I paid $4700 for a 65lb paperweight.

M

MichelleJae

New Member
Region
USA
I’m at my wits end. Late April I purchased a Giant Explore thru Weblink and had it shipped to my local dealer that I’ve purchased bikes from before. I had that bike for about a week until the charger died and I could no longer charge it. They worked with warranty and were told the chargers were on backorder and that either I could wait or get a refund since it was within their return period. So, I took the refund and bought an “upgrade”, a Liv Thrive with the Pro motor.

I took delivery of that bike in mid May. The first issues I experienced were it shutting down repeatedly once the battery hit 20%. I could turn it back on and it would again shut down after 30 seconds. I scoured this forum and the Giant FB forum for ideas as to why. I thought at first the 20% was coincidental - maybe the battery was loose or whatever. I was near the end of my ride both times so I just took it home and put it on the charger. People with similar issues posted that bending the battery contacts, shimming or using dielectric grease resolved their issues, none of which I tried.

Anyhow, the last time this happened was mile 40 of a 65 mile charity ride over Memorial Day weekend. I was able to get it going a couple times, but again the bike would shut down after 30 seconds. Then the RideControl would display no lights and the Evo display would be blue, indicating no assist. 30 seconds, dead again. I pedaled that 60 lb beast the last 25 miles of hills with it powered off. Charging the battery to full overnight did not resolve the issue. It would shut down 30 seconds after turning it on with a full battery. As the owners of my LBS were on vacation, I dropped it off at another bike shop where my brother bought his ebike. They are a large dealership in Madison, WI. They tried a battery from another bike and had the same issue.

(To add - this bike has been ridden on rail-to-trail and bike paths. It’s never been in the rain and was stored indoors.)

5 weeks later - Giant has had them do a half dozen tests including checking all the wiring, attempting a firmware update using an EnergyPak (since they couldn’t keep the bike powered on), they sent a new battery with an updated BMS, and lastly a new Smart Gateway. None of these have fixed the issue. Last weekend Giant had them perform more tests and now the bike is totally dead. They told me to contact Giant thru Weblink, which I did with no response. (Calling them results in voice mail that’s full.) The dealership who is performing the repairs has all but given up it seems. (And another issue is it seems they only have an ebike tech who works on weekends.)

The owners at my LBS have been as helpful as possible, while admitting that they don’t have the technical expertise to work on the ebikes to the extent that the Madison, WI dealership has. (They’ve sold a few of them but I seem to be the only one who has had issues.)

I realize Giant has no representation in this group, or even on the FB group, and I’m pretty dang po’ed that I’ve paid $4700 for a literal Giant paperweight.

As of right now, I’m waiting for a response from my LBS, as again they are vacation. (It’s a married couple who run it, no other employees.) Last week they asked me to keep them informed as to what the other dealership finds out and they could engage their rep, which is the same rep as theirs.

Anyone had to deal with something like this before?

Michelle in Rockford, IL
 
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Quite the 1st post you brought here! This is your problem, more than a Giant problem. "The owners at my LBS have been as helpful as possible, while admitting that they don’t have the technical expertise to work on the ebikes"
 
It sounds to me like there's a misunderstanding on your part regarding what the bike is trying to tell you when it's indicating a 20% charge. At that point you have the equivalent of a dead battery. It's shutting itself down to protect itself. Generally batteries are charged at around 40% or maybe a little higher.

It's a shame that this dealer didn't know/tell you that.

Most owner's manuals will have this info detailed for you....
 
Bummer. From my experience with other brand ebikes, the only other suggestions I have would be to check:
1) possible faulty cable or loose connection. I had a bike that had an intermittant short, and then loss of power. Moving and twisting the wire harnesses in my case, while using the throttle, identified the problem (of course, not riding it, but in my garage). Replacing a cable did the trick
2) possible faulty controller. In my case it was after about 10,000 miles with my ebike, but in that case it was the controller that went bad. Maybe you have a factory defective one?

p.s. -
If there's any chance to return or exchange your "lemon" of a bike, if I were you, I'd really push on them to do that.
Good luck!
 
AHicks said:
It sounds to me like there's a misunderstanding on your part regarding what the bike is trying to tell you when it's indicating a 20% charge. At that point you have the equivalent of a dead battery. It's shutting itself down to protect itself. Generally batteries are charged at around 40% or maybe a little higher.

It's a shame that this dealer didn't know/tell you that.

Most owner's manuals will have this info detailed for you....
Click to expand...

