Goodbye to WattWagons & Helios

[skelm-]

I ordered my Helios back in November 2020. I waited with the rest of you (some of you for much longer). On hearing the news that Pushkar has no way to deliver the Helios in a time-frame that was agreeable to me - I have asked for a refund. I have complete faith that @pushkar will refund for non-delivery but will track that here so the folks considering purchasing can see what happens if for some reason Pushkar can not deliver. I have asked for a refund over the phone, emailed Pushkar and also opened a case with Wattwagon (Ticket tracking ID: 2DP-XW7-xxxx). I will update this post as soon as Pushkar does the refund and let you all know. I am sorry to be doing this as I was really looking forward to the Helios

update July 29th - refunded 1/3
update Aug 13th - refunded all
Thanks @pushkar!

 

[Gionnirocket]

I ordered my Helios back in November 2020. I waited with the rest of you (some of you for much longer). On hearing the news that Pushkar has no way to deliver the Helios - I have asked for a refund. I have complete faith that @pushkar will refund for non-delivery but will track that here so the folks considering purchasing can see what happens if for some reason Pushkar can not deliver. I have asked for a refund over the phone, emailed Pushkar and also opened a case with Wattwagon (Ticket tracking ID: 2DP-XW7-MB56). I will update this post as soon as Pushkar does the refund and let you all know. I am sorry to be doing this as I was really looking forward to the Helios

If you were sorry... All you should have done was give him a reasonable amount of time to refund the money and then posted a single comment at that time.... I for one don't care to see the minute by minute details.

 

[TomD]

Did you actually talk to Pushkar or are you basing this on the FUD that Deacon Blues posted? The so called "news" he posed is simply not true. Yes, Helios is delayed (due to issues with the frame manufacturer) but "no way to deliver" is not an accurate depiction of the situation.

 

[skelm-]

If you were sorry... All you should have done was give him a reasonable amount of time to refund the money and then posted a single comment at that time.... I for one don't care to see the minute by minute details.

Sorry for not getting the Helios, not sorry for doing this post, has been a lack of transparency around this issue

Did you actually talk to Pushkar or are you basing this on the FUD that Deacon Blues posted? The so called "news" he posed is simply not true. Yes, Helios is delayed (due to issues with the frame manufacturer) but "no way to deliver" is not an accurate depiction of the situation.

Yes I talked with Pushkar as mentioned on the post

 

[TomD]

I talked to Pushkar today and "no way to deliver" is not accurate. He won't be able to deliver on time, if that's what you mean.

 

[Gionnirocket]

Sorry for not getting the Helios, not sorry for doing this post, has been a lack of transparency around this issue

Yes I talked with Pushkar as mentioned on the post

Thanks for the Ticket ID... I just sent them an email saying that I've changed my mind again and decided to wait and add options

 

[skelm-]

I talked to Pushkar today and "no way to deliver" is not accurate. He won't be able to deliver on time, if that's what you mean.

Perhaps "no way to deliver in a time-frame that was agreeable to me" would have been a kinder way to phrase it

 

[Cuz Vinny]

So you asked for a refund and had to make this post? Don’t see the point in it. If you want to cancel and get a refund I’m sure Pushkar will refund your money. Work it out with Pushkar directly, no need to make a useless post about it.

 

[m@Robertson]

Once again we see someone throwing a tantrum because supply chain expectations pre-2020 are no longer valid, and the 2020-forward reality of life either hasn't been understood by the customer, or s/he has an ulterior motive (needs the money for something else etc.).

Holding a knife to the seller's back as an opening move. Classy.

 

[opimax]

As a new Watt Wagon owner I understand the wait for Helios as I am riding an UC with titanium frame, I thought I would be on a Helios. I still want a Helios or 3 when available. I can and will wait , doesn’t mean others can or are willing to wait. Individual have different needs /wants, you must do what is best for you!

I believe I was just as frustrated with the situation as anyone else. After going to his shop and all the work I have seen done by Pushkar I will still wait. The difference for me is a new bike . Not everybody plans for multiple bikes in their “garage” as I and some other crazies around have. If you were waiting through all this time and didn’t like the current situation getting out makes sense In many ways. I believe WW will do the best they can and think it will be worth the wait. I don’t think this just supply chain but legal issues I am glad I am not dealing with.The only upgrade comes to mind is i was local to WW or even better the other way around

I havent seen anything else on the market currently I would get instead Helios. I bought a Trek Allant 7+ that I wont ride, Bosch motors/mid drives with chains are not for me . It was to tide me over till Helios was here. i bought the UC to replace the Trek not the Helios purchase..Currently with my brother if he likes I will give it to him and if not i will get him a UC.. and the Trek will be for sale. He is getting a Helios also.

That being said I am still rear DD kind of guy so keeping options open on the infamous N+1 need for ebikes. May need to adjust the formula to N+2

 

[onlineaddy]

…supply chain expectations pre-2020 are no longer valid, and the 2020-forward reality of life either hasn't been understood by the customer…

That is not what’s going on here. I don’t agree with how the OP is responding to the actual situation, but, as opimax said, everyone handles it differently. I can sympathize and understand the frustration; I share it, actually. But, I’ll be responding differently.

