted they would deliver. Personally, I tend to go with your perspective on this.

 

[harryS]

I don't know if the practice is still allowed, but some crowd funded sites allowed the campaign to keep the money if the minimum funding was not achieved in the time allowed. There would be a disclaimer next to the goal.

So there was this guy that offered a $199 ebike to the first few $199 backers only, the price went up for the rest. Anyone with brains would stay away but he would catch a few suckers and when the time expired, he disappears with a few hundred bucks, petty cash, but it's money lost, . I suppose he would have been crushed if he actually raised the money and had to actually deliver, because he apparently copied the text out of other kickstart ebikes and obviously had no plans. I only know about it because there would be posts in this subforum pushing that $199 ebike,

Still, even with legit and very successful campaigns, and I am thinking of Sondors and other now established vendors still using crowd funding, time is money for some of us. Who wants to wait six to nine months just to save a little money.

 

[Jaspy]

Buyer beware ! Sorry but I will Never fund indigogo or kickstarter ever again. There is no accountability or security from these places, just read the fine print. So if you have any issues your on your own, meaning good luck ! I have given up fighting with these guys and have just accepted my $100 loss. Lesson learned, buy from a lbs and smile , it’s not worth the hassle or risk. Of course there are always exceptions.