That’s funny, because on the previous bike, I was able to ride that battery down quite a ways past 20%, which is what happened when I discovered that the battery charger had failed. (I had it on the charger overnight, assumed it was charged, then discovered it wasn’t)

In any case, it’s obvious that you didn’t read my post. The bike does not start up at all. After the 3rd incident, and after the battery was fully charged, it would no longer start up. A new battery didn’t fix the issue.

Don’t push the blame on me. It’s a failed bike. Not a person who failed to read the owner’s manual, which I did cover to cover. (And my brother and boyfriend both have e-bikes that they’ve ridden down below 20%, all the way to zero, and the bike still functioned.)
 
PSm said:
Bummer. From my experience with other brand ebikes, the only other suggestions I have would be to check:
1) possible faulty cable or loose connection. I had a bike that had an intermittant short, and then loss of power. Moving and twisting the wire harnesses in my case, while using the throttle, identified the problem (of course, not riding it, but in my garage). Replacing a cable did the trick
2) possible faulty controller. In my case it was after about 10,000 miles with my ebike, but in that case it was the controller that went bad. Maybe you have a factory defective one?

p.s. -
If there's any chance to return or exchange your "lemon" of a bike, if I were you, I'd really push on them to do that.
Good luck!
Click to expand...

I just got off the phone with my LBS, they called me as they just got back from vacation and today was their first day back with the store open and were swamped with repairs. They are calling their Weblink rep tomorrow and seeing what they can do. I’d really like to have it fixed - there really isn’t much to these - I have the “schematics” so I understand what the different parts are, and I’m no idiot to servicing electronic devices as that is the industry I work in. I’d love to just have it fixed and be on my merry way. After I ordered this one, there was no more to be found - showed out of stock everywhere.

When I first dropped it off, the first tech to look at it said he was able to get the lights on the RideControl to flicker when he jiggled the wiring to it. I’ve mentioned this to the service manager and he dismissed it. As now they are unable to get it turn on at all, he thinks it’s the main wiring harness - and if it were me, I’d grab a voltmeter and ohm it out to determine if there was a short in that harness.
 
rich c said:
Quite the 1st post you brought here! This is your problem, more than a Giant problem. "The owners at my LBS have been as helpful as possible, while admitting that they don’t have the technical expertise to work on the ebikes"
Click to expand...
First post but I spent a significant amount of time reading this forum and FB forums before posting. And, I didn’t drop it off to my LBS - as I said in my post, I took it to another dealership that’s more than just a husband and wife running a storefront. They have a fairly large service department.
 
PSm said:
Bummer. From my experience with other brand ebikes, the only other suggestions I have would be to check:
1) possible faulty cable or loose connection. I had a bike that had an intermittant short, and then loss of power. Moving and twisting the wire harnesses in my case, while using the throttle, identified the problem (of course, not riding it, but in my garage). Replacing a cable did the trick
2) possible faulty controller. In my case it was after about 10,000 miles with my ebike, but in that case it was the controller that went bad. Maybe you have a factory defective one?

p.s. -
If there's any chance to return or exchange your "lemon" of a bike, if I were you, I'd really push on them to do that.
Good luck!
Click to expand...
Regarding #2 - faulty controller. Just to verify, are you talking about the Smart Gateway or the RideControl at the handlebar? I ask because the shop it’s at has intermixed the terms “controller” and “smart gateway”, as the second part they replaced they said was the controller, but it wasn’t the RideControl at the handlebar. (When I asked them on a follow up call if it was the Smart Gateway, they said that’s what it was.)
 
MichelleJae said:
That’s funny, because on the previous bike, I was able to ride that battery down quite a ways past 20%, which is what happened when I discovered that the battery charger had failed. (I had it on the charger overnight, assumed it was charged, then discovered it wasn’t)

In any case, it’s obvious that you didn’t read my post. The bike does not start up at all. After the 3rd incident, and after the battery was fully charged, it would no longer start up. A new battery didn’t fix the issue.

Don’t push the blame on me. It’s a failed bike. Not a person who failed to read the owner’s manual, which I did cover to cover. (And my brother and boyfriend both have e-bikes that they’ve ridden down below 20%, all the way to zero, and the bike still functioned.)
Click to expand...
You're very right. This isn't rocket science. So you know how to use a volt meter? Would you care to do some troubleshooting?