 

[m@Robertson]

That is not what’s going on here. I don’t agree with how the OP is responding to the actual situation, but, as opimax said, everyone handles it differently. I can sympathize and understand the frustration; I share it, actually. But, I’ll be responding differently.

If I've misunderstood something then fine, but asking for a return and immediately posting like this is the sort of tactic you use in open warfare where you are purposefully burning your bridges behind you. I've never seen any indication this seller deserves anything like this.

 

[Deacon Blues]

Did you actually talk to Pushkar or are you basing this on the FUD that Deacon Blues posted? The so called "news" he posed is simply not true. Yes, Helios is delayed (due to issues with the frame manufacturer) but "no way to deliver" is not an accurate depiction of the situation.

What does FUD mean?
Tom, let me make one thing clean....when I had a lengthy phone conversation with Pushkar (I contacted him on the 16th) there was NO mention of him having the frames built by another manufacturer.
We talked about a numbers of things and I could tell that the bad news about the frames had hit him pretty hard. From our conversation I figured the Helios, for all intents and purposes, was dead and at the time I think he did too.

I really wanted this bike and if the frames can be built in a reasonable timeframe I'll cancel my refund and wait. Pushkar said it could take awhile to get the refund (could be up to six months) so I don't mind waiting.

 

[Acme]

Skelm, i’m very sorry you are giving up on Watwagons, but completely understand. I ordered my Hydras in November as well and received them only yesterday. It was certainly a welcome relief that I will cherish for sometime and I wish I could share the happiness with others here. I know Pushkar has been under a great deal of stress for the last 3+ months getting jerked around by the frame manufacture which seems to me to be done with some intention or muscle flexing, as well as all the other regular COVID-19 component delays. His communication has lagged I’m sure because of it. I know in my business when I don’t have good news I would rather not give any.
I should note I ordered another bike from Pushkar a month ago. This particular bike is still in the design process but I know it ticks all the boxes for me. Why would I order a third bike when he hadn’t delivered my other two. I look all over the internet when I can’t sleep and Pushkar is building something that is just not available anywhere else and at an incredibly fair price. Riding my Hydra’s in the dark last night I was reassured they are in a class of their own. I can run away from any conventional euro spec ebike. I can take a break if my knee is bothering me and use the throttle. I can lift them into my van easier because they are more than 10 pounds lighter than my Frey.
For me I would say they were worth the 7 month wair. BTW my Frey was a 6 month wait and after riding it I quickly realized I wanted something lighter and better.

 

[Art Deco]

What does FUD mean?
Tom, let me make one thing clean....when I had a lengthy phone conversation with Pushkar (I contacted him on the 16th) there was NO mention of him having the frames built by another manufacturer.
We talked about a numbers of things and I could tell that the bad news about the frames had hit him pretty hard. From our conversation I figured the Helios, for all intents and purposes, was dead and at the time I think he did too.

I really wanted this bike and if the frames can be built in a reasonable timeframe I'll cancel my refund and wait. Pushkar said it could take awhile to get the refund (could be up to six months) so I don't mind waiting.

FUD = Fear, Uncertainty, and Doubt. A sales technique employed most famously by IBM, DEC, and other manufacturers of traditional mainframe and mini computers against PCs, but used for any complex product.

 

[tomjasz]

I for one don't care to see the minute by minute details.

Yes! Pointless. I dislike the users that air their dirty clothes out here.

I've never seen any indication this seller deserves anything like this.

Exactly!

 

[TomD]

If I've misunderstood something then fine, but asking for a return and immediately posting like this is the sort of tactic you use in open warfare where you are purposefully burning your bridges behind you. I've never seen any indication this seller deserves anything like this.

There is more going on here and I can appreciate that some people are upset. Some of it is deserved. I don't have a problem with anyone accurately depicting the situation.

 

[Cuz Vinny]

There is more going on here and I can appreciate that some people are upset. Some of it is deserved. I don't have a problem with anyone accurately depicting the situation.

Pushkar needs to have a reasonable amount of time to issue the refund. Asking for a refund and then immediately posting a thread like this is not good tactics IMO.

 

[Ebiker33]

I empathize with those that have ordered Ebikes in 2020 and still don't have them, you want/need them for summer riding, and if the money is just sitting there, the urge is to move on from this.
This would be doubly true if it's your very first Ebike, at least those that already own one can still ride.

But where at the end of June 2021 can your order a Ebike of this caliber and have it within 10 business days right now ?

 

[TomD]

Pushkar needs to have a reasonable amount of time to issue the refund. Asking for a refund and then immediately posting a thread like this is bullshit tactics IMO.

None of us were privy to the conversation between the OP and Pushkar so hard to say. Founders paid up front for significant discounts (to source parts) so need to wait for a refund if they are unwilling to wait for their bikes. Someone who isn't a founder may have an expectation of a more immediate refund due to the significant delay, I suppose it depends on the terms of their purchase.