Assuming you have a 48 v battery (I haven't a clue about your bike, and you don't say) generally there are 13 cells. You can divide your battery's voltage by 13 to get an idea of where you are at as far as charge. Cells reading below 3 volts are on death row. Cells reading 3.3v are needing a charge badly. I generally charge at around 3.5v to avoid over discharging. Fully charged you should be getting something close to 54v.

Then there is voltage "sag". When you place a large load on a mostly dead battery like this (say one reading 44v or less), there is very likely going to be a large drop in voltage. This drop may be enough to trip the controller's low voltage setting (LVS) or possibly the battery management system (BMS). If either are tripped, the bike looses all voltage. You can restore it by turning it back on. If you apply that same large load, it's going to go down again. If you cool it, you may be able to ride it a little further.

BTW, I don't care whose fault it is, I'm just trying to help you understand it....

FYI, bikes can be calibrated to read remaining voltage, or remaining capacity. The fact you know other who can ride below 20% indicated means nothing. Same could be said when you climb into a strange vehicle with the gas gauge reading "E". Do you have another 100 mile range, or is it running on fumes? You aren't going to know until you get to know the vehicle a little better...
 
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rich c said:
Quite the 1st post you brought here! This is your problem, more than a Giant problem. "The owners at my LBS have been as helpful as possible, while admitting that they don’t have the technical expertise to work on the ebikes"
Click to expand...
How is this more his problem than Giant's problem? Also, why would you mention YOUR experience with YOUR LBS? This is not about you, or your LBS. Does everything have to revolve around you?
 
Reality is that with these types of mysterious issues, unless you have the technicial expertise, you have to rely on a really good bike shop to do the in-person troubleshooting. And it may just take replacing parts one by one until it gets fixed. Wish there was a better answer, but that might be it.
 
MichelleJae said:
First post but I spent a significant amount of time reading this forum and FB forums before posting. And, I didn’t drop it off to my LBS - as I said in my post, I took it to another dealership that’s more than just a husband and wife running a storefront. They have a fairly large service department.
Click to expand...
Don't mind RichC, he poops on everyone's parade and seldom if ever offers any genuine help.
 
AHicks said:
It sounds to me like there's a misunderstanding on your part regarding what the bike is trying to tell you when it's indicating a 20% charge. At that point you have the equivalent of a dead battery. It's shutting itself down to protect itself. Generally batteries are charged at around 40% or maybe a little higher.

It's a shame that this dealer didn't know/tell you that.

Most owner's manuals will have this info detailed for you....
Click to expand...
The BMS itself will doing this to protect the battery, during my brief foray into Ebike bliss I have discovered a weak undersized controller can give you fits, the first thing I would have done is to check battery voltage, the next obvious thing is to suspect controller- you are apparently pushing this thing beyond its limits, another issue can be a battery not locking in to make good contact.I have had good luck on resolving problems with internet vendors( usually it was a sorry controller or bad contacts) Hope you get it fixed, we need all the E-riders we can muster.
 
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If it does the same thing with multiple different batteries and they checked all the wiring, why aren't they replacing the motor?
 
You want this thing to fail?( just kidding,I do know I have seen dissatisfied People find every little excuse to say a product is bad. unload this waste of Aluminum alloy and get on with your life.I bought a supposed off-road bike from Minnesota, it was so bad I paid over $900 for that thing(on sale they said) even after spending money on it to improve it was still a( brown emoticon- the company address apparently was fake) I practically gave it to a Kid who was going to ride a few blocks to work on it. Get rid of it and get on with your life, that is one lesson I learned in my latter years. Your time is valuable.
 
Is that the same Giant Explore listed on the Giant Bicycles US for $3450? If so it looks like a very nice bike but if it weighs 65# I can see why Giant won't list the weight. BTW why $4700?
 
kevinmccune said:
You want this thing to fail?( just kidding,I do know I have seen dissatisfied People find every little excuse to say a product is bad. unload this waste of Aluminum alloy and get on with your life.I bought a supposed off-road bike from Minnesota, it was so bad I paid over $900 for that thing(on sale they said) even after spending money on it to improve it was still a( brown emoticon- the company address apparently was fake) I practically gave it to a Kid who was going to ride a few blocks to work on it. Get rid of it and get on with your life, that is one lesson I learned in my latter years. Your time is valuable.
Click to expand...
Bit of a difference overpaying for a no name terd without doing your do diligence and buying a name brand bike that's "supposed" to have manufacturer support.
Giant is fully responsible here to get him a working bike.
Me personally I would open a credit card dispute and sit back and watch the fire that it lights under Giants ass.
 
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